uk on critical alert

[Rod Paradise]

From the IRA to Al Queda, eventhing they do or did was for political motivation and personal gain, regardless of what banner they claim to be fighting in the name of their god through.

Wrong Mikky - Religion was never used as a reason by the Irish Republicans - it was introduced as a divisive measure by the Government to divide the Land Leagues etc and divert them into fighting eachother.

[ariston]

Dont bring the IRA into this argument as you will show how little you know MikkyT. The IRA was completely different from these nutters and fought under completely different circumstances.  
You say its the governments fault (or the US governments fault). Please explain how Tony Blair or Dubya Bush caused British Muslims to blow up our tubes/buses or how they caused 20,000 + americans to be hit by 2 planes in the twin towers. Dont say I have ignorance fueled crusades on this, if you want a debate on terrorism lets have one. Explain why you dont think religion comes into the current troubles, religion has been used for centuries to control the masses- now its being used to kill innocent people by numpties who think they can be martyres.

[mikkyT]

throughout history it has been proven that most wars and conflicts have been driven by religion.

how mickyt can say this one isnt is bbeyond me.

yes i dont deny that its also politically motivated but to say religion isnt involved is in my opinion pure blindness or ignorance!

Not true, religion is used as an excuse. The real reason is land/oil/riches/power or a combination thereof. You're right, religion is involved, but its not the motiviation behind the act.

More often than not its the vechicle used as recruitment into extremist groups however. But no holy book be it the Bible, the Torah or the Quoran teaches that violence is right. In fact all three of them preach the opposite and to be peaceable amonsgt your fellow man regardless of his status or belief.

[mikkyT]

From the IRA to Al Queda, eventhing they do or did was for political motivation and personal gain, regardless of what banner they claim to be fighting in the name of their god through.

Wrong Mikky - Religion was never used as a reason by the Irish Republicans - it was introduced as a divisive measure by the Government to divide the Land Leagues etc and divert them into fighting eachother.

Thanks for proving my point Rod, I owe you a pint. My point is that its nothing to do with religion. And I know I'm right, so really everyone should stfu cos Im right lol.

[mikkyT]

religion has been used for centuries to control the masses- now its being used to kill innocent people by numpties who think they can be martyres.

Thanks for proving my point!

Religion has been USED.

[Jon MW]

From the IRA to Al Queda, eventhing they do or did was for political motivation and personal gain, regardless of what banner they claim to be fighting in the name of their god through.

Wrong Mikky - Religion was never used as a reason by the Irish Republicans - it was introduced as a divisive measure by the Government to divide the Land Leagues etc and divert them into fighting eachother.

Thanks for proving my point Rod, I owe you a pint. My point is that its nothing to do with religion. And I know I'm right, so really everyone should stfu cos Im right lol.

Wasn't Rod's point that the IRA never claimed religion as a motivation?

[ariston]

it has proved how wrong you are. You tarred the IRA and al queaida with the same brush when they are the exact opposite. What is happening now is all about religion. The young muslims believe by blowing themselves up and taking infedals with them they will be looked after in the afterlife.

[turny]

rid the world of religion and the world will be a better place imo

[mikkyT]

From the IRA to Al Queda, eventhing they do or did was for political motivation and personal gain, regardless of what banner they claim to be fighting in the name of their god through.

Wrong Mikky - Religion was never used as a reason by the Irish Republicans - it was introduced as a divisive measure by the Government to divide the Land Leagues etc and divert them into fighting eachother.

Thanks for proving my point Rod, I owe you a pint. My point is that its nothing to do with religion. And I know I'm right, so really everyone should stfu cos Im right lol.

Wasn't Rod's point that the IRA never claimed religion as a motivation?

I never said they had claimed byt the IRA, I said it was claimed and or used as an excuse or as a vehicle for recruitment - it doesn't matter who made the claim.

[mikkyT]

it has proved how wrong you are. You tarred the IRA and al queaida with the same brush when they are the exact opposite. What is happening now is all about religion. The young muslims believe by blowing themselves up and taking infedals with them they will be looked after in the afterlife.

Total shite. The young men believe themselves to be fighting a religious jihad after being brainwashed by some clever mastermind with a grudge against the west. That mastermind uses religion as a tool to recruit these young naeive men into his little gang for political purposes, training for his various suicide missions against political targets in the west.

Religion is being used, religion is not the cause nor is it the fault thereof. Stop looking for excuses where there are none to be found. The world would be a better place without politics (and without people, but I think thats too much of a utopia to look forward to)

[Jon MW]

it has proved how wrong you are. You tarred the IRA and al queaida with the same brush when they are the exact opposite. What is happening now is all about religion. The young muslims believe by blowing themselves up and taking infedals with them they will be looked after in the afterlife.

Total shite. The young men believe themselves to be fighting a religious jihad after being brainwashed by some clever mastermind with a grudge against the west. That mastermind uses religion as a tool to recruit these young naeive men into his little gang for political purposes, training for his various suicide missions against political targets in the west.

Religion is being used, religion is not the cause nor is it the fault thereof. Stop looking for excuses where there are none to be found. The world would be a better place without politics (and without people, but I think thats too much of a utopia to look forward to)

It may not be the leaders religion that is causing them to brainwash people, but it is the bombers religious beliefs that are being exploited which allow them to be brainwashed. Therefore it is still down to religion - without their religion they wouldn't be so easy to manipulate.

[ariston]

If the world would be a better place without people maybe you could make a start for us instead of spouting shit on a subject you clearly know little of.
We are all under threat because of the government obviously, its all Blairs fault (you numpty). I dont know how much you know about the troubles in Ireland but I can promise you they are nothing compared to the current troubles. The internal battles in Belfast/derry look like a childrens party compared to what Al Quaieda would do given half a chance. I dont support any government and am not religious in any way but I am glad the intelligence services are doing their best to catch these people and stop attacks. I have a 7 year old son and would like to think he can catch a bus without the risk of getting blown up.

[Jon MW]

And I don't think the IRA have ever claimed to be anything but political.

[TightEnd]

Gentlemen, whichever side of whichever argument you are on, please debate without flaming....we don't want to censor or delete and I recognise that religion is one of those subjects that is going to ignite passions

Even allowing for that, keep it civil please!

Thank you

[mikkyT]

If the world would be a better place without people maybe you could make a start for us instead of spouting shit on a subject you clearly know little of.
We are all under threat because of the government obviously, its all Blairs fault (you numpty). I dont know how much you know about the troubles in Ireland but I can promise you they are nothing compared to the current troubles. The internal battles in Belfast/derry look like a childrens party compared to what Al Quaieda would do given half a chance. I dont support any government and am not religious in any way but I am glad the intelligence services are doing their best to catch these people and stop attacks. I have a 7 year old son and would like to think he can catch a bus without the risk of getting blown up.

Who mentioned blair? I mentioned politics and oil. I didnt mention the names Duyba and Blair, I think that was you....