Cmon England!!!!

[bobby1]

yep, what a genius to leave Ronaldo to the 5th penalty. Best player in the team didn't get to take one.

wpggcheerio

put 5th behind 2 centre halves, one of whom was made to walk up twice?

Oh my, oh my

Yes, madness.

[mondatoo]

It couldn't have happened to a nicer guy, GTFO Ronaldo.

[AndrewT]

Surely it makes no difference if he's 1st or 5th.

In fact it's better if he's 5th as, presuming he's the best at penalties, he's more likely to score. If he goes earlier, then one of the lesser guys takes the 5th and, with the added pressure, more likely to miss.

[bobby1]

Surely it makes no difference if he's 1st or 5th.

In fact it's better if he's 5th as, presuming he's the best at penalties, he's more likely to score. If he goes earlier, then one of the lesser guys takes the 5th and, with the added pressure, more likely to miss.

but if it makes no difference then why not put him first, coz by putting him lower down the list you run the risk he doesn't take one.

That has to be a big difference doesn't it?

[Josedinho]

Gerrard and Drogba did it in CL finals and it worked out ok.

Wherever he goes they lose when Alves and Moutinho miss their penalties.

[AndrewT]

Surely it makes no difference if he's 1st or 5th.

In fact it's better if he's 5th as, presuming he's the best at penalties, he's more likely to score. If he goes earlier, then one of the lesser guys takes the 5th and, with the added pressure, more likely to miss.

but if it makes no difference then why not put him first, coz by putting him lower down the list you run the risk he doesn't take one.

That has to be a big difference doesn't it?

But if he scores earlier on, the other fella still misses and you still lose.

The question is, how does Ronaldo going earlier make the player at number 5 more likely to score?

[rfgqqabc]

Shambles. Ramos was class and Nani's pen was unreal. Where did that come from. Alves should have turned round and stopped, looked like he'd seen a basalisk!

[bobby1]

Surely it makes no difference if he's 1st or 5th.

In fact it's better if he's 5th as, presuming he's the best at penalties, he's more likely to score. If he goes earlier, then one of the lesser guys takes the 5th and, with the added pressure, more likely to miss.

but if it makes no difference then why not put him first, coz by putting him lower down the list you run the risk he doesn't take one.

That has to be a big difference doesn't it?

But if he scores earlier on, the other fella still misses and you still lose.

The question is, how does Ronaldo going earlier make the player at number 5 more likely to score?

but you are judging it on tonight's result  not the long term. Ronaldo taking a penalty in a shootout improves Portugals chances of winning it surely?

[rfgqqabc]

Your best 5 penalty takers should take the first 5, in virtually top to bottom order, you can perhaps mess about with the first 3, but you should never have Ronaldo 5th as any advantage gained when he takes last is nullified when he doesn't get to take a penalty. I don't know if they have to hand in an order but you could save him for the first essential penalty. Also, your best penalty takers score more and add pressure onto the opposition players

[AndrewT]

It's a best of ten shoot out.

If each penalty is an independent event then it makes no difference which order the players take their penalties, as the overall result would be the same.

The order only matters if the position affects whether a player will perform better or worse than if they took any other penalty.

If the better players going first will make the lesser players more successful later on then it's a no brainer to have Ronaldo 1st. Could this be the case? Make it more likely that the defender at 5 is trying to win the game rather than avoid going out, which eases the pressure a bit? Maybe.

However, I would maintain that a lesser player's chance of scoring is improved if they go early, at the time of, relative, lesser pressure. If Ronaldo will handle the pressure of 5th better than another player then that's where he should be.

[bobby1]

It's a best of ten shoot out.

If each penalty is an independent event then it makes no difference which order the players take their penalties, as the overall result would be the same.

The order only matters if the position affects whether a player will perform better or worse than if they took any other penalty.

If the better players going first will make the lesser players more successful later on then it's a no brainer to have Ronaldo 1st. Could this be the case? Make it more likely that the defender at 5 is trying to win the game rather than avoid going out, which eases the pressure a bit? Maybe.

However, I would maintain that a lesser player's chance of scoring is improved if they go early, at the time of, relative, lesser pressure. If Ronaldo will handle the pressure of 5th better than another player then that's where he should be.

but you can win the shootout before the lesser 5th pen taker has a chance to score but by putting your best man last you can already be beaten, as happened tonight.

[AndrewT]

The times when you win the shoot out before your crap number 5 gets a go are the times when you would still win if he went first - the order has made no difference.

[rfgqqabc]

The penalties are not independent events, theoutcome of the 4th clearly effects the 5th, as showed by tonight. Surely the chance of winning the penalty shootout before your worst players take one. I see what your saying but having your best player not take a penalty is clearly a disaster. If his goal expectation 0.8 and alves 0.6 we are clearly better off putting the best men forward to win the game

[aaron1867]

I can confirm that when I play on Football Manager I put my best penalty takers first.

And still lose.

It's all ifs and buts right now, but Ronaldo should have been the first penalty taker. I am not sure I believe in this 0.8 and 0.6 stuff though, every professional football player should be scoring a penalty 8 times out of 10.

Although, at least Portugal get a good international player like Ronaldo, a player who matches his club form. Unlike Rooney, absolute tosh for England, time after time. Is he really world class???

[mondatoo]

Ronaldo would've missed anyway, he's choked a few times in penalty shoutouts.