blonde poker forum

Interesting thread

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/61/mtt-community/sorel-allegedly-bottom-dealing-vs-john-racner-983244/

Interesting

Especially as within the next week Sorel Mizzi is coming "In the Well" on blonde, give or take a few days

Ha think that is going to be unlikely now tighty like fuck am i paying him if this is true, waiting to hear from Racener.

dont understand why racner would let him deal if he is a dodgy fk

Sick!!1

Too late Flushy itt.

could bring alot of hits to blonde tho

Probably be a good platform to get his full side of the Story. Rerun of Tightys interview with Ade lol.

Dont pay the guy, just tell him this is the only place hes gonna be able to give his side if he was scheduled to come anyway. As PaulyHo said, would be good to bring hits to the site

Was he really? Doesnt seem very wise, given all his cheating n that

Am I hearing this right, you going to pay him to do a well? Have you paid anyone else?

James had Mizzi agreed to do a well on here. We discussed it, and I informed the mods too, the merits/problems with this. I reckoned the upside of profile/hits and a really interesting well could outweigh the potential problems (it kicking off on thread, basically).


After all, we wouldn't be short of questions to ask.....


I still hope it happens, but that's down to other factors

No and no. I did not say we would pay him. Another poster mentioned this above

Phew, thought the world had gone made when 99.99% of known players would do it for free

Maybe if this is the reaction, we've had a close escape lol.

Next. Mark Teltscher, Luke Schwarz and Andrew Feldman

Never did a more deserving player get fucked over in monte Carlo

what happend in monte carlo??

Quite comedy that this comes out about 2 days after his 'lifetime' ban is reversed on Full Tilt

wow.

Mizzi was cheated out of around 6 figures in a game of Chinese, iirc

Wheat i meant was Sorel was going to do a well for blonde it was something he agreed to when we played Chinese, i ended up losing $88k to him but have only paid $18k of that so far. I am not in the mood to pay the 70 or even talk to the guy, as such i doubt he is now going to do a well.

Lets just await developments and see what happens, waiting for Deeb to get me in contact with Racener.

Dunno if i should be happy or pissed?

Guess you should be happy Deeb outed him and you don't have to pay the $70k imo, dont give him a penny unless Deeb says he made the whole story up himself.

You have to admit, Mizzi in the well would be hilarious to rail

 ;popcorn;

So basically flushy has won 70k?

No, Flushy has been grimed for 18k :(

Best excuse possible for flushy to grim regardless imo ;D

Did you play with a joker Flushy?

it reminds me of the time I caught my mate with 8 letters in his rack at scrabble :)

No, but Sorel did.

We played with 2, sigh

Away from poker is Sorel a friendly likeable person? 

Just seems strange how a convicted cheater still finds people to socialise or play poker with on the circuit.

Demps I said at the time you shouldn't have played with someone as him. He wouldn't think twice about putting one up on his gran.

Make sure he pays you that 18k or the price of coming back to england is 18k.

LOL - they're sat next to each other in tonight's FTOP.

Lolol that's pretty sick

Opened up full tilt to see the table close :(

but I discovered I had $84 there... so all is good

Deeb is a better internet policeman than Greeky. FACT.

suprised u played with him demps, thought his rep was terrible.

Wrong vinny - if demps had told me I'd of told him not to play that scum cheat

A big long post on the 2+2 thread (since deleted) from someone who said they used to work in FTP's security team said that Sorel was banned for multi-accounting, but has been playing loads on FTP since under many accounts, using ever more sophisticated methods to disguise it (including one big tourney where there were numerous new accounts all playing from the same IP address which were strongly suspected to be him). Think he said Sorel had shipped an FTOPS event under another alias, and that he strongly suspected him of multi-accounting on Stars as well.

Wish I hadn't refreshed that page...

Flushy, do you have a 2p2 account? If so, perhaps you can come and post your experience in the thread?

All this net police bs to one side, how the fk do you seem to always know about this kind of stuff?

YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fB9ShKka_v4
.

Lolol I know everything woodsey!

Why do u think I've never been grimmed?

and "fun" to moderate

That was me. I decided to wait before posting to see the direction of the thread first. I don't really wanna risk losing my FTP account as a result unless I really need to.

Wow Flushy, awesome run good.

Paiiiiiiii the man his money flushy!! Inocent until proven guilty i say!!

If flushy pays him a single cent more, I'll run naked around DTD for a whole hour!!!!!!!!

paiiiiiiiiii the man a cent flushy

looool so fucking funny. HERO

if sorel didnt cheat here then he's 100% getting grimmed for the tabs imo

just goes to show the price of a bad rep. wouldn't happen to bambos or ben roberts ;)

or just link everyone here, flushy is shareholder in this site and has done 18k in cold blood, at least let his site have the extra traffic for a weekend

too much smoke without fire here for flushy to ever pay, racener and deeb come on to report a known cheater cheating! pretty sure racener not struggling to pay 20 dimes

flushy give him a cent and if this happens when i am there i will give you £10

Racener hasn't posted anything yet

agreed. If only deeb had outed this 2 weeks earlier he coulda bought a DBS.

Ridic that you played this clown... now go spend that $70k on upgrading to a dbs!

pez itt.

Already been linked

willing to stake demps for this, i would just say 1c, but i reckon your worth $15 maria, at the most obv. X

He doesn't, he just waits until something big is revealed and says something like "Yeah I know, I didn't say anything because John Juanda swore me to secrecy in a $25/$50 Cap PLO game"

Don't b hatin baz cos its your job to know and I still know before you

greeky does seem to get the scoop very early on

Lol.  

You couldn't run for an hour, you'd have a heart attack in the first 10 minutes. (If you did it naked, I'd have a heart attack in the first 5 minutes)

So both Mizzi and Racener haven't posted yet and Racener  can't be arsed posting anything himself/setting up a 2+2 account himself but just asked SD to do it.

Sure all sounds convincing to me.

yeah, but the facts are Deeb how no motivation to lie, seemingly no financial or personal benefit to him, racener does have motivation to lie to knock sorel for 20k, but apparently they were gambling or week and bigger sums passed hands, plus although we all have no idea it seems very unlikely that racener would be struggling for 20k lol the whole story stands up because there is no reason really for it not to be true....

Sorel on the other hand has plenty of motivation to cheat, has demonstrated in the past that it is well within his moral core and there is very little chance of Racener not lying and it being a misunderstanding on his part....

He just literally couldnt be more guilty in light of the info we currently have imo

Needs to learn to deal seconds....

would still prefer to see Racener posting something in that thread the whole "I'm sorry, I'm too busy to explain something but not too busy to ask someone else to post something about me" situation is a bit meh..to say the least. Not saying the accusation isn't true but just saying it's a bit odd.

I'm interested to know if Sorel was dealing one-handed at all during the long session.

This is a serious question.

Not enough evidence to confirm however if u owed him for playing the same game not another penny would be shipped until the matter was prooved one way or the other.... Also I would think back to the game and try and recall if things didn't seem right. If he was cheating then he would be dangling from somewhere until the 18K fell out.....

What do you mean 1 handed?

Just dealing with the deck in one hand and shooting the cards out with his thumb and not using the other hand at all.

obv he was dealing one handed he was using the other to masturbate furiously

$15 ??  ;cupcake; ;bumwiggle;

I offered £10 chilli that at least $16

This whole coup surely indicates that Flushy's run good at the wsop 2010 was a complete fluke.
How could anyone with an IQ over 3.5 play heads up in a hotel room with the 2nd most well know cheat
in poker and expect to not do your conkers. That Racener comes across as a doughnut as well.
The only way for flushy to redeem himself is to donate a good chunk of the $70k to charity or add some cash
to a prize pool in the £50 with a £50 at the Brighton rendezvous casino.

or back me in my business venture to create a zoo with only stuffed animals in it.....
Keys has already missed the opportunity but not too late flushy if you wanna get involved!

Sorrel Mizzi response from two plus two:


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'll be the first to admit that I have made a ton of mistakes and have several regrets in both my life and profession but cheating in Chinese poker isn't one of them. The allegations in this thread are so absurd, far-fetched and severe that the magnitude of the lies almost make me at a complete loss of words. What makes me even more speechless is how many of you jump to conclusions in a situation where it's one persons word vs my own. I guess I shouldn't be too surprised when it comes to Me vs anyone else in the community its the other person who gets the immediate credit for telling the truth and people who play against me or I do biz with obv know this. This is the primary reason why people take shots at me. Because I took over for someone in the middle of a tournament over 3 years ago no one in the general poker community will believe anything I say and it sucks because no matter what I do, for as long as I'm in this industry, I will always have that stigma attached to my name. I try to seperate myself from most poker players and not get too close to them because (and this may sound really weird to you guys coming from me) I think most of them are douchey and scummy. Maybe its time for me to consider a new career because respect from peers in industry is very important and I clearly have very little.

I have been cheated and stiffed several times since the FTP incident, the people involved knew full well that by doing so not only would there likely be no negative reprucutions but they'd possibly get praised for doing it to someone who has "stole" so much from the community. Just to mention one example, someone i was staking left me while in makeup 2 weeks after the FTP incident ... what can I do? Post right after the ftp thing unravels saying I just got ****ed over? How do you think that would turn out? Imagine me coming onto 2+2 saying someone had lost a bet and didn't pay me or cheated me out of money. The thread would be full of people saying things such as "pot calling kettle black," "you deserve it cheater," "karma's a bitch" etc. and very little focus on the actual issue at hand. The first time I publicly complained about being cheated was also the last. Mizzi Mad at Italian Poker
There's really just no point in me calling these people out publicly because it just seems like no one cares because it happened to me, a "known cheat".

I have been playing Chinese poker for about 4 years on and off but mostly on. I've played thousands of hands with such players as Doyle Brunson, Eli Elezra, Roland De Wolfe, Barry Greenstein, Mike Matusow, Phil Helmuth, Matt Glantz and David Oppenheim. Some of which who have been around the poker world for decades and I'm sure could easily sniff out a cheater in a self dealt game.

I have had both big wins and equally big losses in Chinese but am fortunate enough to be up a decent amount lifetime. I have been accused or suspected of cheating in Chinese poker a couple of times prior to this. One of the times the accuser was someone I had never played against and accused me solely based on how much I won from my opponent (his friend) in such a short amount of time (we were playing 8k a point at peak and doing random 50-100k flips). Another time I was accused of cheating in online Chinese poker by using a program that when I submit which 13 cards I have tells you exactly how to set the hand perfectly according to maximize your EV. This program does exist and I had just started using it prior to playing online Chinese in order to practice against the computer and get better at setting my hand but had never used it while actually playing.

I did play Racener in Bahamas. He knew that I had just beat James Dempsey out of ~90k a few days prior playing basically the same format. We had an outstanding number from various things such as betting on a basketball game, lodden thinks, last longer's and Chinese. We had known each other for quite a while prior to this trip but only as acquintances who would occasionally exchange head nods when we walked by one another.

We were doing random 50:50 flips and playing Chinese poker freezeouts (whoever was up after 10 hands wins 5k-10k, i think?) with 2 jokers where we would both deal a deck and we take turns having a hand with 14 cards (and get to discard one). I was up 3-1 (effectively 10k) in the Chinese game. Since we didn't know each other that well we agreed it would be best to settle after every game so we both had chips and cash. The current game we were playing was for 10k, he had finished setting both of his hands and looked back at the first hand he had set to change it. It's def against the rules in criss-cross Chinese so I told him it wasn't allowed. His reaction was super defensive and sensitive, I didn't think what he did was that big a deal but I just thought I'd point it out to him because most people I play Chinese with know it's a nono simply because you can set your first hand better with knowledge of what you had in your second hand. A few hands later he stopped me after the deal and told me that he wanted my 14 card hand. I told him he couldn't because it was my turn to have the 14 card hand. He grabbed the hand and freaked out when he saw that the joker was around the bottom of the deck (3-6 cards in not first bottom card like Shaun reports). He started going off on how he saw me deal the joker from the bottom of the deck. I yelled back and him and told him he was wrong blah blah blah. Went on for about 5 minutes and then John decided to quit in the middle of our 10k game with me up around 15-20 points after 4-5 hands and demanded I paid him back all the money I won from the trip from all the other stuff we bet on. I basically told him GFY and left but still ended up paying him for the sports bet he won.

I'm not sure what John's incentive is for lying to Deeb (assuming he did in fact and Deeb is not making this up which despite our problems in the past and knowing how big of a hard-on deeb has for "exposing" me I don't think he would do). Even tho I truly believe that Deeb means well he def likes to be the center of attention in uncovering controversies and has no problem triumphantly taking credit for it. I didn't think it would be money since he had just come 2nd in the WSOP for over 5 million (although I know he only had 50% of himself minus taxes minus a pretty balling house which he said he just bought minus whatever losses he may or may not have incurred since the main event in poker or other things). But I guess people's incentive in these situations don't necessarily have to be monetary. Perhaps he heard rumors from people of me cheating in Chinese and wanted to take advantage of that thinking the entire poker community would side with him (correct). Maybe he just disliked me and wanted to see me go down (final nail in the coffin etc).I'm not even sure exactly how one effectively cheats in Chinese. The only stories I've heard about cheating in chinese poker is people who muck their bottom hands and put a big hand up top when their entire hand is **** (like bad 3pair so they put AA up top and muck rest of their hand). Or maybe putting down a big royalty (straight flush) but setting it down so that you don't see that one of the cards in the "straight flush" is actually a heart and not a diamond ex.(having 3d,4d,5d,6h,7d) but covering it as if the heart is a diamond) Dealing off the bottom of the deck is ridic, honestly sounds like something out of a movie and don't really think it would be effective in Chinese ( unless ur playing with jokers i guess).. I've probably played with jokers a total of 5 or 6 times?... I'm by no means a magician or good with cards or card tricks... I have one card trick and its kind of lame...

I liked Racener b4 this , but the guys def got some issues if hes telling people I admitted to cheating and claimed a family member was dying / i was on anti depressants as a reason for cheating.. oh and suicide threats lol... that just blows my mind. Was waiting for him to actually post b4 saying anything n not just go off of shauns word but doesn't seem like that's going to happen anytime soon (maybe after this it might)... Overall, I'm just very confused tbh, trying to figure things out myself... prob going to delete my 2p2 account and self ban myself for life b/c i care less and less what people think on this forum the more and more I read the crap u trolls write (only attacking the trolls, u know who u are).. its just makes me sad and depressed (not enough to kill myself dont worry) and I want to be happy and enjoy my life. The theme of 2011 is to protect myself from being ****ed over... What else is in store for me? I think after the WSOP I'm likely going to do some charity work in Cambodia and then seriously consider finding another job  as far as my chinese goes, as much as i enjoy it I prob won't play again unless it's with someone I trust / someone I've played a ton with and/or there's a third party watching at all times to settle disputes.

Peace out for now (until next controversy obv) ETA 2-3 months

Not a bad response IMO...hope Racener will respond as it all doesn't mean a thing without his post IMO.

trigg you crack me up

Iv been knocked often enough to have an instinct for when someone is lying and I get that instinct here very strongly.

give us some stories of you being knocked dave. make for  good reading imo

u got an instinct from his typing?

wow u have some cool powers

He's just a bullshitter Paul. (Sorel is btw, not lil Dave).

I'm interested to hear Maria's opinion of Sorel's press release....

Sort of get what Dave is saying here and agree

i know he is a bull shitter but its kinda hard to tell just from reading from what he says

Seriously, did he ever get caught doing any other cheating?

I know what he did in the past was bad, but on my moral scale it isn't even close to the 3 DUIs Racener has.

Account swapping was pretty rife 3 years ago, and is still probably pretty common.  It is just something I note when watching my poker tracker, and kind of accept. 

can the people that know it all pls give concrete examples of his cheating pls. inclined to believe the guy.

This is just what I know of mizzi:

- was banned from ftp for buying an account of someone who was deep in a big tournament.

- a transcript of a conversation between him and another high stakes reg known as 'roman' on 2+2 was leaked. On it mizzi was looking for a backing partner for his idea. He explained this idea saying they would stake a large number of horses and then use software to oversee all of them at once, help make decisions and then take over (without needing to log in from a different machine and hence skipping ip traces) when individuals are deep.

- someone from ftp said that since mizzi was banned they still believed him to be playing on the site under other accounts and believe he even won an ftops.

- mizzi allegedly lost around 500k+ in private hu vs a guy who was cheating him. This was documented on 2+2 thread. (Whilst this doesn't implicate him, it was a bit of a shady game to be involved in).

- then there's this debacle and I even think there may be something else I'm forgetting.

he has admitted to havign 6 ftp accounts

Mmm, I think this new accusation is on a whole new level to the rest. I think muliti accounting whilst illegal is not even close to the same level of cheating and I'm pretty sure many on here have done it tbh. I would not believe the new accusations based just on this............

can this not be done with team viewer and mikagogo cos. i know of a load of chinese kids who do this and the  main reason i dont play the on line stuff full time any more. well its coz i have 3 kids really

names?

Me........

and yes my second account was banned lol. If I've done it you bet your ass the more serious players than me have.

Oh man I'm not even in the chinese cheating clique FML

did i imagine it or didnt he get exposed for bottom dealing but in his long post never even comments on it just talks about how hes heard others have cheated at chinesse

MA'ing is as much cheating as any other form of cheating in poker/gambling

for poker to be fair both parties need to have equal information (they may not process it as well, that's part of the skill) if you a) happen to know what the flop will be, or b) have info on someone else's game/tendancies, whilst they have none on you and do not know that you have any on them then the game is unfair and the guy with the advantage is cheating

it's just flat out cheating.

Don't agree at all, there is a massive difference.

What about the various I-poker skins where you can pop up as various aliases on effectively the same site? If it was as serious as you mention those separate skins, or at the least the ability to have an account with more than 1 skin, would have been banned a long, long time ago.

I realise he has multi accounted in the past, but what makes him more likely to cheat this game than the guy who has been convicted of drink driving 3 times?

They were drinking Kaliber

multi entry / multi accounting = similar thing

sure is!

be intersting to hear what john Tabbatatai has to say on these romours as he an sorel were very close friends an still are?

Yh its annoying on iPoker, prolly the main reason behind the limited HU cash action

same on the old cake network where you used ot be able to change your SN - the difference is that people know that it's possible I spose.

I mean as someone who's been cheated out of several chunks lifetime from MA'ing and given that I personally have never done it nor would I even consider it I think it's a massive massive deal.

It's as much cheating as anything else imo, spose we'll have to agree to disagree :)

and yeah Jason they are completely different not even remotley similar :p

Woodsey - its very different having different ipoker accounts where its fair game and everyone knows you can have diff account names on different skins than deceiving regs etc on full tilt by doing something against t's and c's.

I know exactly what your saying mate. But my real point is there is different levels of cheating, playing with a fixed deck or dealing from the bottom or whatever I would put right at the top of the list of worst of the worst. Just because someone has MA I wouldn't automatically assume they had sunk to new depths of cheating like has been suggested.

Maybe he did it? Maybe not? Who knows? But to link one with the other is a pretty big jump imo.

Yeah I can't disagree with that woodrow wilson

cliffs from before

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/poker/columns/story?columnist=wise_gary&id=5528193

interestingly Shaundeeb puts the boot in there.

sorel mizzi previous coming clean post

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/61/mtt-community/coming-clean-setting-record-straight-863952/

I had a quick look through and it appears throladean who allegedly had that conversation allegedly never posted to deny it

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/61/mtt-community/alleged-chatlog-between-sorel-thorladen-857685/

another thing about that thread is that waxonchris never posted again.

i see them as similar because they give an advantage to those with a bigger roll over the average man. the skill level should be enough of an advantage without giving him multiple advantages in the wallet. whats the difference in a guy sitting as imperlumpum in 6 seats and having the chips combined to a single stack as the tables close and him sitting as Icheat, fuDave, h8rsh8, tellYaMammy and kissMyButt and doing the same thing...only reason i can see is coz you wont have the hand histories on your huds of all the aliases.  cheating has always gone on on the net and prob always will. some forms of cheating are legal. some forms are not

Sorel and MattG1983 (Matt Graham - who later signed with UB!) had a dispute which i think occured before the buying of Chris Vaughns account. Essentially IIRC Sorel took over a mates account deep deep into WPT satellite on UB where there was one package and MattG finished second to this account that Sorel was now playing on.

wow. another nice prahlad type deal...ub bends you over then gives you the reach round. top guys top site

I always wondered who the punters were who believed OJ was not guilty and thought it a good idea to
give Hindley and Sutcliffe another chance.
Looks like a fair few are poker players - get a grip.

it's pretty common for people with more money to have an advantage. Whereas multi entering a tourney does give you hightened chance of winning the tourney, it also penalises you financially, you dont actually gain a $ev edge over any opponent that you wouldn't have had anyways

now, supose we're playing HU cash and I've played tons with you we know all about each others games now one day you show up on an account that I have no idea  who it is. The advantage you'll have over me (at least for the first 200-300 hands) will be so large ots puts me into a positions where Im pretty unlikely to be able to win without getting extremely lucky.

How anyone doesn't think that is basically stealing is beyond me

Throw in the fact you can have 2 stacks on the same table...

The situations where he may have been multi-accounting in the same tourney (if that did ever happen), are clearly wrong / cheating, and there is no defence for it.

If he did open up to 6 accounts, with the intention, or the result, that he gained an unfair edge over other players, then ditto.

However, opening up a new account just to carry on playing on FTP, after your previous one was banned, possibly unfairly / harshly given the offence committed, and the probability that lots of others have committed the same offence, but without the same penalty, is in a different category.
Although this gives him an advantage in the short term, the account gets opened not with the express intention of deception, but just to stay in the game.
It's still wrong, but I could see myself considering doing this, if it was my only source of income.

The point I am trying to make is that you can't lump it all together and say 'cheater' - it's a bit too lazy - each offence needs to be considered on it's own merits.

+1

Seriously? Not with intent to deceive? Opening an account at a site where you're banned from playing, to play vs people you have tons of history with under a SN they wont recognize? Sounds very deceptive to me....

Lots of people who dont play poker on the internet seriously mis understand how big an advantage you gain from playing in your reg games under an diff account. Its so huge and in the short term especially can cost thousands and thousands.

To put it into live poker context...

You're playing at DTD and the board is  Jd Qd Qc after you've opened the button and Jason Herbert c/raises...seems like a decent spot to fold the  Kc Kh to me.

Now lets say this wasn't jason herbert, but Tom Middleton in a Jason Herbert costume...................

and yh sorry woodsey I agree they are different and we cant assume that because he committed offence a) he must have  committed offence b)

However I disagree that the two forms of cheating are in any way less serious. both intend to gain a long term financial advantage over another person using foul play, makes them exactly the same in my books.

Thanks for creating an epic scooby doo reveal moment in my head dave!

He would have got away with it if it wasn't for those pesky internet kidz.

It has the result of being deceptive, but you don't know that deception was the reason for opening an account..... might have simply wanted to stay in the game.

There are a number people who post on BP who have more than 1 account on one of the main sites, but it is not automatically assumed that their prime motivation is deception.
In this instance, because it is Sorel Mizzi, he is guilty irrespective.

The evidence  against him, in the cheating at chinese poker incident is scant / non-existent.
Therefore, judgement is being made with reference to his previous behaviour.
That isn't completely unreasonable, as long as we take a balanced view, and not a one-eyed view, of the other alleged incidents.

Thank you for explaining this to me. I will promise not to comment on online poker again, until I have tried it out for myself.

Lol <3 noel goblin and lol doyve

http://quadjacks.com/audio/12/john-racener-speaks

Sure know who my money would be on for telling the truth after that interview....and sure would be paying if flushy.  Racener sounds pretty straight up to me (cue how can you tell he sounds straight up lol)

I think the absolute key point is that Sorel was giving JR free %ages in tourneys to keep schtum.

why?!?!

if he could recover those texts it would be gg sorrel

Playing Devil's advocate;

Really? Going out is scary? Who are you, Justin Bieber?

Why the F would you delete these? I hardly ever delete my texts, maybe just about once every 3 or 4 months. But these important ones that back up your story you throw out? And some of them probably sent after SD "broke" the story on 2p2?

Other than saving yourself some pennies or maybe you didn't like him "beating your head in"?

Hmm don't know about this. Don't know how unusual it is to play with a joker but if you've never played Chinese Poker with a joker before  and never even thought you would you must be pretty degen to do that for 5-10k flips. But there's nothing suspicious about playing with a joker and if you thought there was you could have just said no.

Well SD does have a bit of a bug up his arse about Mizzi, no?

Maybe someone that plays CP can clarify whether what Racener did that Mizzi had a problem with is allowed or not?

Was it just me or did the interviewer also not sound entirely convinced by everything?

I don't know how old Racener is or how clever he is but he sounded like a young and relatively naive kid that got caught underage drinking or something TBH.

/end being Devil's advocate.

This, and proof of this please.

So you think that Racener concocted this whole story then?

Fair enough, in that case he's completely bamboozled me.

I think Racener has huge mental problems and Sorel is fully legit. The deleting of the texts is just laughable.

Paiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii him.

I don't really mate. Don't know what to think of this entire story TBF..it sounds pretty naff from all angles.

that interview certainly didn't do racener any favours. he sounds a bit crazy in it

pretty sure he can get those texts retrieved

If he had a nokia or bb u can get them retrieved I think

Yh i agree that his multi-accounting history has no relevance to the chinese accusations. That's not the point tho


Maybe several blonde members have multiple accounts, altho still completely out of line in my eyes I agree if you're not a reg at a certain game there is far far less advantage to be gained. But if sorel is banned from FTP and starts a second account then its EXACTLY the same thing regardless of whether he wanted to cheat initially or not.

And of course I didn't say not to comment on online poker (sorry if that came across like i was being a dick) my point is that people who dont play everyday and understand how valuable the information you've mined on your reg players is than it's impossible to actually grasp how much you stand to get fucked my MA'ing

I don't what to think, I don't think either parties have put a convincing arguement across. Sorel's is more coherent but he has a history of talking a good game while doing shady stuff. Whereas Racener just seems to be on another planet and why he has deleted the texts is beyond me, pretty much has Sorel dead with those as evidence.

Its a known cheat vs a repeat drink driver, sod the pair of em.

if ur a cheat y would u text someone trying to bribe them to keep quiet?
pretty stupid if you would do that

racener doesn't sound convincing

Have you ever gone over the speed limit barry?

Relevance?

I don't see how racener having been done for a few DUI's is really truly relevant to this issue. It's irresponsible, against the law and endangers lives, just like speeding.

If Barry get's done over for a poker related matter should we be saying 'two fingers up to him anyway, he got 3 points for doing 46 in a 40'?

you're quite right of course..don't think Barry was being completely serious.

Listening to that interview though you'd never think Racener was old enough to drink and drive.

Yeah I wasn't being serious really, just saying they are probably both a pair of pricks.

And in answer to your question, I got my first speeding ticket ever a few months ago, had to do one of those speed awareness courses to avoid the points.

I did that as well..money well spent :)

Stop saying speeding is the same as drink driving people, that's just uber dumb.


I don't want to believe Mizzi but haven't seen anything irrefutable from either. Pair of tits imo.

You know what, I didnt actually mind it all that much, it was marginally interesting and I think I have been a bit more careful as a result. It was still shite though, just not as shite as I imagined it would be.

Same for me, though I never speed in a built up area anyways and the course was really not tailored for people doing 82 on the M6.

So when is Racener's 24 hr deadline to post (he said he'd do it within 24 hrs of the interview) run out? will I have something juicy to read tomorrow morning or not so much?

I didn't get the option :(

3 DUI's in a year is INSANE.

Ahh, Gary "Plaigia" Wise

How do you even get 3 in a year? Surely: 1st time = ban. 2nd time (dui + driving without license) = prison? 3rd time (dui + driving without license + on the run from prison) = 20 year stretch (or the death penalty?)

I think he did his 3 DUIs over 4 years or so.  There are some mug shots somewhere along wth the one when he was done for assault or similar.

pillar of society obv 

I aasume this is genuine

http://jgarywise.com/?p=286

A statement from Racener, handed to me by his people,

“Though I stand by my original claims of cheating on Sorel’s part, I feel that it was extremely irresponsible to make statements regarding Sorel’s mental state at the time and immediately following the incident. After much thought, I realize now that taking such matters to a public forum is dangerous and can be detrimental to the person that is being talked about. I also should not have allowed the matter to be addressed by a third party in a public forum. I look forward to putting this incident far behind me. This matter is being dealt with between Sorel and I, and I consider the topic to be closed.”

Obviously, keeping things private would have been the more professional approach, but this is at least a step in the right direction. Sorry it won’t be solved publicly, forum-dwellers, but this is life in the grown up world.

lol, Wow he's an awful lot more articulate in his posting than he is when speaking about it. Did he study law?

+1mil

i got banned earlier this year and i find it pretty annoying when people say "drink or drugs?". speeding is way less of a crime imo.

It might be less dangerous than drink driving but I still think speeding is a dickish and irresponsible thing.

If you hit and kill a little girl and you've been doing either, what difference?

how about on the motorway? i dont speed in built-up areas.

There is a big difference, you are completely right if someone is doing 100 in a 40 or something equally as ridiculous its just as bad, but if its close to the speed limit its nowhere near as negligent as somebody deliberately getting behind the wheel drunk. For me, someone who is over the drink drive limit by a considerable margin should be an automatic jail term.

cos how many people actually do 30 in a 30 mph zone. london may be different but if anyone is doing 30 they are usually holding traffic up...same for doing 70 on the motorway. the majority of people pick up points for doing 34 to 38 mph. its a massive way to generate revenue. the %age of people in an accident doing 35 is substantially different to the %age of drink drivers having an accident.

This +10,000,000


Doing 40mph past a school is highly irresponsible and should be dealt with accordingly.  Not the same as a German hippy dwarf doing 84mph on the M6 (assuming it was a fine, dry day?).

Anyway, there's a thread for this somewhere...

What happened in the end on this one?

Oh and



didn't get enough love at the time.