blonde poker forum

Holdem No Limit $1/$2

[Jun 29 11:35:29] : Seat 1 : sholohan has $303.34
[Jun 29 11:35:29] : Seat 2 : Wizard-50 has $167.75
[Jun 29 11:35:29] : Seat 3 : wopin snout has $234.25
[Jun 29 11:35:29] : Seat 4 : CUFC has $185.75
[Jun 29 11:35:29] : Seat 5 : TightBlonde has $226.92
[Jun 29 11:35:29] : Seat 6 : zekulya has $172
[Jun 29 11:35:29] : Seat 8 : skim0167 has $245.46
[Jun 29 11:35:29] : Seat 9 : chris13105 has $155
[Jun 29 11:35:29] : chris13105 is the dealer.
[Jun 29 11:35:30] : sholohan posted small blind.
[Jun 29 11:35:31] : Wizard-50 posted big blind.

[Jun 29 11:35:31] : Seat 5 : TightBlonde has 3c 3s
[Jun 29 11:35:34] : wopin snout folded.
[Jun 29 11:35:35] : CUFC folded.
[Jun 29 11:35:37] : TightBlonde called $2
[Jun 29 11:35:39] : zekulya folded.
[Jun 29 11:35:39] : skim0167 folded.
[Jun 29 11:35:42] : chris13105 called $2
[Jun 29 11:35:44] : sholohan called $1
[Jun 29 11:35:51] : Wizard-50 raised $8
[Jun 29 11:35:54] : TightBlonde called $8
[Jun 29 11:36:00] : chris13105 called $8
[Jun 29 11:36:01] : sholohan folded.
[Jun 29 11:36:02] : Dealing flop.
[Jun 29 11:36:02] : Board cards [9h Ah 3h]
[Jun 29 11:36:10] : Wizard-50 bet $16
[Jun 29 11:36:15] : TightBlonde called $16 and raised $32
[Jun 29 11:36:16] : chris13105 folded.
[Jun 29 11:36:24] : Wizard-50 called $32 and raised $109.75 and is All-in
[Jun 29 11:36:26] : TightBlonde ?


Oppo has just sat down, and lost his first pot

I call the raise with the sole intention of hitting the set. I hit it

He bets out, I put him on Ax

I raise to define my hand, he answers

Only problem is...the answer may be I have an A with x of hearts, or I have two hearts, or I have Ax no hearts


do you go with this and put your stack at risk?

I would probably of passed pre flop because I can only win with this hand by hitting trips.(a comment on my ability not your play)

Having said that I would also have only flat called the flop bet on the basis of thinking AK with king of hearts (or queen) being a real possibility you can let him put all his money in with anything but a heart on the turn, knowing you are far more likely to be well ahead at that point. Plus if the board pairs you have position for the river if the heart does come.

not sure that makes sense but hey....

Edit... forgot to put what I would od after the all in - I would call and moan at the computer when he turns the flush or has the pocket aces!

I think you've got to call, although I would be looking at the guys stats to check he ain't a complete rock first.

I think at the 1/2 level this is an easy call. No disrespect, but most of the time they will turn over A with a big heart, no A and the big heart or just the A. You already have money invested, he doesnt have a full buy in at the table and if he has flopped a flush you are not dead by any means. Only hands you are in desperate shape against is AA and 99 obviously.

Somebody said they would fold preflop, big big mistake. set mining is probably the most profitable cash game play. I wouldnt wait for the turn either, because if a heart hits you are almost definately behind and cant call a big bet.

I would call this on the flop all day long

Is it better to look for sets in limped or raised pots in such a situation? (genuine question...obv more likely to be paid of in the raised one I guess?)

any set is good obviously, and well concealed. If the pot is raised it is more likely that some1 has an overpair and in most cases at low-meium levels they just dont fold now and you usually get paid off for a full buy in

No, like Pab said, "Not at this level."

I call to.

I set mine also, i will call any pp for a 4 times the BB raise, anymore and i am dumping 77 or less.

Depending surely with how much the raiser is sitting with? If he is sitting with 200*bb, are you still going to fold to a 5*bb raise with a small  P/P?

i have to disagree...althou i'm probably not good enought to argue...anyway i would fold preflop here...

in a multyway pot the only way to win with 33 is to flop a set...no question about this..

Thightend limps with 33 , as i would do... then the button and SB call the BB , and the BB raises to 10$ ( 8 more ) ..so now the pot is 16$ and TE has to put 8$ to call... 2 to 1 with a baby pair are orrible pot odds in my opinion...PLUS 2 other players are left to act...a reraise is not that probable but still possible, and i can't see how TE could call a reraise frome the guy on the button.... and also, the BB and the button both have less money than TE, so that makes the implied odds not that favourable...i tend to agree with Rooky9 on this hand..

but if you called preflop, it's an easy call on that flop imo...

You explanation of the process was the exact lines I was thinking of, however I don't play a massive amount of cash poker (or poker full stop) and so would be prepared to believe that perhaps this is an option for a long term method of winning at cash games, particularly when it is coming from a good player.

I will move outside the line in some cases, i will call very marginal hands if there are enough players in the pot.

Another point with set mining is you need to be able to take a few of the pots without hitting your set, so position is desirable and i would prefer to be playing tight/passive or loose/passive players.

When my opponent is not sitting with a full buy in and is OOP and especially if I have notes to suggest he is ABC (not the case here, no knowledge) I am calling a raise less than 6-7x bb with any pp due to my implied odds if I hit my set. This applies to 1-2 and 2-4 cash..my regular levels. It is more important that he does not have a full buy in in front of him, because it means you cannot be stacked, he can be.

Here two of my three pre-conditions for set mining are in place. Also I have to be prepared to follow through on a raggy flop to find out if I am up against an over pair or AK/AQ

Hitting a set combined with an A on the flop is golden, although as we see here it gets complicated if you hit a set, there is an A and the board is flushing!

If you are looking to stack opponents, hitting a set against an overpair or TPTK or similar is golden. Actual pot odds at the time of calling a raise are immaterial...it's the implied odds for the time you stack them that makes it worthwhile

Did the other player have  Ad Kh?

and this is what happened

 
[Jun 29 11:36:26] : TightBlonde called $109.75

[Jun 29 11:36:27] : Seat 5 : TightBlonde has 3c 3s
[Jun 29 11:36:28] : Seat 2 : Wizard-50 has  Ac Kh
[Jun 29 11:36:29] : Seat 5 : TightBlonde has 3c 3s
[Jun 29 11:36:34] : Board cards [9h  Ahrt 3h 9c Jc]
[Jun 29 11:36:34] : Seat 2 : Wizard-50 has Ac Kh
[Jun 29 11:36:34] : Wizard-50 has Two Pair: Aces and 9s
[Jun 29 11:36:34] : Seat 5 : TightBlonde has 3c 3s
[Jun 29 11:36:34] : TightBlonde has Full House : 3s full of 9s
[Jun 29 11:36:34] : TightBlonde wins $344.50 with Full House : 3s full of 9s

He had TP and nut flush draw, so it was one of those unavoidable ones, could have gone either way.

Board:  Ahrt 3h 9h
Dead: 

           equity (%)     win (%)   tie (%)
Hand  1:   30.1010 %     30.10%    00.00%      { AcKh }
Hand  2:   69.8990 %     69.90%    00.00%      { 3c3s }

Call and pray he misses the flush, if he has the flush then so be it you still have outs.

As for the set mining debate i must agree with Pab here a great way to gain chips either in cash or tournies.
I will call bets on the flop even if i've missed because implied odds can be huge (unless hitting my set would put a possible flush out) if i hit the turn. Moreso if a pair has flopped because you are more likely to be paid off by trips (obviously this can lead to losing to a bigger FH but very rarely).

Being "stacked" matters not in a cash game - the amount is the same whether it's your whole stack or half of it. I'd want him to have me covered so I can win more.

Am I looking at these things the wrong way?

Maybe I expressed it incorrectly


what I meant was assuming you had your starting chips or higher and he has less than a full table buy in, here $200, then you aren't playing for all your stack whilst set mining

Whilst you might in some circumstances want him to have more than you (such as on a non flushing non straightening board where you hit a set) in others, such as here where he clearly has a made hand or a big draw, you don't want it all at risk

Not important in the big scheme of things, I accept