blonde poker forum

zambla is at seat 0 with $118.25.
-Gotcha- is at seat 1 with $198.40.
NutsInYourEye is at seat 2 with $207.90 (sitting out).
jwill950 is at seat 3 with $237.65.
Erut is at seat 4 with $208.40.
BartelWstrnMU is at seat 5 with $121.50.
The button is at seat 0.

-Gotcha- posts the small blind of $1.
jwill950 posts the big blind of $2.

zambla:  -- --
-Gotcha-:  5c Ac
jwill950:  -- --
Erut:  -- --
BartelWstrnMU:  -- --

Pre-flop:

Erut folds.   BartelWstrnMU folds.   zambla folds.
-Gotcha- raises to $6.   jwill950 calls.

Flop (board: Kc 5d Tc):

-Gotcha- bets $12.   jwill950 calls.

Turn (board: Kc 5d Tc 6c):

-Gotcha- checks.   jwill950 bets $7.   -Gotcha- calls.


River (board: Kc 5d Tc 6c Jc):

NutsInYourEye has reconnected.
-Gotcha- checks.   jwill950 bets $20.   -Gotcha- raises
to $40.   jwill950 re-raises to $170.   -Gotcha- folds.
jwill950 is returned $130 (uncalled).

He goes all in and says something like "you have a big club?"

 No ,I hate it

Um if im reading this right you are laying down presuming he has  Qc 9c and that only. I can't lay this down, I would be worried that he had it but can you really lay this down getting nearly 2 to 1.

This has to be completely read based if he is a rock yes i can see it being a good laydown, but otherwise all i got to say is WOW. You are either going to be a genius or look stupid.

Tell me he showed the  Qc 9c and i will officially call you a genius.

What else can he possibly have?

Um the bare   Qc or a total bluff. If you think about it from his point of view it is good bluffing territory, he figures the only hand that he gets to call him is the  Ac. Also does he push the lot over the size of the pot with the stone cold nuts does he not want a caller?

This all put together makes it a call, admittedly a slightly crying one while saying to myself " The ****** got this hasn't he"

A smaller flush?

This is 1-2 at UB. They're generally weak tight games, I don't fold here at Party. Opponent seems to be a reasonable player. I check raise river, what can I have? Seriously I can only have the ace. He goes all in. On a bluff? He would have to have the Queen and balls of steel. I think most players fold the Queen here, some will make a crying call and maybe 0.000001% have the balls to go all in on a bluff. I think probably you guys play higher than this and play in games where people can make that sort of move.

Anyway I wrote "you have str8 flush????????"

Someone else types in "For sure" (a bit naughty that)

My timer runs out and I tell him I had the Ace. He spends the next 5 minutes telling me he was sure I had the Ace and that I would call his all in thinking it was a bluff. You obv can never tell but I think he was telling the truth.

This hand would be more interesting if it was in an EPT or something and a tough player made this move. If most people couldn't fold the Ace here is it a good bluff?

I WANT TO PLAY WITH YOU.

$10 heads up on BPL?

 OMG

 you CANT fold here

 i would NEVER fold in this spot i wouldnt care if i was playing Doyle Brunson

 ffs

sorry bud, gotta agree. Horrible pass. If he has the straight flush you have to pay it off.

You think that he calls a raise pre flop with  Qc 9c? Cant be that tight a player surely?

I couldnt lay that down. I'd just have to pay him off.

I will say in Byrons defence in current small stakes  cash internet games there are large minority who are 99% of the time only pushing with the str8 flush. Yet unless you have a read, you can't lay it down.

This comes from going up through the stakes where no-one can fold a hand, so making moves is generally unprofitable. So the successful low limit players are often the ones who play ABC nuts poker.

Also pre flop and post flop tightness especially on the river are two different things. Yes there are alot of loose passives who will call a raise with this kind of hand who will only push with the nuts on the end.

I'd pay him off

However I agree with your and others contentions that on some sites (not Party, not tribecca) the only players pushing there have the stone cold nuts. UB and others full of ABC nut pedallers who play loose passive pre flop and weak tight post flop, so they call a raise hoping to hit a flop and then fold if they don't. You can find out one way or another with a post flop feeler bet.

 I'd have still paid him off though  :D you just can't be sure enough unless you know the player inside out.

Tough hand man. How can he raise again there without the nuts?

Unless its an unbelievably good bluff i.e. - He knows that you have the Ace (since you raised on the end) and knows that you know he has the Ace (dont you?) and he knows that you are capable of laying it down. He'd have to have played with you an awful lot to make this read; I think it's a very risky bluff, one that I would expect VERY few people to make.

So I think he's probably got it so good fold.

One thing that could be said is echoed from Sklansky - "dont raise (or bet) if you wouldn't like a re-raise". So if you are not going to call a re-raise dont raise the river here.
Dont know if Sklansky had something like this in mind here though as its difficult not to value bet the 2nd nuts but in fairness would you expect a call from the Qclubs here?

I PMed Green Plastic at www.cardrunners.com (http://www.cardrunners.com) about this hand. He's meant to be one of the best players on the internet and I have read a couple of posts by him about gut feeling and making big laydowns etc. This is his reply.


I think the problem was that at the time I was just taking a tentative step up to 1-2 and it seemed like a lot of money to be wasting when I was sure I was beat. I would have called at .50-1 so I can see why I should have called, I was just playing with scared money. I moved back down and am just making the move back up again. Hopefully it will go better this time.

So if you're reraised on the river you always fold unless you have the stone cold nuts?

I think you have to call

You cant fold here, in the LR it is surely a profitable play to call it....in NL200 people are likely to do anything to take a hand down...i couldnt lay down the 2nd nuts here.

Good post.

I think its a horrible thing to have to do and i dont think I could do it. The fact that you made it shows great discipline and is a sign of a great player. well done

call every time in that situation unless u have a proper tell on him..

Odds of him with royal flush against having a lower flush are tiny

imo this is a massive case of "if he's got it good luck to him"  if he's got it reload and move on (this should be ok if at the right level with your bankroll) if he hasn't scoop the pot!!

''If hes got it good luck to him''

Perfectly summerised :goodpost: