blonde poker forum

 i was playing in a league game live last night.

 anyway utg raises and straight away im thinking he has AK for some reason

 utg + 1 calls , i look down at QQ so i reraise , the bet x 3

 the guy on my left then pushes all in , by this point i have 5 k in and he moves in for about 8k so 3k more

 then the original utg raiser pushes in as well for 11k - 6k more , and utg + 1 calls all his chips - about 9k

 so it comes to me and i know im behind , the guy has practically told the table he has aces

 but i only have to call 6k to win 33k and with QQ its hard to fold

 also the format is a shootout so top 3 go through to final table - more points etc

 so i still had 9k left if i lost the hand and blinds were only 300 - 600 at this point

 so i had to call really , if i spiked the Q i would knock 3 players out and go to the final table with massive chips

 anyway utg sure enough has the aces , then utg + 1 turns over the cowboys , i flip the queens then the guy on my left turns jacks , everyone was laughing and the full hall came over to the table to see what was happening.

 anyway a K came on the flop and a Q on the turn so i had 1 out on the river but it never came

 i won a sidepot though of 3 - 4 k so still had 12k in chips so wasnt too unhappy , and we lost 2 players

 2 questions

 what are the chances of this happening  ( i couldnt believe my eyes )

 and how did i play the hand.

the only thing on which I am focussing is this part "6k to win 33k " so you're getting 5-1 your money. that's not enough to justify that call I'm afraid.

Glad to hear you did allright out of ti anyways but when it comes to pot odds it's a definite fold. once you say you know the guy has aces.

QQ is a 4-1 underdog to aces so surely its a call, although i wouldnt like it. the problem is all the other hands in there too if somebody held AQ or even QQ you dont have odds. i think its probably a fold for me. you are facing 3 allins and it had been raised about 17 times.

I have never been great with potodds (in fact I@m terrible with them)  so your 4-1 might well be right...however I just see it as only having 2 outs against a full deck that can screw you that doesn't sound like 4-1 to me...but indeed you can safely assume one of your other queens would be gone aswell and that just means you're in realy trouble.

lol, who the hell told you that?!!!?? That is funny!!! I guess you was joking right?

Well it's nearer 4.5 to 1 to be fair (18.453%). Don't look at it as 2 outs, its 4.5 to 1, 4.5 to 1.

Keep saying that to yourself over and over again. fourpointfivetooone


How on earth is this a safe asumption? Which of the other players played their hand like AQ?

The most likely thing is AK being out there. I wouldnt be suprised to see AK AA KK. Not bad spot for QQ.

It seems like a a bit of a crazy hand but theres a helluva lot of chips to be one.  For some reason when I was reading through that I thought you might have been up agaisnt AK, AK I think at 9/2 you are getting the odds to make the call on the end, I am not laying down that hand at this stage once I have committed as much as you have. 

The good thing is you never lost all the chips invested.

 yeah because of the format as well i knew if i did win the hand i was through to the final table wit a lot of chips so i thought it was worth another 6k when i had 5k in already.

 whats the odds on this occurring tank ?
 
 and a bonus point if you know the odds of it occurring in order ie utg - AA , utg +1 - KK and so on

Actually, when you have QQ against AA and KK, it is more like 5.85-to-1.  Fivepointeightfivetoone.

When you are QQ vs AA, you have to hit your Queen AND dodge an Ace.
When you are QQ vs AA vs KK, you have to hit your Queen, AND dodge an Ace, AND dodge a King.

Things get complicated when there are more than two hands.  Like when you have 57o vs AKs, you are -EV.  But when you have 57o vs AKs vs AKs, you are +EV.

So, anyway, on pot odds alone, it is a fold.

ah and here in lies the problem my friends...how many players are at this table? I am assuming ten, therefore I would always assume one of my queens to have been folded. There are not just 3 players in the hand...there are 5 or 7 more and that means 10 or 14 other cards are out...

it's a fair bet that one of your queens will therefore be gone.

you know ur behind but with the format of the game i think its an easy call for the extra chips plus the fact you still have a playable stack even if you lose

 we were 6 handed at this point and ill elaborate a bit more.

 i called this the table of deathe because it was a table of maniacs and muppets ,

 the guy utg is not too bad now but used to play any 2 cards all the way for all his chips.

 the 2nd guy is nicknamed the rocket because of his style of play , u can never safely put him on a hand , he could limp / min raise with AA / KK or overbet with Q9

 and the guy who pushed in 1st , on my left is probably the worst of the lot and wiould literally push in here with A5 or 44 etc

 so at the time i was hoping i was pretty sure i was behind to 1 of them but they really could have had a wide range of hands from Ace rag to small pairs or even just high connecting cards , maybe against other opposition i would have flat called the original raise , with a raise and flat call before me i could have seen a flop and got away cheaply had the A or K fell, so it was just a tricky situation to be in after raising to 5k and only having 6k to call.

  ;goodvevil;

You have made a fundamental mistake here.  If two players were dealt in and you have pocket queens, the probability of the next card off the stub being a queen is 2/50.  If 10 players were dealt in and you have pocket queens, the probability of the next card off the stub being a queen is still 2/50.  If 25 players were dealt in and you have pocket queens, the probability of the next card off the stub (which contains only two cards) being a queen, is still 2/50.

 ;technophobe; ;technophobe;

That logic doesn't work here, Boldie. The chances of the Queen being folded are the same regardless of the number of players.

Personally, I think it's a close call, although I think I'd opt for a fold because one guy's gonna win a monster pot, which can't be bad if it's a 'top 3 go through' type set-up.

Not wanting to be overly pedantic, but Boldie IS correct when he says that the more players who are dealt in, the more likely it is that a queen will have been folded.  The important point is that this statement is irrelevant.

Let me draw an analogy.  We start with a full deck and I deal you a card.  The chances that I deal you a red card is, of course, 50-50.

Now let's start again, but first I will throw half the deck into the bin.  Of course it is very likely that some red cards will get thrown into the bin.  But when I deal you a card, it is still 50-50 that you get a red one.

Now, suppose I throw 51 cards into the bin.  We can say for certain that there are some red cards in the bin.  But it is still 50-50 that the one remaining card is red.

So, in exactly the same way, the odds of a queen popping out are the same however many cards have been thrown in the bin/folded by other players.  It is correct to say that there are fewer card left in the deck which are queens, but don't forget that there are also fewer cards left in the deck which AREN'T queens, and as such the proportion stays exactly the same.

true

I meant in comparison to other cards tho

yep....my bad ofcourse...also explains why i have a tough time getting the nhang of pot odds.....*hangs head in shame*

Impeccable logic and a cracking looking picture of a cat, you should post more often Mrs Lime!