blonde poker forum

I've been having a bit of trouble with my heads up game recently so i would appreciate other people's thoughts on this hand.

I have the button and this is a low limit game.

-   thanathz is at seat 0 with 1250.
-   SupaMonkey is at seat 1 with 1750.

   SupaMonkey is dealt:  Aspades Ks
-   
-   Pre-flop:
-   SupaMonkey raises to 90. I always raise preflop when i have the button.
-   thanathz calls.
-   
-   Flop (board: Ad 2c 9c):
-   thanathz checks.
-   SupaMonkey bets 90.
-   thanathz raises to 450.

What do you do here? If you call, what is your plan for the turn?

-   SupaMonkey calls.
-   
-   turn card: 8c
-   Turn (board: Ad 2c 9c 8c):
-   thanathz goes all-in for 710.
-   SupaMonkey ?

Do you call? What kind of hand do you think your oppo has?

It depends on the guy you're playing and how he's been playing hands.

You raised pre-flop which is fine.

then when you get reraised on the flop I tend to stick my chips in..the guy will probably call anyways but on the flop you're probably ahead.
I would even say on the turn you might be ahead, there is no need for him to bet this agressively if he actually has the flush. I call.

Thanks Boldie, i changed it a bit.

OK...I don't know why you always raise pre-flop (I advise mixing it up a bit more so your oppo definetly doesn't know where to go).

in this case, if you have played him for a while he won't put you on the Ace if you always raise preflop (does he always call?)

If he doesn't always call he has either the ace or a pp (Obviously pockets 9's and dueces are an option). I would say A10+ (in this situation you are obviously ahead unless he has sooted Ace of clubs).

If I put him on this I always move in, if he has the Ace he doesn't put you on it because you always raise and he will call. unless he has Ace of clubs you will be fine.

again..the turn bet is way too agressive to be a flush...there is no need for him to move all his chips in. if he has a hand that beats you it will most probably be trips.

If he has been playing like a rock (as far as HU will allow you to)then I would fold on the flop assuming he slowplayed a pp.

In most circumstances I would stick my chips in on the flop when he reraises you as I would put most people here on an ace and he thinks you're at it because you always raise preflop from your position.

Thanks boldie.

I always raise in position to exploit my advantage. Do you use pokertracker (i am going to start using it, i have only just found a reasonable HH grabber for Ub) i'm pretty sure that most people win more in positon that out of position. I am just trying to amplify this effect.

Preflop he likes to fold reasonably often but it changes. Here i am chip daddy so he is more likely to get involved and try and pull some moves. If he was chip leader then he would have a tighter calling range pf.

Why do you want to move in on the flop? Do you think he will slow down on turn/river (maybe a club scares him)? I know you have already said you think he will call with a weaker ace, but at the time i was thinking wondering what weaker hands would call an allin there. If you call on the flop, do you think he will fire again on the turn and you could get your chips in with him having a wider betting range.

There's nothing wrong in raising every button, that's a common strategy and especially effective if your opponent is weak.

I would have checked the flop to add deception. I feel I garner more information from betting the turn.

I would re-pop his re-raise. There are too many hands that you have beat. Weaker Ace, middle pair, flush draw. I'd be surprised if he had 9-2 or A-A.

I'd fold the Turn, especially because I don't have the Ace of clubs.

I don't use poker tracker..but yes in position you tend to win more pots HU. Position is soo much more important HU then it is at a full table (and we all know position is important enough there)

I assumed this was a 1500 starting stack HU thing (maybe my mistake because I mainly play those things) that's why I said move all in..if he sticks in 460 that is about 1/3rd of his stack (assuming he has about his 1500 starting stack left)..that will do me nicely..especially when a weak ace will call here. (HU loads of people over play their weak Aces..even after the flop..they just can't let go).

Most players would be scared if you flatcall and fire on the turn and that would lead them to fold. If any danger cards come out (like in this case the flush) you might be scared yourself..or if you bet the turn he will be scared.
The flop is the time to get the chips in if someone bets this big and you have a big Ace because, unless he already has you beat (2 pair or trips), he is more likely to think he's good here and call.

Snoops/boldie, thanks for the good replies.

Snoops, i didn't want to check the flop with that kind of board because if he does hit his flush on the turn i could end up losing a large pot.

Both of you said to push once he reraises me. My thinking was that he had an ace and didn't take me for one (like you said boldie). I thought that by repopping him i would get most of the hands i was ahead of folding (including weaker aces) however, i thought he was definitely going to fire again on the turn so i called with the intention of calling/moving in on the turn (i had him on a weak ace at this point).

Here is the rest of the hand.

-   turn card: 8c
-   Turn (board: Ad 2c 9c 8c):
-   thanathz goes all-in for 710.
-   SupaMonkey calls.
-   
-             Tournament all-in showdown -- players show:
-             thanathz shows 7c Qc.
-             SupaMonkey shows Ks  Aspades.
-   
-   river card: Ts
-   River (board: Ad 2c 9c 8c Ts):
-           (no action in this round)
-   
-   
-   Showdown:
-   thanathz has 7c Qc 2c 9c 8c: flush, queen high.
-   SupaMonkey has Ks  Aspades Ad 9c Ts: a pair of aces.  ;technophobe; ;technophobe; ;technophobe; ;technophobe; ;technophobe;



What do you think of the way he played it? I can see why he has played his flush draw like this but i don't like it. I think he commits too many chips to the pot and because the pot was big i should have moved in to protect my hand. Maybe i was greedy?

the good thing about his bet on the turn is that I fell for it. there's no need to bet a flush like this HU but..it worked (and would most likely have on me if I'd called on the flop)

he sticks WAY too many chips in on the flop for someone with a flush draw. He had 1100 and stuck more then 1/3rd of his chips in after you had raised. He would have a tough time folding if he'd missed the turn.
He might have thought you were bluffing when you bet the flop and therefore thought he had a lot of outs but I don't like it...I would have tried to sucker you into this..raise your 90 bet (by about 180) and then keep dragging your chips in through all streets. A flush is soo strong HU it is foolish to scare people off.

Anyway, yes I think you got greedy. repopping the flop when someone has this many chips in (relative to his stack) is never a bad thing.
I see quite a few people trying to get to a conclusion of a HU match too soon..by either being greedy or forcing the issue. The reason I tend to do fairly well HU is because I grind the suckers down. You sit down with me for a 30$ HU match (or even a 5'er) and I will have you at that table for 30 minutes if I must.
Most people playing HU (especially lower limits) want fast results and get impatient if they don't. That's where you want them to be. You want them to go nuts or get fed up. Yes your ROI might go down compared to STT's but you'll be doubling your stake more often then not.

I played a 200$ HU match last weekend and made it last for 1 hour (1500 starting chips).it's all about grinding the bastards down..not about a quick double up.


hmmm rereading the above part about being greedy might sound a bit harsh (but I'm too lazy to retype it). I only post the above to help out..not to critisise.

Interesting point. I have never thought of a HU match as grinding people down, i really just take each hand as it comes. I wasn't trying to end the match but i was trying to win the most i could for the hand.


Don't worry about it, i know what you mean.

Boldie what is your win rate in HU games?

77% ATM...that's over the past month.

Thats quite high, how many games is that?

That's going to happen whether you bet or not. He's not going to fold a flopped flush draw.

178 played 135 won. (mind you, that's on various levels..and only on the very odd occasion do I venture above the 30$ level)

Yes Snoops,

What i meant was that if he called my flop bet i would more readily put him on a flush draw but his reraise made me think he had a made hand. If you check the flop, a club falls and he bets, what do you do? If you call here and then he bets again on the river, what do you do?

Also...I hardly play anything else...I some times play a sat to a bigger buy in tourney going on in the back ground but that's it. MTT's are not for me....I wish they were though

if you check the flop...he checks it but then you check the turn and he bets it you can stick a small re-raise in to see where you are..this guy (judging by the amount of chips he fired in would reraise you..probably all-in) you have no choice but to fold IMO and wait for a better opportunity to take him out.

I meant all your games.

I have position on him.

I have only been keeping track of my HU games as off 7 weeks ago. And this month is by far the most accurate % I have. I am actually not doing it for any particular reason other then everyone says you should and with the thought of turning pro (in a month or so depending on when I get paid for my last job) I thought it'd be a clever idea.

I have experienced the same learning curve as everyone has with HU, I guess. Painfully stupid in the beginning ( a few months ago) and after a while I found it to be my strenght...I stink at cash games and, like I said, no good at MTT's (well, I get double my stake back sometimes but that's not good enough).
HU seems to be the way to go for me.

Also I reckon 77% HU wins (in shootouts..I don't play cash HU) isn't really all that high. If you can't get over the high 60's/low 70's then HU isn't the way to go as the most you can do when playing HU is double your stake (minus the reg fee which is ussually between 8 and 10%).

yeah you are right of course...wasn't thinking there...at work..work puts me off writing coherent posts.

If you check the flop (after he checked it) and the club comes and he raises (he wouldn't stick that large a bet into a small pot as it would surely scare you off) say he bets 100. you could reraise him to find out where you are (300?) and fold if he bets heavily on the river or he moves all-in over you (then again..I would also move all-in over you if I had a weak ace and thought you would genuinely be scared of the flush). A flush is a tricky thing to put someone on especially when you have no other info to go on. (bets on the flop and all that). You did the right thing by betting the flop on a board with draws you would like to find out if someone might have them. (atleast I do)

Ok, thanks.

I know a few people who play HU's for a living and not one of them has a 77% rate, not one of them would say no to 65%

Your stats basically mean you should pass AK if you are showed A2! If you believe someone has a FD you shouldn't be getting it in!

I've played a few hundred and i think my % is to high and it its 66%

I expect you will find a downturn in the future, if you are quitting work on the proviso that you will be winning 77% all the time then my advice would be not to quit just yet!

I am not expecting it to be 77% for ever.. Mainly because I will also be moving up levels when I turn pro. Therefore won't have to have a ridiculously high% Ofcourse I am also playing weak opponents at the moment. I don't play the levels the pro's play and, as you will know, most amateurs don't really know how to play HU which makes them fairly easy pickings.

Always raising every time you have the button isn't a good idea for a lot of reasons. In fact when the blinds are small and not worth stealing you are better of always limping unless your oponent is an incredibly weak postflop player.

By limping you leave more room to meneuvre postflop, but if you commit to always bnutton raising you get yourself into trouble when the blinds get juicy since you're basically saying you're happy to raise with crap just because you have position. You're also giving up any chance you have of limp raising with big hands.

 :hello: Welcome to blonde.

Thanks for the comments.