blonde poker forum

They say all gamblers have tried it at some point, I was wondering how true this is?

You can check two boxes, one in the yes or no, the second conditional on what your answer was.

If you answer yes, please answer one of the options 4-7
If you answer no, please answer one of the options 9 or 10
If you fancy yourself as a funny bugger, feel free to check box 3 or 8.



For those unsure what the Martingale system is....

You play roulette, for example, and bet 1 unit on black.

If you lose, you bet 2 units next time
If you win, you have netted a 1 unit profit.

You bet 2 units on black...

If you lose, you bet 4 units next time
If you win, you have netted a 1 unit profit (-1+2)

You bet 4 units on black....

If you lose, you bet 8 units next time
If you win, you have netted a 1 unit profit (-1-2+4)

so on and so forth, till you run out of money, or win 1 unit.

Never heard of it so this means i'm not a degenerate yes?

Or have never been a degenerate yes. :)

Ah, i didn't realise it had a name.

I have to say i have never really enjoyed casino games (bore me to tears), but on a few occasions in the past i have accompanied a friend who loves the places.

Whilst there yes i did use this system, i would wait until there had been 5 consecutive BLACK numbers, then i would place £20 on RED, and it worked out to be very profitable (although no thrill)

I voted 'NO' but.....

Like lots of folk, I thought I'd invented the system. Fortunately I ran the idea past a Maths teacher friend of mine who quickly talked me out of using it.

if the tables didn't have a maximum bet limit then it would be worth doing.

Bankrolls are usually finite too

Every now and again I get talking to someone, mention that I play poker and they start telling me about this system to beat the casino games.
It is ALWAYS the martingale or a take on it.
Some people take a lot of convincing that it's bad and I'm not that great at explaining stuff so the conversation usualy ends with them still saying "yeah i know,,, but the chances of losing are almost impossible"  ;frustrated;

By the way....

'Martingales' are the little leather straps on swords to stop them flying out of your hand. I suppose then I use a Martingale system quite often  :D

"I came up with it myself, thought I was invincible and it nearly ruined me"


Back in my heavier gambling days, i managed to run it upto £80 on red. I was so nervous it would lose, because if that lost i would have had to withdraw £160 from my bank as i had no more cash. It started with a tenner and i was sure i couldnt lose.

Luckily, i won on £80, but i promised myself never again.

I said no to the system, I do have a system though not structured exactly.
I spell out the word of the day one letter at a time with each spin.

I know guys with very deep pockets who use something similiar on the gg's.

u decide you want say $100 profit for the day.
u bet the amount that will give u said profit depending on the price. i.e if its 10-1 u need to bet $10
if the horse wins your done for the day, if it loses you are now down $10 and have to change your stake accordingly.
so next race the horse u fancy is 2-1 so u have to bet $55 again if u win u pocket the $100
if u lose again your now down $65 so now u need to win $165 and so on...

the guys i know who do this are loaded so i dont know why they even bother as a hundred a day is not really worth the bother. they say it keeps them interested!!???

btw they were once in the hole for over 23000 chasing 8 days money

however if u can handle the ridiculous swings, in other words you dont rreally need the money, it works

give it a go, nice way to spend those poker profits. anyway spending all your time in front of your pc is unhealthy, get down the bookies NOW.

I've used the Martingale system on Greyhounds, overall i won more than I lost but I did take a hammering a couple of times and had to reduce my bet sizes and build up again slowly. I would use it along with some other criteria too though.

Basically if the dog was the most favoured by the racing post website, and it was the bookies favourite it would qualify as one to bet on, otherwise, look at the next race. ( I also tried using some trap No based probability stuff too)

It was quite fun and frantic because there are greyhound races during the day and evening and usually 4 venues running simultaneously. So I would sit at my PC with multiple bookies sites and betfair open checking odds and multiple copies of the racing post site open at different pages (one for each venue I was following) So the time induced panic of tracking your races, finding the next qualifying dog and the thrill of watching the text commentry from the race, whilst updating your spreadsheet and re-calculating bet sizes made it quite fun.

Most of the time my starting bet on a sequence of races would be equal to the minimum bet on the particular bookie (e.g. Betfair £2). If I went through a losing streak of say 7 losers in a row and the bets were getting too scary I would split the sequence in two or three and start say 3 new sequences at 1/3 of what the next big bet on the original sequence had been. It gets very scary if you have lots of losses and have multiple open losing sequences though.

I must conclude this and say I was doing this at small stakes and I was doing it mainly as a test to see if it could work as a system. The fact that I haven't done this in over a year should tell you something  ;D I ended up a bit, but came so close to disaster a few times.

In my opinion.... martingale systems are fun and can work sometimes..... but in the longterm you will lose your bankroll bigtime. When you also take into account the fact that you have a finite bankroll and there will be upper limits on the size of bets you can place imposed by the bookie, I have to conclude that they are not a viable long term profit system.

I'd love somebody to prove wrong though !!!

the martingale system essentially promotes people playing outside their bankroll.
If you have 4000 dollars you simply shouldn't bet 200$. and chasing losses is always a bad thing

wow what a dangerous system. Surely anyone with a brain couldnt follow this. It just seems to take balls not brains and as mentioned surely cannot be considered a viable system. Then again im not stupid enough to play roulette in the first place!

Mathematically, and assuming unlimited bankroll, it is a correct and viable system on a straight 50/50 like red/black and can't be argued with except for this point by UptheMariners, which is the only real reason why it can never work; balls and gambling spirit have nothing to do with it.  Also, roulette has a '0' which makes it even less feasible...

I once got a free £25 bet from William Hill when I opened a poker account to use in their casino.  The catch was I had to wager £750 to cash it out.  I really had nothing better to do, so I put £1 on their roulette red/black, doubling when losing and dropping back to minimum when winning.  I was lucky and after just a million hours of doing this tedious thing I cashed out £220, although I would have been happy just to get my free pony.  That's been my only flirtation with any of these games and it stopped being fun around the 400th £1 wager, although free money is free money... :)

Oh, and I was doubly lucky because I never had to double beyond £32, which would have brought this experiment to a quick end.

It is a fallacy that the balance between red and black is maintained over a short period of time.  It is not, like blacjack, subject to continuous probability i.e. what comes up in one instance does not affect what comes up in another.  It's 'reset' if you like every time.  I have seen people with little pieces of paper recording numbers and colours in casinos, but unless they discover that the wheel itself has some kind of imbalance affecting the probability of the ball landing in a specific area, it's a terrible waste of time.

But congrats to anyone that can leave a casino with a profit on the table games!

I concur with you entirely: My main point was I only ever visited the Casino rarely, when i did i had a set amount of cash in my wallet (no credit cards) which i was prepared to LOSE for the evenings entertainment.

I believe there is NO system that works, but in my own perverse way of thinking, i felt that if 5 continous numbers of the same colour came up then it couldnt continue forever, (law of averages lol), i didnt win 1st time every time, but i never had to go past 3 double ups (obviously got lucky), and on each visit (probably 6 at the most) i left with a tidy profit.

I am the 1st to admit that if i felt this was a GREAT system then i would go broke very quickly.

This common belief is known as the Gambler's Fallacy - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambler%27s_Fallacy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambler%27s_Fallacy)

It wasn't something I read about (although I voted in the wrong box on a poll I made ::) ), like a couple of others, I came up with the idea myself, and believed it to be infallibe. I'll admit to using this sytem, losing £64 bets left right and centre, always struggling to get another stake together.
Kept going after those £127 stakes, and within a few months, did a lot of damage. Stopped before I got completely out of control, it could have easily gotten much worse though.


Hey, we were all 17 once. Yeah you're right though, I was an idiot (maybe I still am) but the lights were so flashy on those terminals.


I wouldn't want any young kid I know to make a similar mistake. What would be the best way to concisely explain the pitfalls of this ruinous system?

point to TK and say "He used the system and is only 23"?

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I wouldn't want any young kid I know to make a similar mistake. What would be the best way to concisely explain the pitfalls of this ruinous system?
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Win a little, win a little, win a little, LOSE A LOT

Didn't work on me at the time. Couldn't see past those three win a littles.

If you visit theSpeilbank Hamburg casino website they have a link to all numbers spun in their casinos. There are regular runs of 13/14 reds blacks,odd/ evens and High/Low.

Apparently in Sheffields Owlerton casino in the 80's there was a run of 30+.

http://www.spielbank-hamburg.de/spielsaal/permanenzen.php4?tid=9&tag_tag=30&tag_mon=04&tag_jahr=2003&button.x=50&button.y=2

Then maybe it would be an idea to get them to imagine they are running a casino. Would they want punters to use this system?

Many years ago when I was at uni, someone came up with the reverse martingale system on the bonkers assumption that as the martingale system didn't work doing the opposite must.  i.e always betting on the colour that had just won.  It didn't work.

Incidentally I think that the record for one colour coming up consecutively is 35 or something like that.  Following the martingale system you would have to bet 34 thousand million on the next roll....

Tried that one too ::)

Like Jen, the only time I've dabbled with roulette has been online with 'free' money.

The first time, I did a quick google for "roulette system" and found this - http://casino.oddschecker.com/casino-game-system/system/12-6-roulette-system

I took their $20 upto $100 using it and then used to play poker on their site for while.

On another couple of occasions I've shown a decent profit before getting greedy and losing it all back... and a couple of times just lost the free money straight away!!

I worked in casinos for 12 years and never saw anyone win using this system.

I saw many try. I saw many win small amounts regularly. I saw them all crash and burn.

The min/max spread is usually set so that after 8 consecutive losses the total loss is irretrievable in one bet.

During the Brighton festival 1 of the wheels came up 34 5 times in a row, the casino lost a fair chunk on the 5th!

One of the croupiers told me he once spun 24 and 28 in turn for 14 spins! He was gutted as it doesnt count for any records as it was 2 diffrent numbers.

Interesting

SYSTEMS SMISHTEMS.

Listen closely I will say this only once.

"There is no system ever invented that has worked or indeed could work.If there had been, then the whole gambling world would implode ,out ,of existence."

Trust me I've tried all of them.Read many books on the subject, from the "How I broke the bank of Monte Carlo" to the learned text book type tome.

They are all the same and connot work. Spend your thinking time on higher thoughts.......................I've done all the thinking for you over the years, don't bother.












Except........

There IS a system on the dogs, which is spoken of in a whispered tone. that comes around every thirty years or so. This system does work, but anyone who attempts to re-use it is crushed, by Messrs HILL CORAL LaDBROKE Et AL.

I'd like to pass the system on to you all, but my life would not be allowed to continue.

Now.............................All you bright young things should put your minds to cracking this particular code. Cos sure as eggs are eggs, someone WILL try this system again.

Next time you see me ,Just ask,and I'll show you the scars from when I last used this system, but beware, think of the hell I've had to suffer knowing the secret.

OOOh - intrigue.........

Thankyou for the honest voting.

Interesting results.

-ev gambooling is for idiots anyway, that's why we play poker instead (doesn't include newmanseye as he's -ev for poker too)

Or for people who just want to have some fun.

hence why its possible to profit from poker, the play-for-fun fish (idiots)

when you play roulette you are the casinos fish, pwnpwnpwn

and?

If you want to have some fun does it matter if it costs you money?

I'll ask billy/newmanseye next home game and get back to you.

where is he btw?

I profit from poker largely due to bad players thinking they are good players and just 'unlucky'

Like i say though the wheel is a bit of fun, i play for the smallest stake possible and i play very rarely but there is fun to be had and well worth the price!

its a great game, as many casino games are, if you have discipline. Terribe game if ur weak minded!

The Party Poker Blackjack bonuses lend themselves to a Martingale derivative system.

you get $100 bonus (only wager on /bj) - this usually has a 1000x work rate BUT if you join the bj table and make a profit. You then witdraw to your account Your profit is then yours and untouched when you rejoin the bj table so.. what you do is:

1] Get BJ strategy chart from wizardofoddz.com (its a well known standard strategy losing less than 0.5% per hand)

2] join BJ table:

2] bet $1 if lose bet $3 if lose bet $5 If win at any point cashout

4] When you rejoin then start at $1 again

5] Keep going until you bust (need 5 or six successive losses)

The reason this works is because a) its not your money b) the only way you can get the core money is through WR (BJ is very boring)  3] Party allow you to trim off profits in this manner.




 

Agree


Fail to see how this is aided by any kind of system.

Ahh, I see it now.

I'd still punt the bonus in one hand.

the EV wont be much different, and I'll save an hour.

i cant see it. can you explain little more simply.....

I have seen red come up 18 times consecutively in a casino on the Roulette. I don't play roullette because it scares the bejesus out of me, but the mad Chinese around the table were getting madder by the spin.....

I wonder what the record is????

You get 100 to punt, when its gone its gone.

You play to win a quid, utilizing martingale.

When you win, you exit.

Go back and punt the 100 again, in search of another quid.

Repeat until you lose the 100, you'll still have all those quids you won (however many that was) you can go punt these won quids on poker (I think, if I've read the post right)

Shoot till you miss, guaranteed profit, all very attractive.

Probable waste of time EV wise though, punt the bonus and get back to work.

Cheers Mate

This made me LOL because I went through the same phasea few years ago,  ended up shi*ting myself when I had to put excessive amounts on. I was playing online roulette at the time..and like you, I ended up winning. It never worked in a real casino for some reason....I used to slowly build up a stack of ponies playing blackjack for 2 hours+..then blow the lot on roulette within 10 minutes!..and leave feeling sick. ;frustrated;  At least I can look back and laugh....

When you do this it takes about ten minutes (unless you're really unlucky - or really lucky)

Mathematically its hard but one way of looking at it:

The probability that you bust out (and stop being able to wager) is higher the bigger the bet you make. If you make a very small bet then because you make so many bets (your standard deviation  goes as root number of hands) - then you are less likely to bust out. (OK the number of hands guarantee a loss rate but this is the other end of the risk/return)

If you double up on a big bet you have to decide what to do. Triming profits is a good thing (i.e take your $100) you just cant keep doubling up...only a  loony would keep staking what he has just won.. until he bust.

It turns out you need to play about 30-50 hands to reduce the probability of busting but keep your work rate reasonable. The above system does this.

Its not a big effect but it adds a few more percentage points.

Key to all this is the bust out or trim profits effect - it adds a little bit of a funny in the maths (not vast amounts).  So the idea of averages and statistical deviation (which assume linear effects) crumble a little.

This is not a system for getting rich. is does a couple of things:

1] gives you a few more percent given the right casino set up.
2] Means you play about 30 hands of BJ - this is usually enough for me :)

I stress this ONLY works for Party type setups where you can trim profits. Most casinos don't operate like this.

Blackjack is my casino game of choice and my staking system is a knid of anti-martingale.

My local casino has a £2 minimum and £200 maximum.

Starting at £2 I will play 2 boxes (the last 2 if possible) and follow basic strategy and always stake £2 on a losing box.

The winning streaks are where you punish the house with their own cash.

You can (and I have) hit the maximum bet after 10 consecutive winning hands.

I stake like this :-

(Always dropping the losing box back to £2)

£2, £4, £8, £12, £18, £27, £40, £60, £90, £135, £200

The key is to always play consistently, don't let a £135 bet stop you from hitting 14 against a 10.

Nothing like a juicy £90 double 11 against a 5 to get the heart pumping!

Do you believe that this is a winning system? Or is it just a fun way to play?

I was a casino dealer on and off for about 7 years so I know there is only one winner!

I employ this system to pass the time before the poker starts and I have troubled the cashiers desk for some sealed packets after a good run!

Although, over the long run, I'm sure I must be a losing player.

But I enjoy it!

FFS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :pop:  This is a proven winning system going back to the 60s so i doubt your pal invented it.

The guy called it the reverse labouche system i think, I read the book he wrote on it some years later after he was barred from every major casino in Europe but i cant find it now and people think i'm crazy, drunk or lying when i tell them about it, I concede that at any given time i'm drunk,crazy or lying but i'm telling the truth this time!!

The guy had teams of players working on a table and adopting this system they followed "progressions" instead of chasing them, increasing their bets in uneven increments according to his mathematical convoluted system, essentially he was trying to make the casino play against his team that had taken over a whole table.

He said he always declared to the management that he had a system and was always welcomed until he ruined casino after casino.

The book was called "Breaking the bank" I found it credible because it was more a an autobiography than a mathematical exposition.

I cant remember exactly what the mathematics entailed because i lost the book ages ago but i'm going to investigate.

IT WORKS!!! IT'S PROVEN!!!!!!

Sounds like you've got a bit mixed up but are referring to the MIT team

they played ROULETTE in the 60s did they?

the reverse labouche is the only proven roulette system ever. i and my aquaintances successfully used it on betting shop roulette machines until even money selections were increased to 1 pound minimums and payout on a spin were capped

Exactly, ty

we did the same thing, was about 5-6 years ago now, i cant remember the mathmatics though and i lost the book.

well its all about the math!! i would explain here how it works but there are some online casinos which are still user friendly to the system so whilst that is the case no explanation and i suggest you try very hard to remember the method or offer to me sufficent remunaration for which ill happily explain all !

I was thinking about that actually

pm on its way ;)

Am I thinking of the same mob, wrote a book called the Utopian Casino? Basically bought a roulette table and build electronic doo-dahs that would predict which segment the ball would land in from timings taken mid-spin. Had a few runs but bailed out in the end.

I'll sell my system for 12 grand.

Are you thinking about the Easern European mob from a few months back, they did alright didnt they untill they got nicked?

Cant remember whether or not they got a not guilty though, I think it was a civil action in the end and they had to pay the dough back but i'm not sure.

Nah, same idea though, the MIT lot had foot-tappers and buzzers strapped to their bodies whereas they're using lazers and whatnot these days. Their book was a good read though.

Thats not the same MIT team that Andy Block was in then. They just got done for counting cards didnt they!