blonde poker forum

Hi all,

Just back friom Southend, & trying to keep on top of the e-mails before I come out to play on the Forum, but thanks to our Ace on the spot reporter, Red-Dog, here's a few chip counts at he first break. They began with 3.5k (plus "double chance" second tranche of 3.5k), and there were a whopping 126 entries.

Snoppy 12.5k

Simon Nowab - OUT (his AA ac ad trumped by  ks kh)

Burnley John 10k

Womble 14k

Rumit 5k

Andy Gomm 2k

Hot-Dog 8k

I Know It 15k

Big Trevor Reardon 10k

Karabiner 6k

Red Dog 7k

Malcolm Harwood 6k

Jo Handman 2k

Ben Callanin 3k

Greek jack 2k

Phil Peters 13.5k

Micky Wernick 15k

Steve Read 11.5k (he beat The Belly's  asp ah with  kh  kc)

Lawrence Gosney 10k

Des Bling Bling Jonas 13k

Tom has promised me more chip counts later, so long as he remains in the comp. Don't hold your breath, eh?

Busted, 10 minutes before the end (don't want to talk about it)

unlucky Red.............will you say if snoppy etc. are still in?

Players that I saw still in as I made my exit are

Bling Blind Des

Snoopy

Lucy Rocach

Lawrence Gosney

karribiner

Phil peters

Big Trevor

Ellias Katzi

and some geezer who calls 10k all in bets with  kc ts

And, err, did the geezer who calls 10k all-in bets with K-T happen to bust you Red.......?

Good to hear snonpy is stil in.

I refer the honourable gentleman to my previous post

I'm out by the way.

Hadn't raised too many hands recently so thought I'd limp utg with   ac kc and move all-in if some1 raised. That all happened. Unfortunately, the chap called my reraise with his  ad jd and hit.

1 jack on the flop was cheeky. the second was just plain rude.  :(

Bugger.  :(


Malc got it worse than me. He had around 12k. Reraised a pf raiser with  ad ah. Flop came  qc qh ts. Malc moved in. Opponent called and showed.  8c 8d.  ??? ??? ??? Rivered an  8s. Ouch.

Still in:

Karabiner
Lawrence G
Micky Wernick
Lucy Rokache
I Know It
Phil Peters

Big TR out just be4 end.

Nice to meet ifm at last. Top bloke.

Good to see the rest of the gang again.

 :)

AA was cracked at least 6 times to my knowledge, I was one of the crackers with tc ts

U2 snippy, i really wanted to play this but i just knew the luck was against me today.
How many return tomorrow?

Have u recovered yet?

I still feel deflated?

about 40 I think.

snippy?!  :o :o :o

wow!!!!
joking ain't ya?
how many entrants?
it'll go on all night

no joke. 3am finish whatever the number.

They start at 1pm tomorrow from I what I understand.

Prob take them all day.

are Burnley john and Womble still in ??

Simon and Burnley went out early.

Simon very early. He was on my table.

Remind me what womble looks like and  I may be able to tell u.

Womble is Steve Walmsley,  hard to describe him really ... not much help i know lol

Is he bald?

My bad beat 'downs' only last about 5 minutes as a rule, lifes too short

Cheer up, who wants a soggy Snoopy?

We stayed in a little b&b in Sarfend, it wasn't up to much but it did the job, when we checked in there was a fat Greek bloke in the front room, sprawled on a sofa playing poker online, he didnt seem very interested when I told him we were down for the comp. Then next morning he ran up to me, grabbed my arm and said "bloody hell, you missed it, we had Dave Colclough in here last night"

I'm sure he grabbed Dave's arm too and said, "bloody hell, you missed it, we had RED-DOG in here this morning"

Just got back. It's 3pm ko tomorrow.

I think there are about 38 left, and I would estimate c23k is average.

I have 16800, Lucy has about double that and Micky W has similar to me.

Gozza looked to have a healthy stack too.

good luck tomorrow, Karbiner.

Thank's for the updates, & unlucky, spoony.

spoony, soopy, snoppy, sonopy?


Even I'm not sure what I'm called anymore...

 :-\ >:?

Don't forget snippy.

suppose it's better than Chesney.  ;D

i like spoony, but i think it has to be snoppy ;D

Birmingham City FC is now officially staying in Room 101.

And anymore of this snoppy businnes and you, Tom Burns, Steve Bruce, and any more bluenoses can go in there too.  >:D

 ;) :D

what are you playing in a £10 stt online :o how can he call that? would anybody else?

Question is what sort of fish pushes in on a QQT flop with AA first to speak?

Any Ideas whats happening today at Walsall £300



Regards

M

Yup, mini-update in 30 seconds M Power.

Lucy Rokach 60,000

Phil Peters 70,000

Karabiner 60,000

Lawrence Gosney 80,000 - probably chip leader.

There are 21 left, 20 get paid.

Karabiner just had a bit of bad luck, big pot, his  ah ks  v ac  2h  , board paired twice, split pot!

More news in a moment......

Karabiner tells me the comp is on an unscheduled break right now due to a prolonged & "messy" dispute/ruling.

No doubt the details will emerge later, but on a board summat like  ks kh kd 3d 4d the pot was awarded to the wrong guy, then the cards wre mucked. Everyone knows the pot went to the wrong person, and it's the "cards speak" issue. Lucy - NOT involved in the hand - is arguing strongly on the basis of "cards speak".

By the way, Lucy & Mr Gosney, both chipped up, are on the same table. There may be troubles, ahead.........

Had the same dispute last night, flush v full house, pot awarded to flush, cards mucked, decision stood

That's EXACTLY the problem right now as I understand it Red.

Cards speak v cards mucked = dead..

IMHO dealers should highlight winning hand by pushing three cards up from the board

This underlines what we were saying about casinos fielding dealers before they have had enough training

Not sure if this is the one that RED-DOG is referring to, but I also recall a disturbance with a full house v flush hand.

One guy all-in with flush draw. The other lad had 2 pair. River is an 8s. Gives the all-in player a flush, but the caller a full house.

He declares he has a full house. The dealer pushes the chips towards the flush man.

3 or 4 players then shout out 'no. full house'. The dealer appears to ignore them and decides to muck all the cards and start shuffling for the next hand.

The guy with the full house is dumbfounded and asks for a ruling. Lucy gives the 'cards speak' line.

Card room manager comes over and rules that the guy with the flush should get the pot because the cards have been mucked.

The dealer remians silent. So does the player who held the losing hand.

Bizarrely  ::) the player with the full house doesn't accept the ruling and complains further. A few other players back him up.

Then, after talking with Dani, the cardroom manager changes his minds and gives the pot to the full house.

oh dear, he changed his mind and gave it to the other fella.
That IS a big problem, if they start reversing decisions they are asking for arguments.
The rule at walsall is that once they are mucked that's it, simple even if it is unfair.

What good is a rule thats unfair? even if it is simple, why not just give the pot to the biggest bloke?

OMG, I was in a bad mood. Now I'm laughing. Stop it Red.

cos I'd never win.  :(

the point was if they start reversing decisions there will quickly be arguments over every decision, you have to any decision is final or anarchy will rule.
There is no point tring to say that it's better this way because even if it is it doesn't apply

Although I don't agree with changing your mind half way through an arguement, if an additional fact had come to light (and i don't know the circumstances) in the interest and spirit of the game sometimes we do reverse our own rulings. Even though I don't see eye to eye with Dani, he would have been put in a position to make a decision. Whichever route he takes in this situation, he would have listened to both sides and made his own judgement (rightly Or wrongly) But his judgement stands. The last rule of any card room is.....The decision of the management is Final.  :)up

Most decisions are judged on their own merit. Snoopy says that before the pot was awarded people had already noticed that the full house had won and told the dealer. If the dealer chose to ignore the players advice and did not double check the winning hands, then IMO Dani made the right judgement. And I would be referring the dealer back to the pit for the next training school.

Anyone know what's happening in the £300


Regards

M


 

I've never ever ever seen a dealer look so bored.

He was clearly in a world of his own.

 :o were you dealing sopony ? ;)

Probably the scenario where the dealer doesn't want to be in the card room then. Some dealers deliberately mess up because they don't like the card room. GET THEM OUT!!! put the people in, that are interested in the game. This saves US time and energy!!!

:-O Kev.

Certainly not. I'm always on the ball.  ::)


Unfortunatley, I'm a shocking dealer as I seem to have shaky hand syndrome. I'm also a clumsy bugger who can't shuffle.

Karabiner cut the S*** How did you get on
I Think you got 5th


regards

M

Who are u asking?

And what do you mean about Karabiner? Has he cashed?

on the phone to him now LIVE

4th

regards

M

Well played Ralph, mind you, it was an easy field  ::) ::)

cool

that's gr8 news.

A man on form.

Nice job, Karabiner.

 *g *g *g *g *g

Just got back finished 4th for a nice £2700 payday.

3 left, Lucy has about 450k, Lawrence 250k and Phil Peters 75kish.

In the controversial coup, the ruling was that the cards "spoke" after they had been mucked and the pot awarded to the wrong "winner"

As you can imagine there was plenty of bad feeling, which was unavoidable given the situation.


Oddly enough, my exit or rather, crippling hand had an odd similarity to it.

Just after 9pm we took a short break and were then informed that the final table (four of us) were being moved
so that they could start the 9.15 £25 tourney. We were moved from the back of the card-room with no spectators
to the gallery, by the rail and the stairs.

Blinds are 4k/8k and I make it 23k to playwith KhTh. Lucy and Phil fold, Lawrence calls.

Flop is K J T.

Lawrence moves allin for about 100k, I call pretty quick, and it comes brick, brick.

Lawrence turns his cards over and taps the table.

A voice calls out from the stairwell "Lawrence you have a flush".

He turns his cards back face up and sure enough his Js7c had made a runner-runner fflush which neither of us or the dealer had seen.

Next hand I was the BB and Lawrence raised with KT (a little spooky) and I call for my remaining 23k with J8.

He rivered a straight after I had flopped a J.


But the previous hand left me with a bit of a sour taste after thinking that I had won.
Obviously I wouldn't want to win a pot that was not mine, but I'm sure you guys understand how I felt.

All in all not a bad weekend though, and the drive home was both fast and theraputic.

 :)up   

Ralph

Wow £2700 a good result £4.2k Gross  against quality players, if SAGA ever got into Poker
I think you'll be on to a winner with sponsorship. You and Tikay.

I hear your older than Tikay ;D and about the hand with Lawrence well regardless of how it was done
he was in front, so don't let it bother you  too much

WELL PLAYED  :)up

Regards

M

 





 

Well played Karabiner, didnt realise one of the spectators had shouted flush, if thats true, which im not disputing by the way, is disgraceful and let me say you handled it with total class. Even shaking Lawrences hand after you were knocked out the next hand.

The dispute earlier was handled well by Dani and I believe the correct decision was made.
The hands were KJ, vs 99. The board read K,3 ,9, 3, 3.
The pot was originally given to the KJ. Ithink lawrence commented that actually the 99 win, but somehow the cards were still mucked by the dealer.  Every one on the table saw the hands so there really was no doubt who had won. This is where it gets tricky and the tough decision had to be made,but in reality everyone saw the hand and was in no doubt so I think Dani made a good and fair decision.
Why should a player be penalised for a dealer error, just cause the cards were mucked, when everyone was a witness. There must be this type of concession to compensate for dealer error, so that the player is protected at all times.
I came to the conclusion tonight that there should be cameras above every poker table as in roulette, so the disputes similar to these can be easily rectified, regardless of the cries " but the cards have been mucked, so I win "
Well done Dani. 

Slightly concerning that the exact same mistake was made twice, with the dealer mucking the cards on both occasions.

How did u get on, I KNOW IT?

Out after about 20 mins today, had about 12k,  blinds are  600   1200  find AK early position raise 4500, get re raised by SB, call for my last 7500, and he turns over AA. That was it really. Probably get away from hand if I had a decent stack.

that move is common now and is known as "the ironside"

Delighted foir blondeite Karabiner. He's on a roll.

Saga as a possible sponsor for him & me? Sorry, I am in negotiations with Stannah. "Why not Raise with Stannah, the AA of Stair Lifts".

yeah they are looking for someone to replace thora hurd :)

Give these people a call, you might be just the man they are looking for

http://www.arizona.free-online.co.uk/

Ha bloody ha Red. Anyway, how come you know of these peeps?

Decided to look them up after sharing a table with you, I have a nose for these things

Dani didnt change his mind >:D
        when they asked for a ruling it seemed straight forward enough, thats why i stated the hand was dead, then the true facts came to light both players and the rest of the table agreed that the player with the full house won the pot, so there was no decrepancey with the hand, if there was then i would of killed the hand.

what took the time was the sorting of the pot has the player had pulled the in to a messy bundle.
after speaking with the 2 players away for the table the pot then was easily reconstructed
        
        my aim when i run the cardroom is to run it fairly and look after the players interested. ( as most of u guys know) thats the only concern of mine.

We know that, never thought otherwise, some of the dealers could use a little more training/vetting though, very hard for them if they are in at the deep end, or worse, don't want to be there

dont worry red dog there all in for some extra training. this happening twice is totally unacceptable.

By the way thanks DIK for your kind words. was quite unexpected :)up

No problem, just saying as it is. People think that as card room managers we make rules to suit ourselves, and don't realise that our job primarily is to uphold the integrity and the spirit of the game. We make rulings that contradict ourselves (or so it seems) as each situation is different from another. As with most things in the cardroom, the rules are guidelines for us to work off. Sometimes it takes bollox to go against a rule, knowing that some wise ass will read it straight off a wall !!!

Grosvenor Walsall have introduced the following in the wake of this dispute...

1) All dealers will now push up the cards (as suggested by someone in this thread). This has been / is being communicated to all staff and has the 100% support of both Zak & Dani in the cardroom - therefore it WILL be enforced. Also they'll be reviewing the procedures currently used.

2) Dani & Zak will be conducting a review of dealers' knowledge of rules and procedures, and be conducting regular scheduled monitoring of them. The results of the monitoring will be fed-back to the dealers, and identified training needs will be covered asap.

Regarding cameras: A camera+microphone has recently (early hours of Sunday morning) been installed on the main cashgame table (Gallery Cardroom next to steps), and plans are afoot to add a camera on the most commonly used final table in the main cardroom (this would have been done on Sunday morning as well, but hey-ho).

Regarding the Ruling: I was in two minds with regards to this ruling, but having heard the whole story (corroborated from several sources), I believe it to be the correct decision. This is based on the fact that the winning hand was declared by several players BEFORE the hand was mucked, and that all players involved agreed who'd won. Rules can appear very black and white on paper, but any competent Cardroom Manager HAS to have the ability to make the "grey" decision.

I have to take my hat off to the guys at walsall.

I dont know the exact circumstances and am only goin off what i was told and hats written in this thread but as stated its the correct ruling. Good to see someone else highlighting the fact supervisors have to make "grey" decisions and use their brain to come up with the correct rulings. The fact walsall are making positive steps to stop this happning again involving training and  evaluations is a brilliant idea, if only their colleagues in Blackpool could have the same attitude (and no i'm not talking about Yogi lol)

Good move all round kudos to you  :)up

What he said - let's hear it for Walsall.

Agreed, big respect to the Walsall crew.

 :)up