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Title: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Mark S. on September 30, 2005, 10:55:24 AM ...but when some guy called Simon Young gets a job writing articles about poker in the SUN newspaper (http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2005450000-2005450333,00.html) it really is time to take stock of just how demented our game has become.
On one hand you have the likes of Dave U, Harry D, Joe B, Barney B, Dave C et al doing their best to promote the game is a positive manner and on the next you have another muppet 'newbie' (Simon Young in this case) giving out the viirtues of how great it is that he's only been playing poker for 6 months and he's already on a European tour! For those of us that have served an apprentice in the game I get real pissed off at the jokers who come into the game and pretend its soooooo easy to do and anyone can do what they do if they only had the dough and a national newspaper to back them! Well duh!! Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 11:03:18 AM good luck to him, if he's got the chutzpah to persuade News International to bankroll him on the EPT then well done
He, and with it Murdoch's money, is likely to be dead money so why not embrace it and encourage even more of these people with unlimited, if temporary, bankrolls in the game It's the same with most of the celebs...I might not want to watch Celebrity Poker meets Peter Andre wife swapping whilst making over my garden with Laurence Llewellyn Bowen on ITV1 at 12.30am, but until they get good (Helen Chamberlain, Michael Greco these days) I want them in my comps or my cash game Snobbery costs money UKPoker, be inclusive and get their dough quietly, you'll be alright! Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: ariston on September 30, 2005, 11:04:14 AM Disgraceful how a player with no track record can get sponsorship and write a column in a national newspaper. What next for the poker nobodies- book deals maybe? Bet within 6 months hes starting 38 new threads a day on internet poker forums. ;)
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: AdamM on September 30, 2005, 11:06:47 AM there is NO apprenticeship to the game. I've been playing 5 years and am still slogging it out in the sub-£50 comps. you make it sound like this guys has less right to play / win a big comp than me and in turn I have less right than you. you put your money up and take your shot. if the money is coming from a newpaper, an online poker site sponsorship or sales of a book, it's no business of anyones opponents. if he's good enough he'll win, if he's not he'll loose. If you're not good enough to beat players this new to the game, you're not good enough period.
good luck to him Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: byronkincaid on September 30, 2005, 11:08:35 AM Why hate? The geezers blagged his way onto the EPT. I'd try to do the same if I was a journalist. Not too different from say a young Jeremy Clarkson blagging his way into driving around in nice cars all day. Hopefully he'll be able to convey the excitment of Poker to the Sun readership and it'll lead to more beginners playing. The Sun seems to be promoting poker quite a lot. They even had a photo of some muppet who calls himself byronkincaid in their centre pages the other day. (BTW If anyone has played Ray Parlour could you let me know if he's any good please?)
If he does well it might lead to another Big Deal or Positively 5th Street kind of book. Good luck to him. Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 11:13:03 AM Why hate? The geezers blagged his way onto the EPT. I'd try to do the same if I was a journalist. Not too different from say a young Jeremy Clarkson blagging his way into driving around in nice cars all day. Hopefully he'll be able to convey the excitment of Poker to the Sun readership and it'll lead to more beginners playing. The Sun seems to be promoting poker quite a lot. They even had a photo of some muppet who calls himself byronkincaid in their centre pages the other day. (BTW If anyone has played Ray Parlour could you let me know if he's any good please?) If he does well it might lead to another Big Deal or Positively 5th Street kind of book. Good luck to him. Ray Parlour is a hopeless gambler (horses/poker/the lot)....loose, aggresive. These days though he's not on the sauce as much, so it takes him longer to do his dosh. This is gained from playing against him once in a charity do. I am extrapolating that he plays this way all the time, so don't take it as 100% gospel Not as good as Sheringham, as bad as Etherington. Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: byronkincaid on September 30, 2005, 11:15:02 AM Thanks TightEnd.
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 11:18:38 AM OK, Here's why you want celebs in your game (as texted to me this morning)
EPT media event last night A pot with Moneymaker and John McCririck, the racing pundit Board is asp kc qd jc th Moneymaker bets on the end McCririck, thinks, thinks some more and folds Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: AdamM on September 30, 2005, 11:19:55 AM beautiful
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 11:30:50 AM I, myself, am probably around the 80-85% mark in correct decision making but the poker gods would have us believe thats not good enough...and it isn't. Mark, Adam is just starting up a small business. I would suspect he would love to play bigger events but has other priorities. Please don't assume it is a lack of ability on his behalf As to the statement I have highlighted...I am just stepping outside the tent now, and I may be some time P.S Have a look at www.Shuffleupshirts.com. Buy a t-shirt. Make someone happy. thanks Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: AdamM on September 30, 2005, 11:34:26 AM Adam...have you ever stopped to wonder WHY it is you're still playing in the sub £50 comps? Do you WANT to play in the £100-£500 comps? Whats stopping you? you cheeky shit, how dare you? you know nothing about my game or my circumstances. I started playing live Jan 2004 and haev had a lot of nice results at the level I'm playing at. In that time I've lost one job through stress, another through redundancy and have had a second child arrive. before the second job loss I'd moved to a larger house to accomodate the growing family and so, having lost the second job any bank roll I had was plundered to feed the family. as soon as I win any money it goes straight into the bills account. I'm grindind while I get my business up and running, then I intend to take on bigger games where, I have some belief, my game will hold up. It's that kind of sharp poorly thought out response that makes it difficult for normally friendly guys like me and my fellow blondites to resist flaming you when we would not normally do so. watch your mouth Mark Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: AdamM on September 30, 2005, 11:35:20 AM thanks T E
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: action man on September 30, 2005, 11:37:44 AM get that chip off your shoulder mark
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 11:38:20 AM I sort of anticipated your response Adam, mine would have been the same
Adam, do me a favour? count to ten thousand and leave it there please Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: AdamM on September 30, 2005, 11:39:06 AM deep breaths, remain calm.
I am at one with the world and relax Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 11:40:16 AM good man
ta ;) Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Heid on September 30, 2005, 11:40:47 AM Tighty,
Be careful out there, see if Tony has some mint cake :) Oh and make sure you have a coat on :) Are your pants clean? What if you get in an acccident?! As for everyone else, I will be doing some deep breathing, and I want you all to join in :) Ohhmmmm! Heid xx Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 11:42:46 AM Tighty, Be careful out there, see if Tony has some mint cake :) Oh and make sure you have a coat on :) Are your pants clean? What if you get in an acccident?! sorry, this is over my head, please explain Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Nem on September 30, 2005, 11:43:37 AM there is NO apprenticeship to the game. I've been playing 5 years and am still slogging it out in the sub-£50 comps. Adam...have you ever stopped to wonder WHY it is you're still playing in the sub £50 comps? Do you WANT to play in the £100-£500 comps? Whats stopping you? I always wondered if you took a player of B+ - A ability (if we assume that Daniel N is A+ and Simon Young is D) and gave him a year playing on the professional tour fully funded would that player make a profit or not? Well for the majority of us its life itself that prevents us from playing in these bigger comps. For those lucky enough to be funded by various on-line sites you'd think that they'd play better than us that play in the $10-$50 tournaments...but they don't! Why is that? I believe that the turn of a card can have life changing effects on all of us. Ask Harry D how he felt about being knocked out of the WSOP 2004 on the turn of a card. From being one card away from a possible $5M he had to settle for a miserable $147k (miserable in his mind). To be a consistent winner in poker you have to analyse every single hand you play and play it the best way you can whether it be call, fold or raise. For 99% of us its an impossibility but thats not to say we shouldn't keep on trying. I, myself, am probably around the 80-85% mark in correct decision making but the poker gods would have us believe thats not good enough...and it isn't. Jaysus Mark, You just love winding people up, think b4 you type :)up Thanks Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: SuffolkPunch on September 30, 2005, 11:44:03 AM Hello all, sorry if have offended the chap who started this thread by entering the EPT without years of experience behind me! I grinned to myself because I have read his book so I've had a good teacher! I can understand his point, but the idea of writing the column in The Sun Online(www.thesun.co.uk) is to bring poker to a wider audience, which must be good for all of us.
It's not a case of a newbie giving all you more experienced players a bad name. So I've only been playing six months? What difference does it make - we all want to enjoy the game no matter the level of our experience. Of course it would be nice to win money (I cashed #1,500 last week) but let's have a good time too. Good luck Simon Young The Sun Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: AdamM on September 30, 2005, 11:45:41 AM nice, welcome aboard simon.
UKpoker is a new member and far from represents the feelings of Blonde poker members Good luck mate, Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: action man on September 30, 2005, 11:45:54 AM this is by no means a dig at tight end, and i know i haven't contributed much to the forum, but how much more do we have to endure of mr ukpoker, i wonder what your response will be when he has a sly dig at you mate. He's only been on the forum a few days and imo is trying his level best to get under the skin of every blondeite, I thought the main point of this forum was to be honest!
best regards rich Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Nem on September 30, 2005, 11:46:56 AM A very quick response to my email Simon
Thanks Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Heid on September 30, 2005, 11:47:03 AM As to the statement I have highlighted...I am just stepping outside the tent now, and I may be some time thanks Off in Antarctic to calm down? Take some Kendall Mint Cake? Wear nice pants in case you are run down and have dirty pants on? Ohhhmmmmmm! Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 11:47:17 AM Good stuff Simon!
Welcome to Blonde Please come back and tell us how you get on, good luck (and I, er, hope you are not as dead money as I made you sound!!! :-[ ;D ;) ) Oh, and don't spend too much time a) worrying about offending the original poster or b) reading his books How long have you been aware of us here at Blonde? Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Nem on September 30, 2005, 11:47:41 AM this is by no means a dig at tight end, and i know i haven't contributed much to the forum, but how much more do we have to endure of mr ukpoker, i wonder what your response will be when he has a sly dig at you mate. He's only been on the forum a few days and imo is trying his level best to get under the skin of every blondeite, I thought the main point of this forum was to be honest! best regards rich Peace Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Mark S. on September 30, 2005, 11:49:39 AM Reply to Adam,
Once again I think you've missed ENTIRELY the point of my post! Reply to Simon, Nothing against you sir...you're just one lucky guy! Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: AdamM on September 30, 2005, 11:49:49 AM no, action man, TightEnd's right
just because UKPoker is being an ass, that's no excuse for me to lose my cool. If I have a problem with him I'll take it up with him directly and also through the moderators. No flaming here, even when deserved Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Nem on September 30, 2005, 11:50:44 AM Here, here
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: RED-DOG on September 30, 2005, 11:51:31 AM Quick response by Mr punch, and he didn't forget to bring his spam
My spidey senses are tingling Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 11:51:48 AM this is by no means a dig at tight end, and i know i haven't contributed much to the forum, but how much more do we have to endure of mr ukpoker, i wonder what your response will be when he has a sly dig at you mate. He's only been on the forum a few days and imo is trying his level best to get under the skin of every blondeite, I thought the main point of this forum was to be honest! best regards rich actionman I was trying to prevent a nasty situation developing, and I have already said that my response would have been the same Adam's I am not a moderator, therefore I can't do much but I can try, but neither Tikay or Ironside are around If I, in your eyes, did not deal with it properly I apologise. I am sure the powers that be will have their attention drawn to this thread. Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: AdamM on September 30, 2005, 11:51:57 AM No Mark, you've entirely missed the tone of your post. re-read what you've posted now you are more aware of my circumstances and try and apply some empathy.
I'm trying to remain civil but you keep pressing the buttons Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: action man on September 30, 2005, 11:52:56 AM as i said i wasnt having a pop, gl with your business m8,
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 11:54:13 AM Reply to Adam, Once again I think you've missed ENTIRELY the point of my post! No he didn't and you know it. UKPoker, you are on thin ice, please leave it Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: action man on September 30, 2005, 11:54:44 AM tight end i understand completely mate, take it easy
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: SuffolkPunch on September 30, 2005, 11:55:25 AM Thanks Tightend.
One of your members emailed me to tell me of this thread so thought I'd better take a look! I'll try and keep you posted on here, but you can get daily updates of my progress (or lack of!) at the EPT on www.thesun.co.uk Good luck. I'm now off to the Victoria for the draw to see if I play Day One today, or Day One tomorrow (in which case I can say I survived the first day!!) Simon Young The Sun Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Heid on September 30, 2005, 11:56:20 AM Sometimes all a fire wants it to be fanned - if you don't give it oxygen it will go out eventually :)
Simon you are very welcome here - congrats on your cashes last month - wish I had the bankroll to make that sort of dosh, and you've managed to do what a lot of us wish we could do - so fair play to ya :) Write lovely stuff about us in The Sun, cause we are all nice, some of us are excellent poker players, and you are going to learn an awful lot from the postings on here. I don't count myself as one of the excellent poker players, but I'm not bad - not brill either, but I have managed to camouflage that fact so far! Mark, you really need to just join in the flow mate, it's not all about being contentious - it's about being a part of the community, and just enjoying it for what it is :) Heid xx Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: AdamM on September 30, 2005, 11:56:28 AM TightEnd, Nemesis, hold me back (swinging) hold me back (struggling) I'll knock that chip off (bundled away by calmer Blondites)
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: ifm on September 30, 2005, 11:58:44 AM Has he wound people up since he got here though? or have people just automatically pounced on him from past experience?
I completely understand Adam's reaction here and is absolutely right to be unhappy about that comment, though it is the first time he has wound anybody up, just being here seems to be pissing most people off. Look at it from the majority angle (people who don't know who this bloke is) and this is becoming like a certain other forum, not because of Mark but because of peoples comments to him. I would say if you don't like him then ignore him, don't start flaming him it's unpleasant and not wanted. Ian Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: AdamM on September 30, 2005, 11:58:54 AM Suffolkpunch, I hope now you're here you'll stay with us. other than the occassional fall out with Mark, it's a really friendly place.
I'll have a look at your colomn (leave it Nun) Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 11:59:44 AM Thanks Tightend. One of your members emailed me to tell me of this thread so thought I'd better take a look! I'll try and keep you posted on here, but you can get daily updates of my progress (or lack of!) at the EPT on www.thesun.co.uk Good luck. I'm now off to the Victoria for the draw to see if I play Day One today, or Day One tomorrow (in which case I can say I survived the first day!!) Simon Young The Sun Simon, good luck again One small piece of friendly advice...no need to spam the Sun anymore...I think we all known about your organ and indeed many will buy it already Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: AdamM on September 30, 2005, 12:02:47 PM Has he wound people up since he got here though? or have people just automatically pounced on him from past experience? I completely understand Adam's reaction here and is absolutely right to be unhappy about that comment, though it is the first time he has wound anybody up, just being here seems to be pissing most people off. Look at it from the majority angle (people who don't know who this bloke is) and this is becoming like a certain other forum, not because of Mark but because of peoples comments to him. I would say if you don't like him then ignore him, don't start flaming him it's unpleasant and not wanted. Ian It's not always what he rights Ifm. people I've spoken too all agree it's the 'tone' of the pieces. it's the fact that he rarely contributes positively to other threads. evey day before lunch he'll come onto this and other forums and post an editorial stance on something or other and step back and watch the board bicker over it, occassionally stepping back in to stir it if neccessary. Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: action man on September 30, 2005, 12:04:53 PM anyway, my mate has left me in charge on a 50/50 cut crapshoot now
[attachment deleted by admin] Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 12:06:53 PM meanwhile
a) it's overcast outside b) but it's Friday!!!!!! YIPPEE In other words Ian and Adam, by all means PM to your hearts content, but how about moving on everyone? Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: AdamM on September 30, 2005, 12:07:31 PM would love to
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Robert HM on September 30, 2005, 12:15:22 PM Well after 2 hours sleep, nothing like a stroll through a sharp breeze of a thread to wake you up. ::)
Welcome Simon, good luck in the EPT, prove yourself by by us all a G&T with your winnings. Too late to contribute as I am following good advice and "moving on" before I even got a chance. Happiness and joy :-* PS Watch out for Polar Bears TightEnd Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 12:17:31 PM The trouble is, the Polar Bears are pretty well camoflagued!
Back inside now, all the others are asleep, crawl into the sleeping bag.....zzzzzzzzzz Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Robert HM on September 30, 2005, 12:18:05 PM Sleep tight Tight
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: byronkincaid on September 30, 2005, 01:04:37 PM Quote I, myself, am probably around the 80-85% mark in correct decision making I would love to know what the bracelet winners, WPT winners and other world class players who post here think their % mark in correct decision making is. Was it Howard Lederer who said he'd never played a perfect hour of poker in his life? Statisticly if you're playing thousands of hours poker a year and making 85% correct decisions there surely must be many hours where you play perfect poker, which means you must be pretty much the best player in the world... Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Mark S. on September 30, 2005, 03:02:00 PM Unfortunately for me the 15%-20% of the time I make a wrong decision it usually leads to my downfall!
I would assume that in any kind of sport/pastime you do you must try and do your best. Lets assume that perfect poker meant winning every tournament. Not possible! However it was Greg Raymor that said that as long as you're making 'good decisions' then good poker should follow. Lets assume that 90% means that, for the majority of the time, you're ability to play the game of No Limit Hold'Em with only 1 mistake in every 10 hands you play. I think we can all relate to making mistakes by the amount we bet, raise etc etc. What I believe is that out of every 10 hands I play I'm making around 2 mistakes. Compunded this means I lose more often than I win! Having done a diary for the past two years on my tournament play I can honestly say that for the whole peiod I've played and the many hundreds of tournaments I've played I'm in profit! Not a lot...but profit nonetheless. I don't think there's a vast difference in ability between me and anyone else, on any given day, but I'll probably make that one mistake more than the better player will and that will lead to my finishing the tournament before they do. Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: Royal Flush on September 30, 2005, 03:59:25 PM Does this mean you dont feel qualifed to write a book on the subject?
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: redsimon on September 30, 2005, 04:04:58 PM Looks like rain tonight..storms later :)
Title: Re: Forgive me for being cynical... Post by: TightEnd on September 30, 2005, 04:05:47 PM it had only just cleared up too...
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