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Title: How would you play this KK? Post by: doubleup on November 03, 2007, 03:32:09 PM Villain is 24/16, flop agg 5. I have 2 choices pre-flop. If I 4 bet, I take down the pot prob 90% of the time, but get stacked by aces. Playing my way I can get bluffed if an ace hits the flop, stacked by aces or a set, but I prob stack QQ and maybe JJ, and should get a c-bet out of AK, maybe even a call on a good day as this player is quite agg. Am I being to optimistic on the upside of my line? Am I being to pessimistic about villains calling range of a 4 bet preflop?
villain seat 1 with $866.74 [Dealer] seat 2 with $655.42 seat 3 with $89.96 hero seat 4 with $428.00 seat 5 with $503.20 seat 6 with $90.66 seat 2 posted the small blind - $2.00 seat3 posted the big blind - $4.00 ** Dealing card to hero: Ks Kd hero raised - $24.00 seat 5 folded seat 6 folded villain raised - $76.47 seat 2 folded seat 3 folded hero called - $76.47 ** Dealing the flop: 4c Th 7s hero checked villain bet - $96.00 hero went all-in - $351.53 Title: Re: How would you play this KK? Post by: LuckyLloyd on November 03, 2007, 03:44:52 PM If you aren't going to 4 - bet preflop against a 24 / 16 with KK what do you 4-bet with? Exactly AA or air?
As played, call the flop lead. Widen his range and allow him to spew some chips at you by two barrelling; overvaluing some marginal hands. Your line is super strong and transparent IMHO. When people call 3 - bets preflop and shove on a dry board like this AA and KK make up a MASSIVE part of their range. By playing the hand this way you are actually making it possible for him to get away from JJ - QQ on this flop. Plus he just folds out any air he has missed with. The games are getting more and more aggressive and the 3 betting range of 24 / 16 regs these days is generally 88+ // AQ+. Sometimes a LOT wider. IMO, I think your line is most ineffective against that range and makes you easy to play against if it is your standard - you would need to be capable of showing up with a lot more than AA or KK for me to like it. Title: Re: How would you play this KK? Post by: Longy on November 03, 2007, 03:51:03 PM I like it. Im assuming that you belive that he may well laydown anything but aa/kk to a 4 bet preflop, though i would start 4 betting a bigger range it this is the case as this is vastly exploitable, 24/16/5 is pretty solid stats.
This line allows to stack qq/jj type hands sometimes and definitley get value from a cbet of villans whole 3 betting range (ak,aq etc). If he has aa well thats the same result if we 4 bet and if he has 10's well thems the risks,ul. Overall your line looks more profitable against a thinking opponent. Title: Re: How would you play this KK? Post by: doubleup on November 03, 2007, 04:22:08 PM By playing the hand this way you are actually making it possible for him to get away from JJ - QQ on this flop. Well why do the fckers instacall when I take this line with AK? :) The games are getting more and more aggressive and the 3 betting range of 24 / 16 regs these days is generally 88+ // AQ+. Sometimes a LOT wider. IMO, I think your line is most ineffective against that range and makes you easy to play against if it is your standard - you would need to be capable of showing up with a lot more than AA or KK for me to like it. Hmmm might be something in this (I do realise that his range for 3 betting is pretty wide), but it's a different line of thought entirely. i.e. it involves a whole 4 betting range and consideration of interaction with the villain. I will have a think about this. Title: Re: How would you play this KK? Post by: AlexMartin on November 03, 2007, 07:20:12 PM I like the line pre, but often id let him fire turn again. You are either so far ahead or so far behind to his RR range that jamming flop is -EV. Esp with this board texture and lack of scare cards available to show themsleves on the turn.
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