blonde poker forum

At the time I struggled to comprehend this play regardless of the result whats your opinion before I reveal the winner.....


***** Betfair Poker Hand History for Game 271893332 *****
PL $2.50/$5 Omaha - Monday, November 05, 23:10:20 GMT 2007
Table Rhone 6-max (Real Money)
Seat 4 is the button
Total number of active players : 6
Seat 1: W4LLY ( $719.15 )
Seat 2: Curly123 ( $310 )
Seat 3: BONESAW17 ( $934.37 )
Seat 4: Huztler ( $1,044.58 )
Seat 5: Doooom ( $454.40 )
Seat 6: Hitandrun ( $899.05 )
Doooom posts small blind [$2.50]
Hitandrun posts big blind [$5]
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hitandrun [ Kd, Ac, Ks, As ]
W4LLY folds
Curly123 raises to [$17.50]
BONESAW17 calls [$17.50]
Huztler folds
Doooom calls [$15]
Hitandrun raises to [$87.50]
Curly123 calls [$70]
BONESAW17 calls [$70]
Doooom calls [$70]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 3d, 7s, 8h ]
Doooom checks
Hitandrun bets [$350]
Curly123 folds
BONESAW17 goes all-in
BONESAW17 raises to [$846.87]
Doooom folds
Hitandrun calls [$461.55]
Hitandrun goes all-in
Returning uncalled bet [$35.32] to BONESAW17
** Showdown **
BONESAW17 shows [ 7d, Ts, 9c, 4c ]
Hitandrun shows [ Kd, Ac, Ks, As ]

I'm no good with Omaha odds, but I think it's pretty close, and he may even be a marginal favourite.

If that's the case, his play on the flop is obviously fine.

It's a lot to pay PF with what is a pretty trashy hand.

he is favorite, but marginal

The preflop call is terrible with that rubbish and with 3 to act after him.

Terrible call pre flop for what its cost him, on the he's a marginal fav with an up and down draw and a pair against your pair with no draw.

Check fold is  MUST here with AAKK.

820 possible ways this hand ends up - he wins 469 of them, you win 351 - 57% / 43%.

this is how the hand finished....

** Dealing Turn ** [ 7h ]
** Dealing River ** [ Qc ]
** Hand Conclusion **
BONESAW17 wins $1,970.10 from main pot with three of a kind, Sevens
************  Game 271893332 ends  ************

Normally in that situation with 3 callers I concider my hand dead unless I flop an A K or 2 spades + to the nut flush draw. I felt flop was poor enough that I was probably still ahead and could win pot there and then. Even if Bonesaw puts me on AA I still think it is a terrible play by him as I have committed 2 much to pass now even if I am up against a flopped 2 pair.

Longines you are spot on with your % and I would love to know how you broke it down. The only way I can analyse it is with an online poker calculator which gets the same result that you do! but only gives me percentages.  when I try to manually calculate the odds  in my hamfisted way I cant get Bonesaw as the favourite

How did you work it so conclusively ?

Longines is Bonesaw in disguise  ::)

Cant understand why you want to get the lot in with AAKK here.

agreed,

but if it is the sort of game  where 3 people call full pot reraises  preflop, u must except every draw to be in against you.

that  said, isolating heads up on flop cant be considered bad play, as its its not a hard fold for op.

I see people making these sorts of call preflop with trash loads on stars at 2-4..I don't get it but that's the way they want to play it.

I hate the call on the flop, I also think the bet is too big. every draw kills you and odds of two pair being out tere are always big in the sort of gae where people call with hands like this. Bet out 250 and you'd get the same result, there's no need to stick 350 in here. He still would have moved all in and you could fairly comfortably let go of your aces...even now you should have folded..save yourself 480$ next time.

Problem is, once you have put the $250 in you are giving yourself a $600 call into a $1450 pot, which, given the board, you are highly likely getting odds to.
Calling the push is going to be the right play more often than not.

It's either a check fold, or you are in all the way, in my opinion.

I know my play is not gr8. having made the preflop call with Bonesaw's hand is anybody here pushing on that flop?

He knows that he is likely a favourite here as the flop is rainbow, so you can't have a flushdraw.  Something like QJT9 is his only worry, but bigger cards from you are much more likely. 

Chris, http://www.twodimes.net/poker is what I use - nice and simple.

i don't mind his play too much, although we don't know enough about player traits to make analysis easy.

If doom has shown a tendency to fold these spots then it's ok to call, if chris has shown a tendency to get stacked with aces his call is fine.

Raising pot out of the BB here is a losing prop overal, getting 7-10% of a deep stack in pre flop out of position to multi oppos in plo is long term suicide.

A smaller raise to offer the original raisor the chance re raise again and prob make it heads up and all in pre is the preferred situation. If all oppos just call then you won't feel so bad about check folding the flop. This also builds up a nice deception giving you the chance to raise a nice rundown or similar and check raise a good flop later on.

Calling the raise is fine as if you hit the original raiser is forced to represent and you get a nice pay off hopefully.

I don't think he played great pre flop but you definately played it horribly imo.

Agree his call on the flop was atrocious but with 3 callers I'm probably check-folding or putting a small bet out and fold to any raise. Even with this very strong hand you need to improve on the flop against 3 players in Omaha.

Your play pre-flop stinks of a big hand like double-suited Aces or Kings and this makes it easier for your opponents to play against you so you're gonna get calls with middle rundowns like 5678 as they are only, at the very worst, a 60/40 dog against bullets.

As it's a cash game, post-flop, if I was in his shoes I would be pushing as well, hoping to either get you off the hand there and then or if you call I know I'd be a slight favourite anyway as I know 9 out of 10 times I'm up against Aces.

Wow i was right the other day you only like playing big pots when you are behind!!

Bonesaw has done nothing wrong here even preflop isn't what i'd consider bad and i'm pushing on the flop 100% of the time with his hand against what is nailed on aces. The problem in PLO is that when you make it so obvious preflop what half your hand is for such a small percentage of your total stack good and bad players will try to chase you down and crack your aces. 3 way this is a definite check fold for me unless i hit a set a FD or a really low paired board like 22 or 33. Possible if i was feeling really sick i'd pot where my AAKK was blocking made straights or broadway draw flops where i could gutshot the nuts to get out of it if called.

If he had only flopped a pair and a gutshot it would be an exact coin flip so without looking it up i know that he must be in the 60/40 favourite region.