blonde poker forum

2-4 NL 6 Max

LAGgy game in 4 of the six spots. The exceptions being UTG and yourself

UTG $540 makes it $14. Solid pre-flop

Button $480 makes it $36, liberal raiser from button.

Hero SB $500 looks down at  Jc Jh

Folds

Discuss.

im folding too.

Would UTG re raise now?

If you feel he wouldnt, then I call and see a flop.

If you feel he would, I am folding here - in a laggy game, I would not want to play JJ OOP to a raise and re raise

Hmmm how often does button 3 bet I assume quite alot from your post therefore. Im thinking our hand is good against both ranges, therefore im squeezing making it about $100, folding to a push from either. Of course it gets interesting if we get flat called in either spot on the flop.

I don't like flat calling here we are oop and not getting the implied odds from either stack imo. I like to get somewhere around 15 to 1 to set mine purely and we are getting less than that. Also as we oop we going to have a job calling most bets from either player on various different boards postflop.

Caveat at the games i play where 3 betting is normally a monster, i will fold here.

If the button is as he says I feel you really should reraise here..

is there not any value in calling to hit a set?

Meh this is my own opinion, mainly based on quite a good discussion on this I saw elsewhere. That while you are 7.5 to 1 to hit your set on the flop and therefore this basically can be seen as your implied odds. To truly get these odds two things have to happen.

We have to get villan to put his whole stack in and actually win the hand.

These two variables mean sometimes villan will fold when we raise/bet postflop and also he may well stack us by hitting a bigger set or a draw. A respected mid stakes cash player settled on needing implied odds of around 17 to 1 to outweigh the other two factors.

Of course this is player dependent and if the pot becomes multiway we have the opportunity to make more/get outdrawn more.

fold the jacks then

repopadoodledo

I folded

result of what other two had irrelevant really, but they played for their whole stack on this hand, as UTG pushed to the button re-raise and button called the push

Those who re-pop here to say $150, if UTG pushes you are folding having re-popped?

I don't think flat call to hit a set here is an option so its fold or re-pop. If you re-pop are you committing to playing for your stack here?

your hand is kinda like 2/9os if u wont play for stacks, so the question is one of image. For someone with your image, I dont think you can raise and stack off, so u might as well have random cards here, someone with a loose image they can raise/stack off here quite happily and often expect to be in pretty good shape. Given your image, and its good that you are aware of the image you project to the table, folding is prolly the best play

wow - he shoved 100+bbs!


This is what I was thinking and also what do you do if you are flat called?

Reraising here is surely just turning your hand into a bad bluff.
  

utg shoved 120bb...with AA  ;D

this is of course irrelevant to my decision pre-this, but anyway!!

Button called shove with KK

 ;hattip;

Jack on the flop?

Do you think calling to hit a set vs 2 opponents here for $36 (lets assume you think you will get to see a flop for this price!) is better value becuase it's more likely you will get paid off by at least one of them when you do hit.

Overall, I think UTG is reraising the button enough here for folding to be the safer option! Even if he got trappy vs one opponent, I doubt it vs 2.

nope, nothing funky. KK stacked off, JJ would have done too

All depends on what you think UTG will do, re-pop or call, if you think he will only call i call...

Oh, and if i think he has AA and will play it cutely and only call, i DEF call...

Isn't that a problem though? If he only calls he isn't likely to have a hand to stack off with if you hit, baring him playing AA cutely (against 2 people!) or flopping a lower set himself (not very likely).

Quite true Bongo, but im struggling to fold J's 6 handed here to aggressive players with the action so far, maybe thats just a weakness of mine...

WOW. 17-1? Id like to see a proper analysis of this. But i wouldnt be suprised if that is near optimal. How much does it reduce as pots get more multiway? p.s could you send me the 2+2 thread :)