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Title: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: boldie on June 02, 2008, 03:11:07 PM http://uk.news.yahoo.com/pressass/20080602/tuk-children-may-face-drink-ban-at-home-6323e80.html
Quote Press Assoc. - 36 minutes agoParents could be banned from giving children a taste of wine or beer at home under a Government crackdown on binge drinking announced on Monday. (Advertisement) Currently any child aged five or over is legally allowed to try alcohol at home under their parents' supervision. But a review designed to tackle the growing problem of teenage binge drinking will consider whether the legal age limit should be raised. The Government's Youth Alcohol Action Plan could also impose new limits on advertising amid fears that children encounter too many drinks commercials on early evening TV. Chief Medical Officer Sir Liam Donaldson will begin work on new guidelines on alcohol consumption among under-18s. At the launch of the plan in London, Sir Liam said: "The law at the moment says that you mustn't give alcohol to your child under five. "We are going to look at the evidence very systematically and see whether it needs to be changed or strengthened." He continued: "In the past, getting drunk was a right of passage for young people. But over the last decade or so we have moved to a situation where it's more than a right of passage. "Young people often say that they drink to get drunk. That pattern of behaviour has become quite deeply ingrained. That behaviour pattern is undoubtedly linked to higher health risks in the medium and long term." He added: "Ultimately, it's parents' right and responsibility to supervise their children and guide them and we want to give them every help and support in this task." lol...someone doesn't quite grasp it, me thinks. the "getting drunk is a right of passage" part is something that really cracked me up...If getting drunk really is a rite of passage for people in this country then I would suggest the problem might be there..and not with having a sip of wine when you're under aged. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: TightEnd on June 02, 2008, 03:12:27 PM you're rite.
Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: Colchester Kev on June 02, 2008, 03:13:14 PM Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: boldie on June 02, 2008, 03:20:53 PM you're rite. oh yeah...I see...make fun of the poor foreigner who doesn't speak English properly!..pffffttt *off to change the mistake I (and the journo) made :) Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: kinboshi on June 02, 2008, 03:24:02 PM you're rite. oh yeah...I see...make fun of the poor foreigner who doesn't speak English properly!..pffffttt *off to change the mistake I (and the journo) made :) Ermmmm, where was the mistake? I can see one now... Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: Snatiramas on June 02, 2008, 03:39:46 PM What about alcohol used in religious services???
Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: bhoywonder on June 02, 2008, 03:40:07 PM Way 2 go.another unenforceable law reaches the statute books,bloody waste of taxpayers money.why don,t they concentrate on the failing economy.
Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: boldie on June 02, 2008, 03:49:56 PM What about alcohol used in religious services??? you're screwed Snatty...Gordon Brown will have you nicked! Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: bolt pp on June 02, 2008, 04:02:15 PM It is a problem, these hoodies sitting around on a friday night sharing a merlot
Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: kinboshi on June 02, 2008, 04:10:04 PM It is a problem, these hoodies sitting around on a friday night sharing a merlot Depends on the neighbourhood. Pinot gris is the preferred tipple by the ASBO-brigade round here, although they're also partial to a Chardonnay at weekends (ldo). Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: Snatiramas on June 02, 2008, 04:10:35 PM It is a problem, these hoodies sitting around on a friday night sharing a merlot Or a nice Crozes Hermitage Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: wader leg on June 02, 2008, 05:55:55 PM Way 2 go.another unenforceable law reaches the statute books,bloody waste of taxpayers money.why don,t they concentrate on the failing economy. It won't be unenforceable when they fit cctv inside everyones home to keep tabs on what were doing, no doubt welcomed by the nothing to hide nothing to fear brigade. BTW what does that mobile phone icon next to bhoywonders post mean? and the page icons on everyone elses posts that I've only just noticed, are they new? Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: madasahatstand on June 02, 2008, 07:01:46 PM In Scotland there is evidence that a high percentage of folk with long term drink problems started drinking under the supervision of parents at 13-15 years old. Thats the black and white evidence but we don't know how many people started drinking with their families at this age and don't have long term drink problems. It's still significant in statistical terms though and policy should be made on academic research and evidence - not on a whim.
You have a bunch of politicans who don't know what culture is never mind try to achieve culture change around alcohol. The quote from the CMO says that he is looking into changing guidelines, not that any laws are going to be changed, well at least thats not what I take from it. I didn't read the link. I'm not a parent but I cannot see for the life of me why you would give a 5 or a 10 year old alcohol except to cool down teething/maybe a sip of champers at a celebration? Why would it be bad news to publish 'guidelines' around children and alcohol so parents know the full evidence and can make informed choices? If alcohol can harm your child then why would you not want that information? CMO's are not usually in the business of setting out guidelines for no reason. They are in those positions to ensure the health of the communities, not to pander to politicians.. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: madasahatstand on June 02, 2008, 07:26:55 PM Just saw the parts about the potential ban - it's unworkable even if its coated in gold plated evidence. I don't believe in the nanny state but I do believe that parents need the information to make informed choices.
Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: bhoywonder on June 02, 2008, 07:29:56 PM Way 2 go.another unenforceable law reaches the statute books,bloody waste of taxpayers money.why don,t they concentrate on the failing economy. BTW what does that mobile phone icon next to bhoywonders post mean? and the page icons on everyone elses posts that I've only just noticed, are they new? means i am in work skiving and on my mobile...lol they havent found out a way to check my history file..give it time though,they will... on a similar note we had tyre fitters in the other day and they have sat nav's installed which flashes a warning to the boss when they drive off the path they are meant to be on...obviously to keep an eye on them and to stop em abusing the company vehicles..so for them the big brother state has truely arrived...the driver told me the other day on a quiet afternoon he went for a haircut after trying with no avail to phone his boss..he got a final warning for that... this country has problems, come the revolution Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: madasahatstand on June 02, 2008, 07:59:35 PM Way 2 go.another unenforceable law reaches the statute books,bloody waste of taxpayers money.why don,t they concentrate on the failing economy. BTW what does that mobile phone icon next to bhoywonders post mean? and the page icons on everyone elses posts that I've only just noticed, are they new? means i am in work skiving and on my mobile...lol they havent found out a way to check my history file..give it time though,they will... on a similar note we had tyre fitters in the other day and they have sat nav's installed which flashes a warning to the boss when they drive off the path they are meant to be on...obviously to keep an eye on them and to stop em abusing the company vehicles..so for them the big brother state has truely arrived...the driver told me the other day on a quiet afternoon he went for a haircut after trying with no avail to phone his boss..he got a final warning for that... this country has problems, come the revolution Ready and able :) Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: wader leg on June 02, 2008, 08:09:36 PM means i am in work skiving and on my mobile...lol Ahh I get it now, cheers As for the haircut he should have tried the old "my hair grew during work time so I got it cut during work time" trick Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: nirvana on June 02, 2008, 08:29:24 PM I like the bit where they say he's "working on a new set of guidelines" - if the guidelines are good then that's it sorted then!
Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: gatso on June 02, 2008, 09:10:10 PM In Scotland there is evidence that a high percentage of folk with long term drink problems started drinking under the supervision of parents at 13-15 years old. that line means nothing and it is using so called evidence like this with false logic that leads to a lot of ignorant conclusions. I'm sure if we look into it we'll find that in Scotland there is evidence that a high percentage of folk with long term drink problems went to the zoo under the supervision of parents at 13-15 years old. no causal relationship is implied by either your sentence or mine. it may well be the case that drinking with parents as a kid causes drink problems later in life but it certainly can't be shown by the evidence you refer to. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: Maxriddles on June 02, 2008, 09:55:30 PM Personally I think this current piece of nannying from Gord and his gophers is another piece of nonsense, heaven forbid that they actually come up with something useful, but there was a very interesting article on Scottish TV today about a pilot in Armadale in West Lothian to tackle bevvied up youngsters which seems to be working a treat.
If I could be arsed looking (I can't) I would post a link but if anyone is interested enough I'm sure you can find it through google. Buckfast was the young folks drink of choice where I grew up and I believe it still is, however where I live now I saw some local youngsters getting stuck into a £10 bottle of Chardonnay, I do imagine that they probably nicked it right enough. My parents taught me well where drink is concerned but if only they'd remembered to mention that once full of the drink you should refrain from playing sit n go poker, I now know this to be true but the drunken sit n go habit has a firm hold on me.........can the priory help with this? Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: madasahatstand on June 03, 2008, 08:20:59 AM In Scotland there is evidence that a high percentage of folk with long term drink problems started drinking under the supervision of parents at 13-15 years old. that line means nothing and it is using so called evidence like this with false logic that leads to a lot of ignorant conclusions. I'm sure if we look into it we'll find that in Scotland there is evidence that a high percentage of folk with long term drink problems went to the zoo under the supervision of parents at 13-15 years old. no causal relationship is implied by either your sentence or mine. it may well be the case that drinking with parents as a kid causes drink problems later in life but it certainly can't be shown by the evidence you refer to. Actually its statistically sound. It means that there is a high correlation among those with long term problems that started off in their living rooms with their parents at that age. That is important but whats more important are lots of other varibales involved..i.e. what was the parenting like. I dont know how you can say it means nothing. It shows a clear trend which you can then start looking at in detail. Research and evidence mean everything but maybe I should have explained what the significance was so you were a little clearer. Without it people wouldnt live so long and new medical treatments wouldnt exist, neither would technology. Talking about technology, did anyone watcch the gadget show last night?....awesome If you want to start off a culture change you need to know where you are starting from so the evidence clearly means something. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: madasahatstand on June 03, 2008, 09:01:05 AM In Scotland there is evidence that a high percentage of folk with long term drink problems started drinking under the supervision of parents at 13-15 years old. that line means nothing and it is using so called evidence like this with false logic that leads to a lot of ignorant conclusions. I'm sure if we look into it we'll find that in Scotland there is evidence that a high percentage of folk with long term drink problems went to the zoo under the supervision of parents at 13-15 years old. no causal relationship is implied by either your sentence or mine. it may well be the case that drinking with parents as a kid causes drink problems later in life but it certainly can't be shown by the evidence you refer to. ah i read this again. its the way i present the evidence that means you cannot extract the info you need? lololol, this isnt a lecture and using the example of the zoo is just plain silly. if 50 of my friends drink with parents and 50 dont but 40/50 that did have long term problems, i think that tells you loads. I'll make sure i tidy up future posts when i quote evidence ;) Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: boldie on June 03, 2008, 09:09:23 AM In Scotland there is evidence that a high percentage of folk with long term drink problems started drinking under the supervision of parents at 13-15 years old. that line means nothing and it is using so called evidence like this with false logic that leads to a lot of ignorant conclusions. I'm sure if we look into it we'll find that in Scotland there is evidence that a high percentage of folk with long term drink problems went to the zoo under the supervision of parents at 13-15 years old. no causal relationship is implied by either your sentence or mine. it may well be the case that drinking with parents as a kid causes drink problems later in life but it certainly can't be shown by the evidence you refer to. ah i read this again. its the way i present the evidence that means you cannot extract the info you need? lololol, this isnt a lecture and using the example of the zoo is just plain silly. if 50 of my friends drink with parents and 50 dont but 40/50 that did have long term problems, i think that tells you loads. I'll make sure i tidy up future posts when i quote evidence ;) Yes, it tells you that their parents are poor parents and you should hang out with a different crowd ;) It's the "Drinking to get drunk" culture that is rife in the UK that is causing it. Parents do it and they do it in front of their kids..that makes them poor parents IMO. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: Ginger on June 03, 2008, 09:35:29 AM Yes, it tells you that their parents are poor parents and you should hang out with a different crowd ;) It's the "Drinking to get drunk" culture that is rife in the UK that is causing it. Parents do it and they do it in front of their kids..that makes them poor parents IMO. Teaching you children to respect alcohol is just as important as any other part of parenting. As you say Boldie, we have gotten to a point where having a social drink is not possible, and kids now drink until they can't stand up or they don't bother. I was a child in a family that taught from a very young age what alcohol was, and to enjoy it in a social setting, in moderation. I do the same to my children now and I'm hopeful that I've removed the mystery element of it, the need to try something 'forbidden' to excess.... I'm glad to say I have a teenager that shows no desire to go out and get drunk/have a drink. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: boldie on June 03, 2008, 09:51:16 AM Yes, it tells you that their parents are poor parents and you should hang out with a different crowd ;) It's the "Drinking to get drunk" culture that is rife in the UK that is causing it. Parents do it and they do it in front of their kids..that makes them poor parents IMO. Teaching you children to respect alcohol is just as important as any other part of parenting. As you say Boldie, we have gotten to a point where having a social drink is not possible, and kids now drink until they can't stand up or they don't bother. I was a child in a family that taught from a very young age what alcohol was, and to enjoy it in a social setting, in moderation. I do the same to my children now and I'm hopeful that I've removed the mystery element of it, the need to try something 'forbidden' to excess.... I'm glad to say I have a teenager that shows no desire to go out and get drunk/have a drink. Well said. You're a wise lady..lousy taste in men, obviously, but a wise lady nonetheless ;) Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: kinboshi on June 03, 2008, 09:57:39 AM Yes, it tells you that their parents are poor parents and you should hang out with a different crowd ;) It's the "Drinking to get drunk" culture that is rife in the UK that is causing it. Parents do it and they do it in front of their kids..that makes them poor parents IMO. Teaching you children to respect alcohol is just as important as any other part of parenting. As you say Boldie, we have gotten to a point where having a social drink is not possible, and kids now drink until they can't stand up or they don't bother. I was a child in a family that taught from a very young age what alcohol was, and to enjoy it in a social setting, in moderation. I do the same to my children now and I'm hopeful that I've removed the mystery element of it, the need to try something 'forbidden' to excess.... I'm glad to say I have a teenager that shows no desire to go out and get drunk/have a drink. Which is exactly how they treat alcohol in France and other European countries (although in Germany and Holland they also seem to like to drink to excess). The media are portraying this as a new thing. It happened when I was a child, and I'm sure it happened before then. Probably didn't happen too much during the war or maybe soon after, but only because of a supply issue (would be interested to know if that's true or not). Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: boldie on June 03, 2008, 09:59:05 AM Yes, it tells you that their parents are poor parents and you should hang out with a different crowd ;) It's the "Drinking to get drunk" culture that is rife in the UK that is causing it. Parents do it and they do it in front of their kids..that makes them poor parents IMO. Teaching you children to respect alcohol is just as important as any other part of parenting. As you say Boldie, we have gotten to a point where having a social drink is not possible, and kids now drink until they can't stand up or they don't bother. I was a child in a family that taught from a very young age what alcohol was, and to enjoy it in a social setting, in moderation. I do the same to my children now and I'm hopeful that I've removed the mystery element of it, the need to try something 'forbidden' to excess.... I'm glad to say I have a teenager that shows no desire to go out and get drunk/have a drink. Which is exactly how they treat alcohol in France and other European countries (although in Germany and Holland they also seem to like to drink to excess). The media are portraying this as a new thing. It happened when I was a child, and I'm sure it happened before then. Probably didn't happen too much during the war or maybe soon after, but only because of a supply issue (would be interested to know if that's true or not). Que? Where did this little snippet of information come from?..Though admittedly it might be a new thing, it never used to be the case. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: Jon MW on June 03, 2008, 10:10:13 AM ... The media are portraying this as a new thing. It happened when I was a child, and I'm sure it happened before then. Probably didn't happen too much during the war or maybe soon after, but only because of a supply issue (would be interested to know if that's true or not). The extent to which it is happening is a new thing though - and this is backed up by good statistics - i.e. hospital admissions for children with drink related injuries and illnesses. It's a fairly deep rooted problem, the change to society which creates the 'drinking to excess' culture has taken 20 to 30 years to get to the state it's in now, it will take some doing to undo. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: Ginger on June 03, 2008, 10:10:25 AM Yes, it tells you that their parents are poor parents and you should hang out with a different crowd ;) It's the "Drinking to get drunk" culture that is rife in the UK that is causing it. Parents do it and they do it in front of their kids..that makes them poor parents IMO. Teaching you children to respect alcohol is just as important as any other part of parenting. As you say Boldie, we have gotten to a point where having a social drink is not possible, and kids now drink until they can't stand up or they don't bother. I was a child in a family that taught from a very young age what alcohol was, and to enjoy it in a social setting, in moderation. I do the same to my children now and I'm hopeful that I've removed the mystery element of it, the need to try something 'forbidden' to excess.... I'm glad to say I have a teenager that shows no desire to go out and get drunk/have a drink. Which is exactly how they treat alcohol in France and other European countries (although in Germany and Holland they also seem to like to drink to excess). The media are portraying this as a new thing. It happened when I was a child, and I'm sure it happened before then. Probably didn't happen too much during the war or maybe soon after, but only because of a supply issue (would be interested to know if that's true or not). Que? Where did this little snippet of information come from?..Though admittedly it might be a new thing, it never used to be the case. Got to say I was a little suprised by that too, as it was partly through my family living in Germany for many years (being born there myself) that introduced my parents to this way of thinking. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: Ginger on June 03, 2008, 10:14:48 AM if 50 of my friends drink with parents and 50 dont but 40/50 that did have long term problems, i think that tells you loads. I'll make sure i tidy up future posts when i quote evidence ;) LoL just reading back through this thread I spotted this..... We have solved the problem folks, it's not the parents to blame, it's Mad driving everyone to drink! Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: totalise on June 03, 2008, 10:15:32 AM is it a lot cheaper to get battered now then it was 20 years ago? did they have diamond whites finest on offer back in the day of cheroots and gobstoppers? you can get out of it (for children) for about £2 these days, maybe thats something to do with it.
Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: kinboshi on June 03, 2008, 10:17:31 AM Yes, it tells you that their parents are poor parents and you should hang out with a different crowd ;) It's the "Drinking to get drunk" culture that is rife in the UK that is causing it. Parents do it and they do it in front of their kids..that makes them poor parents IMO. Teaching you children to respect alcohol is just as important as any other part of parenting. As you say Boldie, we have gotten to a point where having a social drink is not possible, and kids now drink until they can't stand up or they don't bother. I was a child in a family that taught from a very young age what alcohol was, and to enjoy it in a social setting, in moderation. I do the same to my children now and I'm hopeful that I've removed the mystery element of it, the need to try something 'forbidden' to excess.... I'm glad to say I have a teenager that shows no desire to go out and get drunk/have a drink. Which is exactly how they treat alcohol in France and other European countries (although in Germany and Holland they also seem to like to drink to excess). The media are portraying this as a new thing. It happened when I was a child, and I'm sure it happened before then. Probably didn't happen too much during the war or maybe soon after, but only because of a supply issue (would be interested to know if that's true or not). Que? Where did this little snippet of information come from?..Though admittedly it might be a new thing, it never used to be the case. Just from when I've been with groups of Dutch and Germans. They liked to 'binge' drink as much as the English. But that's maybe because they were a group of lads from the same sports team (rather than the country they were from). I'm just going on personal experience, as I haven't read any studies in this area. The only 'fact' I know is that Germans drink more on average than Brits. This isn't necessarily through binge drinking though. So I might well be wrong. In fact, I'm rarely rite. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: boldie on June 03, 2008, 10:23:14 AM is it a lot cheaper to get battered now then it was 20 years ago? did they have diamond whites finest on offer back in the day of cheroots and gobstoppers? you can get out of it (for children) for about £2 these days, maybe thats something to do with it. Yeah but you can buy cheap booze in any country. Though we still have a stigma attached to people that drink that really cheap stuff as it's "something alcoholics drink". I still frown when I see someone pick up "Tesco Value beer", Diamond white cider or Buckfast..I can't help it as you don't drink the stuff for the taste of it. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: boldie on June 03, 2008, 10:24:11 AM Yes, it tells you that their parents are poor parents and you should hang out with a different crowd ;) It's the "Drinking to get drunk" culture that is rife in the UK that is causing it. Parents do it and they do it in front of their kids..that makes them poor parents IMO. Teaching you children to respect alcohol is just as important as any other part of parenting. As you say Boldie, we have gotten to a point where having a social drink is not possible, and kids now drink until they can't stand up or they don't bother. I was a child in a family that taught from a very young age what alcohol was, and to enjoy it in a social setting, in moderation. I do the same to my children now and I'm hopeful that I've removed the mystery element of it, the need to try something 'forbidden' to excess.... I'm glad to say I have a teenager that shows no desire to go out and get drunk/have a drink. Which is exactly how they treat alcohol in France and other European countries (although in Germany and Holland they also seem to like to drink to excess). The media are portraying this as a new thing. It happened when I was a child, and I'm sure it happened before then. Probably didn't happen too much during the war or maybe soon after, but only because of a supply issue (would be interested to know if that's true or not). Que? Where did this little snippet of information come from?..Though admittedly it might be a new thing, it never used to be the case. Just from when I've been with groups of Dutch and Germans. They liked to 'binge' drink as much as the English. But that's maybe because they were a group of lads from the same sports team (rather than the country they were from). I'm just going on personal experience, as I haven't read any studies in this area. The only 'fact' I know is that Germans drink more on average than Brits. This isn't necessarily through binge drinking though. So I might well be wrong. In fact, I'm rarely rite. Yeah they do...but the way they drink it is completely different. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: Rod Paradise on June 03, 2008, 11:37:28 AM is it a lot cheaper to get battered now then it was 20 years ago? did they have diamond whites finest on offer back in the day of cheroots and gobstoppers? you can get out of it (for children) for about £2 these days, maybe thats something to do with it. Yeah but you can buy cheap booze in any country. Though we still have a stigma attached to people that drink that really cheap stuff as it's "something alcoholics drink". I still frown when I see someone pick up "Tesco Value beer", Diamond white cider or Buckfast..I can't help it as you don't drink the stuff for the taste of it. OI!! Leave the Monk's Wine out of this!!!! Buckfast & Morgan's Spiced ftw!!!! Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: AndrewT on June 03, 2008, 11:45:03 AM I think that part of the difference between Mediterranean drinking and drinking here is that in France/Spain etc children are introduced to alcohol as something which is drunk when the whole family is together. Children and parents (and often grandparents) will drink together and, because the social norm is for children not to misbehave in front of older relations, the link is formed in the children's minds that alcohol = something to be drunk in moderation and that excess drinking is a bad thing.
Whereas here, children are told that drinking is 'for grown ups', especially excess drinking. As children naturally want to be all grown up, excess drinking is something to aspire to, it's the mark of an adult. Also, because of the 'it's not for kids' approach, any drinking children do tends to be with their peers and out of sight of any adults, when kids are more likely to do silly things anyway. I'd imagine the Scots referred to earlier who started drinking at home were more likely to be of the 'drinking cans of Tennants all night in front of the TV' variety rather than the 'have a glass of wine with Sunday dinner', which is obviously more likely to engender heavier drinking as they got older. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: Jon MW on June 03, 2008, 11:50:01 AM ... I'd imagine the Scots referred to earlier who started drinking at home were more likely to be of the 'drinking cans of Tennants all night in front of the TV' variety rather than the 'have a glass of wine with Sunday dinner', which is obviously more likely to engender heavier drinking as they got older. I think this is where the point of the statistics being misleading comes in. The Scots drinking at home with parents - leads to excess The French/Med/Whatnot drinking at home with parents - doesn't So their is a link - but it isn't the cause. As Andrew suggests, it's more to do with the parents attitude towards alcohol than whether the children are drinking at home or not. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: madasahatstand on June 03, 2008, 07:00:33 PM I think that part of the difference between Mediterranean drinking and drinking here is that in France/Spain etc children are introduced to alcohol as something which is drunk when the whole family is together. Children and parents (and often grandparents) will drink together and, because the social norm is for children not to misbehave in front of older relations, the link is formed in the children's minds that alcohol = something to be drunk in moderation and that excess drinking is a bad thing. Whereas here, children are told that drinking is 'for grown ups', especially excess drinking. As children naturally want to be all grown up, excess drinking is something to aspire to, it's the mark of an adult. Also, because of the 'it's not for kids' approach, any drinking children do tends to be with their peers and out of sight of any adults, when kids are more likely to do silly things anyway. I'd imagine the Scots referred to earlier who started drinking at home were more likely to be of the 'drinking cans of Tennants all night in front of the TV' variety rather than the 'have a glass of wine with Sunday dinner', which is obviously more likely to engender heavier drinking as they got older. I agree so it's not about drink itself, its about the context of drinking and the guidance you get from parents and family. The only problem is that we are not all clones and don't raise kids the same way so some of us get it wrong, hence the 'guidance' thats to be published. Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: madasahatstand on June 03, 2008, 07:04:33 PM if 50 of my friends drink with parents and 50 dont but 40/50 that did have long term problems, i think that tells you loads. I'll make sure i tidy up future posts when i quote evidence ;) LoL just reading back through this thread I spotted this..... We have solved the problem folks, it's not the parents to blame, it's Mad driving everyone to drink! The alcoholic says to the doctor ' I couldn't help it, the pub door swung open and it was like a sign- I just had to go in' ...personal responsibility is oot the window :) If only I could have that effect of people - driving them to drink. I could get the them all steaming and make the world a better place before they sobered up ;) Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: Colchester Kev on June 03, 2008, 07:07:24 PM if 50 of my friends drink with parents and 50 dont but 40/50 that did have long term problems, i think that tells you loads. I'll make sure i tidy up future posts when i quote evidence ;) LoL just reading back through this thread I spotted this..... We have solved the problem folks, it's not the parents to blame, it's Mad driving everyone to drink! The alcoholic says to the doctor ' I couldn't help it, the pub door swung open and it was like a sign- I just had to go in' ...personal responsibility is oot the window :) If only I could have that effect of people - driving them to drink. I could get the them all steaming and make the world a better place before they sobered up ;) Never ever underestimate your ability :) Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: boldie on June 03, 2008, 07:09:24 PM if 50 of my friends drink with parents and 50 dont but 40/50 that did have long term problems, i think that tells you loads. I'll make sure i tidy up future posts when i quote evidence ;) LoL just reading back through this thread I spotted this..... We have solved the problem folks, it's not the parents to blame, it's Mad driving everyone to drink! The alcoholic says to the doctor ' I couldn't help it, the pub door swung open and it was like a sign- I just had to go in' ...personal responsibility is oot the window :) If only I could have that effect of people - driving them to drink. I could get the them all steaming and make the world a better place before they sobered up ;) Oh yeah..the bloody vegan hippies would be in charge and we'd all wear sandals and drive around on a Prius FFS. :) Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: madasahatstand on June 03, 2008, 07:18:17 PM if 50 of my friends drink with parents and 50 dont but 40/50 that did have long term problems, i think that tells you loads. I'll make sure i tidy up future posts when i quote evidence ;) LoL just reading back through this thread I spotted this..... We have solved the problem folks, it's not the parents to blame, it's Mad driving everyone to drink! The alcoholic says to the doctor ' I couldn't help it, the pub door swung open and it was like a sign- I just had to go in' ...personal responsibility is oot the window :) If only I could have that effect of people - driving them to drink. I could get the them all steaming and make the world a better place before they sobered up ;) Never ever underestimate your ability :) You flatter me ;) Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: bolt pp on June 04, 2008, 12:42:37 AM Whatever, diamond white ftw
Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: MrsBoldie on June 04, 2008, 10:10:43 AM Good old West Lothian Council - shifting the drinking day to Wednesday.....
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/edinburgh_and_east/7434013.stm Title: Re: oh boy..more nanny state? Post by: boldie on June 04, 2008, 10:42:57 AM Good old West Lothian Council - shifting the drinking day to Wednesday..... http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/edinburgh_and_east/7434013.stm rotflmfao Politicians really are idiots. |