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Title: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: Maxriddles on September 05, 2008, 11:42:40 PM OK, I want to know if my call on the river is a bad call, I will explain why I made the call once I get some feedback, no 50p required though as I won the pot.
blinds 30/60 Seeing the flop are Chorron 1 4920 Adleigh 3255 Maxriddles 2400 Mawerlick 2985 SB Rixk07 324 BB my hole cards Ks Qh Flop 9c Qc Kd It checks round to me, I bet the pot 300. One caller Adleigh1 Turn 5c Adleigh 1 checks, I bet half the pot 485, Adleigh1 calls River card 7c Adleigh1 bets my remaining 1600 chips. Although I'm not liking the call I do make it and he turns over Jh Qs before going off on one about how bad a call it is. Was it such a bad call? I'll explain my thinking behind it later. Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: celtic on September 05, 2008, 11:50:50 PM bad call
Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: Robbo63 on September 06, 2008, 12:27:50 AM I don't like the call. Will be interested to hear why you were so confident you were ahead.
Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: MANTIS01 on September 06, 2008, 02:44:35 AM The badness of the call depends on where this Adleigh guy is sitting. If he is calling your bet after the flop with the other 3 yet to act your call on the river is very bad. If he is acting last then I think the call is just regular bad. You only beat a complete bluff and that is very unlikely.
Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: MC on September 06, 2008, 02:53:44 AM I disagree, I don't see why a bluff here is "very unlikely"?
If he has a good flush, why bet all your chips? If he has a low flush, why bet? If your calling thinking you're behind perhaps it was a bad call. But if you called thinking "this hand makes no sense why would you have a club the way this played out", then I think it's a perfectly reasonable call... Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: Rupert on September 06, 2008, 03:05:53 AM Who is Adleigh1 and why is it relevant?
Preflop action? Is this a SNG or a cash game? What are the payouts if its a SNG? Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: AlexMartin on September 06, 2008, 06:44:48 AM preflop action please. this can be a good call sometimes played dependants but without reads its terrible, gets worse when they start value-shoving light lol.
Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: Maxriddles on September 06, 2008, 08:55:04 AM No pre flop action, three flat call (maybe I should have raised pre flop) and both blinds call. It's a MTT with 140 runners, 20 places paid. I was below average chip stack at the start of the hand. Names of the other players aren't relevant I just couldn't get the hand history.
Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: bhoywonder on September 06, 2008, 09:35:42 AM Well thought out call imo.nh
Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: bolt pp on September 06, 2008, 10:22:04 AM bad call
def raise pre Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: Charlie44 on September 06, 2008, 11:20:34 AM I think without any history of bluffs I fold. You're getting more than 2-1 for your money on the river but you are beating little - he wins even with rag club.
Info on how loose he plays and his position pre flop would be useful to consider likely starting hand. Assuming mid to late pos and slightly loose pre flop most, likely starting hand may have been A rag clubs. This way he has nut flush and does not need to be afraid of fourth club. Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: Rookie (Rodney) on September 06, 2008, 11:23:51 AM Easy call
Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: MANTIS01 on September 06, 2008, 12:44:01 PM I disagree, I don't see why a bluff here is "very unlikely"? If he has a good flush, why bet all your chips? If he has a low flush, why bet? If your calling thinking you're behind perhaps it was a bad call. But if you called thinking "this hand makes no sense why would you have a club the way this played out", then I think it's a perfectly reasonable call... The reason why a bluff on the river is very unlikely is because villain calls a 300 chip bet on the flop. Villain is happy to call a pot-sized bet equivalent to 10% of his remaining stack on a crazy drawing flop with active players behind. What type of hand would you make that call with? A weak 2nd pair no club? If someone can figure a strat for villain that makes sense I will accept a bluff on the river is likely. Saying it's clear villain made a wtf call on the flop/turn so it means he's audacious jam-bluffing me on the river with no club no hand is a suicidal tournament strat. Villain will have the Ac a lot of the time when he jams. He will jam because smart alec oppo's will be asking themselves why would he do that if he was strong? But he doesn't need to be strong because any club is a winner anyway, as are sets and str8's. You only beat a complete bluff that has played the hand in a wtf manner. Getting into the habit of making this type of call is bad. Getting into the habit of pushing the turn is good though. Title: Re: Do I make a bad call here? Post by: Maxriddles on September 06, 2008, 10:25:40 PM If he has a good flush, why bet all your chips? If he has a low flush, why bet? This was one of the key reasons I make the call. If he has nut flush he'd be more worried about extracting as many chips as he can so his bet seems too big. If a lesser flush, why bet, he knows from my bets I don't have two clubs but he can't assume I have no club, if he thinks he's strong he could reraise any bet I make after he checks. After all I've bet twice after he's checked. I think his push smells strongly of not wanting a call, it makes no sense to me. He's been check calling all the way, if he was chasing the flush he surely would have shown strength earlier, especially on the turn. Considering these points I think the 2/1 is worth the punt. |