Title: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: GreekStein on March 14, 2009, 02:14:35 PM This hand I played months ago now and never got round to posting at the time as I was off on holiday the next day. It's an uncapped buy in £1/2 NL game and I've only been at the table 25 mins. Villain in this hand has roughly £1300 and is the second biggest stack at the table. Looks like he's been playing for hours. I cover.
Only thing of note is that I haven't played a hand yet. I keep getting dealt 94off and am happily passing away. I bought in for £1500 and pass my small blind for £1 which attracts the comment off some geezer "bought in for all that money so you can fold every 'and eh?". In live games no-one ever passes their SB apparently. I just smiled without giving much response as I'm normally pretty loose but can't really thank the guy for helping me establish an image. The table consists of a few donks playing small stacks but for the most part its serious recreational players who are decent. Anyway for the hand... I'm on the button with Kc Jc and there's an UTG straddle of £5. UTG+2 makes it £21 and gets 4 callers. I decide to make it £95 in the hope that they all pass as my image appears so tight. The initial raiser passes but the last guy calls. Really unsure of his range here but think he most likely has a smallish pair and is trying to set mine. Flop Ahrt Tc 9h He checks to me and after a small dwell and a bit of hollywood to look like I'm really strong I bet £105. For the range I put him on I figure I don't need a big bet here and given my action pre I might look stronger here. He takes about 45 seconds and flats. Turn 7c Villain takes his time and checks. I decided to fire once more as I feel he'll only call with a set (as this nit surely has AA right?) but my hand is super disguised and looks really strong. I figure he'll lay down his JQ type hands, heart flush draws and AQ/J combos. I bet £225. He takes about 45 seconds once again and calls. (pls hit one time!) River 5c Villain shoves for about £900. What do we do? Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: celtic on March 14, 2009, 02:17:53 PM Is this a trick question? ;D
Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: GreekStein on March 14, 2009, 02:23:13 PM Is this a trick question? ;D no. Edit: As much as a decision for the river I also want opinions on how I played the whole hand, pre, flop & turn... Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: Longy on March 14, 2009, 02:32:02 PM I think high fiving the dealer and doing a victory dance, would be against live etiquette. So i would just insta call.
Seriously there is no way you can pass this mate. Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: pokerfan on March 14, 2009, 02:35:01 PM call,then rebuy for 3k and tilt crush villain after he spins over Ac Qc
Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: celtic on March 14, 2009, 02:38:30 PM I like the way you have played it. It disguises the hand you have made on the river and his shove on the river is likely to be with A10 or a set and he can't put on the flush.
Also, if he has made the nuts on the river i can't see him shoving for £900, surely a better sized value bet????? Like Longy said, high 5 the dealer and scoop the pot. Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: TightEnd on March 14, 2009, 02:42:35 PM Also, if he has made the nuts on the river i can't see him shoving for £900, surely a better sized value bet????? I can see him shoving the nuts, as the way hero has played it he should have enough to pay the nuts off That said, I call here quickly too Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: Royal Flush on March 14, 2009, 02:56:59 PM Also, if he has made the nuts on the river i can't see him shoving for £900, surely a better sized value bet????? I can see him shoving the nuts, as the way hero has played it he should have enough to pay the nuts off That said, I call here quickly too This. Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: Newmanseye on March 14, 2009, 03:07:52 PM Call Everest to replace the windows as you break the sound barrier getting the chips in.
The hand is played out really well, he gives you credit for the ace but he probably has 2 pair and is expecting you to go broke, not realising he just stepped in it as you caught a fantastic river card. If he turns over Ac Qc well thats just a sore hand but you played it well. Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: MC on March 14, 2009, 03:14:22 PM I think high fiving the dealer and doing a victory dance, would be against live etiquette. So i would just insta call. Seriously there is no way you can pass this mate. ^^Lol And +1 Did he really have the nuts? That's so sick... Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: George2Loose on March 14, 2009, 03:22:48 PM Fold and find a "better" spot
Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: NoflopsHomer on March 14, 2009, 03:35:09 PM If he's a high level thinking player, he can easily turn Ac x into a bluff here figuring you can't call with practically any hand other than your own.
Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: GreekStein on March 14, 2009, 04:07:30 PM Ok, thanks for responses.
I remembered this hand as I bumped into villain in a restaurant yesterday. The bet shocked me as I thought he would never bluff a missed draw here (especially for his whole stack & when my hand looks so strong). However it didn't take me more than 5 seconds to announce call and I did indeed get shown the nut flush, villain had Ac 8c. Having a bit of discussion with friends after the hand we pretty much said what Flops said. An advanced player can turn the bare ace of clubs into a bluff here. However, I was annoyed that I didn't give the hand a bit more thought. This guy seemed decent but nothing told me he was advanced and in retropect I maybe should have realised that the only hand he makes that bet with was Ax clubs. People seem to overbet shove the absolute coconuts in cash fairly often it seems in the hope they'll get hero'd etc. I read something by Justin Bonomo where he's learnt after calling these types of bets so many times and getting shown nuts time and time over to learn to pass some of these spots. Other than NUTZ what does he shove for value here when we know he's not bluffing? Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: Newmanseye on March 14, 2009, 04:17:38 PM I think fly kicking the dealer and doing a victory dance on his grave, would be against live etiquette. So i would just insta call. Seriously there is no way you can pass this mate. Having now seen the outcome FYP Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: gribbo on March 14, 2009, 07:29:23 PM The guy makes a dodgy call on the flop, and the turn is pretty much the gin card in the deck for him. I would say 2pair set hands he would be jamming the river with but so hard to put him on the hand he had. If the river bricked were u firing a third shell at the pot with K high?
Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: GreekStein on March 14, 2009, 09:00:28 PM The guy makes a dodgy call on the flop, and the turn is pretty much the gin card in the deck for him. I would say 2pair set hands he would be jamming the river with but so hard to put him on the hand he had. If the river bricked were u firing a third shell at the pot with K high? I'm 90% sure I was firing a third shell on a brick river Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: AlexMartin on March 16, 2009, 01:46:46 AM I like how you played pre and flop. Pre is v good btw. The turn barrel slightly concerns me, the board has improved for a lot of slightly marginal flop peels his range contains and you risk the sickest thing ever happening, getting check-raised allin by a dominated/flipping draw and being forced to fold. I like it if you are setting up a third river barrel, but this line REALLY polarises your range unless you are playing like an absolute nutjob and have a tonne of history- basically an opponent dependant, mainly 6M type line v another lag online.
Recognise that this line is most definitely out of the ordinary and good players will look you up lighter. IMO, check back the turn and pending reads fire river. As played this is fist-pump call. Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: paulhouk03 on March 16, 2009, 02:01:08 PM so sick
did u top up to 3k so u will have him covered again? Title: Re: £1/2 deep. Backdoor 2nd nuts and get shoved on. Post by: GreekStein on March 17, 2009, 09:30:38 AM so sick did u top up to 3k so u will have him covered again? I realised the prospect of trying to win back 700bbs in a live cash game was about as appealing as attaching a lit firework to my arse. I like how you played pre and flop. Pre is v good btw. The turn barrel slightly concerns me, the board has improved for a lot of slightly marginal flop peels his range contains and you risk the sickest thing ever happening, getting check-raised allin by a dominated/flipping draw and being forced to fold. I like it if you are setting up a third river barrel, but this line REALLY polarises your range unless you are playing like an absolute nutjob and have a tonne of history- basically an opponent dependant, mainly 6M type line v another lag online. Recognise that this line is most definitely out of the ordinary and good players will look you up lighter. IMO, check back the turn and pending reads fire river. As played this is fist-pump call. Interesting points Alex - I just felt on the flop he wasn't that strong and another barrel would get him off the hand. I was 99% sure he was never c-raising all in. |