blonde poker forum

First post on PHA guys, so i'm sorry if its a little bit long winded!

I've been playing for about 2 hours, with a TAG reputation. Steadily increased my stack to 3-4 times what i bought in for. Anyways, table is pretty mixed- 1 or 2 action players that love straddling and betting at every pot but mostly pretty standard players. Most dangerous player (villain) at the table has accumulated a massive stack (>£600). I've won two big pots off him, both times with AK- once hitting the flop, once not. Anyways, my mate gets knocked out of a tourny so I tell myself this is my last hand. I've got about £200 in front of me, pretty much the same as most of the other players. Villian is a good player, capable of creative plays and good reads and isn't happy i've won two pots off him without showing either time.

Dealt to me UTG+2 and I see  Kh Ks 

Raise to £9, folded around to button who flat calls, bb (villain) calls.

Flop:  Tc 5h  7c

It goes check, I bet £18, fold, flat call (BB). I'm thinking maybe hiding a set, flush draw poss or he's got some K10 kind of hand.

Turn:  Qs

Check, I bet £40, he thinks for a while, asks me how much I've got and pushes me all-in. Now i'm thinking maybe he is on the flush draw, can't really put him on AQ or something. Gut instinct is that he after the flop he knew he would check-raise all-in on the turn. I think about the above for a minute before calling.

What do you guys think of my play here? Would you have folded?

I of course play lower stakes than your good self. But I did play in a 2/2 game with the same kind of characters as you described a year or so ago. Given his actions I would call here. If he has a set and has outplayed you so be it, but I can't see him being ahead enough of the time to make folding a viable option.

Hope you won the hand :) I'm sure we'll know in due course.!

Beat him into the pot... and reload when he hits....

These sorts of questions really are very hard to answer without being at the table with villain and getting a feel on how they are playing etc.

If he's good then he should have us beat here as I wouldn't expect a live player to lay down an overpair on that board with £70 of their initial £200 in the pot. Do we think he'd make a move on a tag player who has only shown down a connected AK and who's raised UTG in this hand? Prob not I suspect.

That said it's not unfeasable that he has  Jc Qc / Kc Jc - I just wouldn't expect him to do anything other than call you down here with either of these two (unless you have a strong feel he thinks he could make you lay AA/KK on a board like this as you're hand is pretty face up imo).

In short, in a live cash game I don't hate either option here though I prob advocate a pass. If you were a lag player I would be getting it in.

Decide before you bet.

Agree with this. I would probably either check the turn or bet/snap call.

never fold

he shows  Qh 5d, opinions now?

2 words live poker.

i think you lost the pot

Fold

not being results orientated but i def fold turn in this sort of environment. i would have checked behind turn aswell

Betting the turn is fine but only with the plan to snap the shove.

It did look like 2 pair though obv would have thought 2 pair.

"Villain is a good player, capable of creative plays"

.....mmmm, calling from the BB with  Qh 5d is certainly creative.

Normally I would say that as described he is a fishy luckbox. But if a player has a reliable read that you have a big pair then (if he is deepstacked and so are you) he can pretty much call with any two cards. There are plenty of cash players who take this line.

I just wonder if he had some kind of tell on you? Did he know this was your last hand? Were you so tight that you could only be raising UTG with such a hand?

..and as someone said, this is live poker, so nothing should surprise you. Also, just because he has a big stack doesn't mean a thing. It's how he accumulated it that is relevant.

Pyso, i like your line of thinking. He did say before my hand was flipped over, "you got aces?" - at which point I knew I was beat. I guess raise more pre? bet stronger the flop? check behind on the turn after a flat call on flop?

I think the way you played the hand was fine, you just got a little unlucky. I have posted this sort of hand myself before and the responses have been about the same. Most say call, unlucky, move on etc.

Having said that, in the spot you describe, when he re-raises you the alarm bells should be going off really. At this point you need to start thinking what hand does he think you have. This is very important if you are to get away from the hand.

If this was at DTD then maybe the raise needs to be more, as does the c-bet, but as played I don't see too much wrong. It's hard to say you should pass when we weren't there at the table. For me in a live game the opponent and his live tells and mannerisms are a huge part of my decision process.

Another idea might be to occasionally limp from utg with such a big pair because raising here turns your hand pretty face up, and at a £1/2 table at most venues it would be extremely unlikely if you didn't get a raise of some sort from the later seats. I wouldn't advocate doing it every time, but it might work if you have a particularly tight image. Just a thought.

- On a general level, everyone expects everyone to play their last hand once they announce it. Unless this guy has a seeing eye, it is more likely that he believes hero is light than it is that he believes he has a big pair;
- Hero has noted Villain was unhappy at losing previous pots, making it more likely that he says "fuck it, I'll play any two out of spite seeing as it is his last hand;
- Live 1 / 2 players are fucking idiots until proven otherwise, guilty until proven innocent so to speak;
- 100BBs is NOT especially deep, and is not deep enough to make defending Q5o correct;
- If he called because he had some 'read' that hero has JJ+ and was trying to outflop - i.e. if he had as logical a thought process as you contend - then he should fall the flop, rather than calling for the five outer. Right?;

People play bad and get lucky all the time at these stakes. Though, hero should:

A) Be thinking about ways to get all the loot in 100BBs deep with an big overpair to the board rather than finding ways to justify a fold;
B) Plan ahead in a hand;

Disagree with this. Board has not got so scary we can ever check behind for pot control on turn realistically. We dont have enough history to start checking back for deception on funky boards to get additional value later (which we would some of the time on a dry board (239r). 100bb deep v a relative unknown we need to look at his overall range and figure we crush but need to protect. We dont need to balance or whatnot. We can probably only get two streets from most half decent villains. Turn is 100% bet to protect and get value (look at the zillion draws that will call turn not riv). Re-evaluate after being craised allin, but folding is probably burning money.