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If Phil Taylor doesnt win sports personality of the  year before he retires, then the award is worthless

The man is brutal

160/1 on Betfair.  Sadly darts doesn't get the same prestige or coverage as lots of the other more popular sports.  They may give him a token 3rd or something.  Jenson Button current favourite!

lol

he'll win it the same year kim jong il wins the peace prize and rebbeca adlington is voted FHM's sexiest woman.

probably, but he deserves it more than any other sportsman around today or past 20 years.

The man is the best in his chosen field by a country mile!

yes the man is best in his chosen field, so is bob smith in championship underwater weightlifting. the point is who gives a fuck?

Thinking the same myself and did vote for him a few years back, total legend. WP  ;applause;

Agree. Nem said it best a year or two back. I'd rather make one tennis grand slam quarter final then win 10 PDC world titles.

It is called Sports Personality not Sports achievement for a reason, people have to know/give a shit who he is and what he has achieved. There is no way Taylor will ever win it imo.

Orf course he will never win it, but he is supremely talented at what he does.

Didn't a bloke who rides a bike win it last year?

Who gives a shit about that either?

I like Phil Taylor and I like Darts but it's a bunch of overweight pub landlords playing a pub game. I'm always gonna find it hard to justify thinking one of these guys deserves an award like this when there's so many fantastic sports people out there.

tell me about it

Ok

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/tv_and_radio/sports_personality_of_the_year/7782818.stm

The thousands who watched the olympics on BBC and voted for him ldo. I believe Chris Hoy is currently on a TV advert as well, as much you or anyone on here might not give a shit who Chris Hoy is, there is evidence that advertisers and the general public do.

I said tell me about it, not link me up!

just lazy ::)

Steve Davis won it back in the late 80's.

Snooker must be along similar lines to darts as far as being a sport is concerned and Taylor's dominance is probably higher than Davis'.

And you could hardly call Davis a "personality". Not back then anyway, now he's pure com.

Maybe there's a chance for Phil?

leave it out, the davis/taylor final got 18 million viewers.

people without sky dont even know what taylor looks like.

They do.  He's been on Question of Sport.

Steve Davis has been in the top three of SPOTY five times - more than anyone else.

taylor for spoty is just lol. he may have won like a million world titles but still 90% of the british public have no idea who he is whereas everyone's heard of the cycling bloke and indeed every past winner

the chances of a public vote being won by someone the public don't know is somewhat slim

spoty is a joke full stop

Irony.

possibly the worst statement Blonde has seen!

Clearly 6,000-10,000 people give a fuck every thursday up and down the country during the PLD Paying over £20 a ticket each, not to mention all the other tourney's every other week and 5,000+ in Vegas during the Dessert Classic half way round the world...... with the sponsors pumping £7M prize money into the PDC every year, means clearly millions of viewers give a fuck. Just because your not a fan doesn't mean Taylor shouldn't be praised for being the true champion that he really is.

possibly the worst statement Blonde has seen!

lol

Clearly 6,000-10,000 people give a fuck every thursday

you should've given the example where they hit the dizzy heights of 11,697, i'd of been convinced

5,000+ in Vegas during the Dessert Classic half way round the world

yeah cos most of em think they'll get to see hatton whilst theyre out there when taylors licking his arse.

with the sponsors pumping £7M prize money into the PDC every year, means clearly millions of viewers give a fuck.

erm, no, these are the figures fir the final(the pinacle of the darts year)for the past ten years..............


2009 809,000
2008 731,000
2007 1,028,000
2006 761,000
2005 530,000
2004 820,000
2003 610,000
2002 Unavailable
2001 420,000
2000 240,000
1999 200,000

not even a mil, pathetic really.

Big Brother gets 5 times as many viewers meaning if you were to show a picture of the latest BB star(someone thats been on t.v only a matter of weeks) it's far more likely they'd know who the bb star was than the wholey anonymous taylor. and this is the guy you think should win spoty? just lol.

Just because your not a fan doesn't mean Taylor shouldn't be praised for being the true champion that he really is.

firstly when did i say i wasnt a fan and with regards to me not acknowledging his achievements..............

"yes the man is best in his chosen field so is bob smith in championship underwater weightlifting. the point is who gives a fuck"?

the next SPOTY..................................

(http://www.stargallery.me.uk/communities/1/004/006/221/621/images/4521621903.jpg)

...............erm, no.

Probably the greatest living sportsman in this country

have there been a lot of sudden deaths amongst the sporting community recently then?

Maybe Giggs n Redgrave give him a run but thats it

if it's gonna be giggs we'd better get the voting in now in case he's shit for the rest of the year

utter pish, PDC paid out £5m Last year, and upped the money to £7M this year.

This aside, Taylor is one of the most recognisable sports people in Britian today, he is on the face of everything related to Darts, PDC, PLD, Sky Sports, Wii/PS2/3/PSP games.

You can't deny it Bolty

You dont even have him in your sig pic Dave ... tut !

I disagree. If you aren't into darts then who cares how many wii and PSP games he's on

He's also, the odd appearance on question of sport aside, on exclusively on Sky. Don't underestimate the impact this has on lack of public perception

Same applies to the boxers whilst the snooker players..on bbc for the masters/worlds...retain profiles in excess of the dwindling popularity of their sport because of exposure on terrestial

I think you're confusing someone that you recognise with someone that other people would recognise

assuming that pic that bolt posted earlier is of him then I for one don't recognise the guy at all and am sure most people wouldn't

compare this to previous winners- hoy, calzaghe, phillips, flintoff, holmes, wilkinson, radcliffe, beckham, redgrave, lewis, owen, rusedski, hill, edwards, christie, mansell and so on. all well known faces. there really is no comparison

i beg to differ, id be lucky to recognise half of the people you have just mentioned.

LMAO .. You would also recognise your Mum, but I wouldnt know who she was.

Just because you recognise him, doesnt mean everyone else would.

True sporting icons appeal to a much wider audience than just their specialist subject audience, Taylor through the snobbery of the broadsheet press and the lack of terrestrial TV coverage just is not a widely recognised sporting figure.

I agree that he should be ... look back at the likes of Bristow, Jocky Wilson, Leighton Rees, Cliff Lazerenko, John Lowe and the others ... they were well know recognised faces ... because they were on the tellybox nearly every weekend.

LOLOLOL

Which 50% of these wouldn't you recognise?

Sir Chris hoy

Joe calzaghe

Zara phillips

Freddie flintoff

Kelly holmes

Jonny wilkinson

Paula radcliffe

 beckham

Sir Steve redgrave

Lennox lewis

Michael owen

Greg rusedski

Damon hill

Jonathan edwards

Linford christie

Nigel mansell


I think you have to accept your interests, football aside, are towards minority sports if you genuinely can't identify that lot!

Not Minority sports, just sports that don't lick ass

!!!!!!

Incredible.

fyp

i don't see why that incredible, i can recognise their names from sports as Motor racing, rugby and tennis......all of which are utter pish sports.

I wouldn't know them if they passed me in the street tho, since their sports is drivel

and i ain't lying about that list Bolt, thats me being deadly honest

talk to me about Sir Steve Redgrave Scottish Dave

you must be the only person in the world that wouldn't recognise mansell

Are you saying you don't recognise them or you don't like what they do?

Do you agree that, in the years they won, they may have been more popular/famous than any darts player?

i know he was in the olympics, and won about 10 gold medal or something like that, but i wouldn't know what he looks like, i hate the Olympics............ I only recognise Paula Radcliffe cos she done a pish by the side of the road on TV!

I know he had a moustache, and my dad said my old teacher in High school looked like him after one parents evening, but still i wouldn't recognise him, Im sure he retired when i was about 11 or 12, so why should i recognise him?

I don't recognise them, mainly because i don't like/take an interest in their sport.

no i can't agree with that as if they weren't popular with me, then how am i supposed to know how popular they were with the public

I don't recognise them, mainly because i don't like/take an interest in their sport.

no i can't agree with that as if they weren't popular with me, then how am i supposed to know how popular they were with the public
[/quote]

Would you agree that someone winning the Olympics (Billions of viewers) or a successful sporting member of the Royal Family (very famous) or indeed a rugby player who won the World Cup may just have the edge with the public in general, over a darts player?

 I understand your argument if it was the 'Scotish Dave Sport Personality of the Year' but I'm not sure if you could get Laddies to run a book on it.

Ever heard of taking a wider perspective Dave?

My perspective would be:

Phil Taylor is by far the best in his sport. Incontrovertible. However its a minority sport, not on terrestial TV (apart from a rival and second rate championship) and thus he has no hope of getting a gong voted for by the general public.

not really TBH.

I personally think its harder to win 14 world championships/10 world matchplay's not to mention every darts tourney is the world today more than once and have a 3 dart average of over 100 eveytime you play, as well as holding the highest 3 dart average in recorded history with 116.01 which he achived last year in aberdeen! IMO this is a much greater acheivement than to win one world cup, or one/two gold medals, or whatever it was that Miss Phillips won.

This is my views anyway.

shouldn't it be other's that take a wider perspective, if its only a minority sport?

maybe then he would get what he deserves.

Dave ffs it is not how important their achievements are, it is how they are seen by the general public. Therefore Phil Taylor will never win SPOTY ever, whether he deserves it or not.

When i did my PGCE (teacher training) there was a lad on the course called Phil Taylor, so I nicknamed him "The Power" less than 1/4 of the course had a clue why and less than half of them had heard him when i explained who he was.

How can they if they do not have access to watching him?

Outside the UK, the Dutch and some North Americans (John Part I can think of, I remember one American too but not his name), which countries play darts anyway?

I personally don't know anyone that doesn't have access to Sky somehow. so saying that can't get access to him, is not really a fair point.

But isn't it the British that vote for SPOTY therefore it doesn't matter which other countries play darts.

But its Sports Personality of the Year, Not Who's the best at their chosen game over the last decade and a half.


Phil Talyor may have a great personality but the public don't see it. (because they don't watch darts)

I was seeking to make the counter point to yours

Taylor's achievements are better than winning a gold medal?

How so lol? To win a gold medal you only need to beat the best competitors from every nation on the earth. As far as I am aware less than 10 countries worldwide play darts



UK Population access to Sky Sports: about 6 million households. ie many many don't


If you want a look at the impact of sky coverage v terrestial take a look at the cricket:

2009: 1st Test Day 1 on SKY 443,000. Peak 948,000

2005: 2nd Test Day 1 on Ch4 1.8m Peak 2.8m

A huge difference, especially when you consider the extra hype this time pre-series

i personally think it is, considering Darts players now-a-days are far better than they were years ago, to win that many titles against a much better group of players consistantly is harder than winning a gold medal. if it wasn't for his talents, there would be so many world class darts players getting world coverage, another testiment to the player he is.

Just LOL very hard, we are going to have to agree to completely disagree

Getting world coverage? where? how? Which darts players get world coverage exactly? 

Walk down the streets of Paris, Berlin, Buenos Aires, Rejkavik, Copenhagen, Vladivostok, Tokyo and Nairobi with a picture of any darts player from history and I'd be staggered if anyone recognised them

You don't recognise all those????

wow

At the moment, its only Taylor, however if he wasn't there, Barnie, Wade, Anderson etc would all be very well known sporting millionaires by now.

they would be millionaires because of sky, but like taylor none would be very well known at all, outside those who like darts and/or have sky sports

agree to disagree as you said, but he still deserves it, probably more than any mentioned on that list

Not knowing Flintoff or Wilkinson. LOL Agree with Bolt [ ] True.
You'd have to not watch the news or pick up a newspaper for the last 10 years.
Ashes and Rugby World Cup's make the news. Taylor winning a darts competition doesn't.
To win a Gold Medal is pretty tough. You train for 4 years to peak at the right time and be the best in the world.
If Taylor loses a World Championship (like he has) he comes back next year and has another go.

I couldn't recognise them at all mate, if i see something in the paper that doesn't interest me, ill skip past it without taking a second glance at it. doesn't matter how much their sport if cover in any medium, ill still keep skipping passed it.

Both these players play for an english team at a shitey sport, therefore why the hell would i take an interest in either of them?

From a man who loves UFC I expected better of you than to think Darts>Rugby or Cricket.

using that arguement only proves that you neednt be the best to win a gold medal - if your competition who has been the best for the previous 3.5 years is injured or not peaked!

I think you would be surprised how many people WHO WATCH SPORT - and therefore vote would recognise and understand his achievements.

There has also been a huge oversight here too. The only reason calzaghe won, is because he complained the year before about being .............................. champion for 13 years and not getting recognition for it!

As for minority sports not winning - i am on the floor laughing.............. Zara Phillips! .......... chris hoy - 2 out of the last 3 years .............. and they won because of achievement in their chosen sports, which are very much minority - less so than darts in terms of TV audience and prize money. Ok Phillips
was assisted by a poor year in sport generally, but still, for sporting achievement nowhere near Taylor.

It is a disgrace that he isnt championed as a national hero. Just because he is shaped like a capital 'D'. Ironically he is dead against alcohol in darts and frequently speaks out about it - i guess he likes his food!

Theres never been anyone who has dominated darts for so long like Phil Taylor before and if he cant win spoty no darts player ever will, darts is nowhere popular as it was years ago when bbc showed Taylors mentor Bristow playing Lowe, local league would have up to 18 leagues in the winter now its lucky to have 5 leagues with teams hardly having enough players to finish the season, didn't they used to say something like darts is the 2nd most played sport in this country after football, very much doubt that nowadays, yeah Taylors a credit to his sport and if darts was popular with the TV viewers he would win it at least one year but this just proves nobody is interested so why vote.

Taylor should employ Max Clifford if he craves wider public recognition.

FYP

If Taylor got his top off and oiled himself up a bit, Dave might add him to his sig pic :D

Carl Fogarty was never in with a shout of winning SPOTY, and he completely dominated his field for years.  Hundreds of thousands used to go to watch him compete live, and yet he didn't get a look in.

Oh, and to say that you know who Paula Radcliffe is just because of her 'toilet break' is laughable.  She's probably the best British athlete of all time - and currently holds the world record (or world best) for every road race distance from 10K and above. 

If there was someone who deserves it even more than Taylor it's Tony McCoy - he competes on terrestrial TV every Saturday throughout the entire winter, completely dominating his sport, yet purely and simply becuase he's never won a Grand National he hasn't won SPOTY (though he did get a 3rd once).

Bob Nutt of Angling. Dominated his sport for 25 years, and its a massive participation sport in the UK

Never came close to SPOTY.

Got to be a major sport, or an immense Olympic achievement, or a minor royal, or a GP driver (huge petrolhead fan base) to win it. Even the incidence of boxing winners is far less than it used to be, exactly correlated with boxing's fall from public consciousness

Darts, Angling, Motorcycling.....none qualify

He actually 'won' SPOTY back in the early 90s, in terms of the fact he received the most votes from the public. However, the BBC disqualified him because they said his votes were mostly from a campaign organised by the Angling Times.

Justin Fashanu would have also won it as well.

Eric 'The Eel' Moussambani should have won it but the corrupt bastards at BBC didn't include him because he's not only fucking shite at his sport but he's also not British.

What sort of BS is that?

That didn't stop Greg Rusedski winning it.

Orly?

Best British runner of all time maybe, but athlete?

Geo

Athlete in terms of someone who does athletics.    Who would you have above her?

Daley Thompson

Arguably.

But how many times did he actually compete in his event?  How long did he dominate for?  He's definitely up there, but I'd personally place Radcliffe ahead of him.

john regis

but, Radcliffe has failed a lot of times when it has really mattered..ie successive Olympics


Could make a case for Coe, Jonathan Edwards, Allan Wells, David Hemery, Gunnell too

Zola Budd

Eddie the Eagle

Phil Taylor?

Kelly Holmes too


all arguable, all a matter of opinion. Do think Radcliffe's failures at Olympics count against her

Radcliffe is the best in the world at road running, rather than the shorter track events.  I don't remember Daley being a great 1,500m runner.

I don't think a case could be made for any of the others you've listed.  But it's all down to opinion, so maybe you can.  Gordon Pirie was another great athlete and he did win SPOTY (in '55).  He didn't win an Olympic gold either.

Radcliffe is the best in the world at road running, rather than the shorter track events. 


but she failed in Olympic marathons too


btw I am a big fan of hers. My kids go to a school on Paula Radcliffe Way in her home town! Just think she was intensely frustrating to be a fan of when it really mattered

racist.

Daley Thompson never shat himself during an international competition.

Tanni Grey Thompson

(http://www.manxathletics.com/2004features/Kris.jpeg)

So if someone's ill or injured for two events, it detracts from her otherwise brilliant record?

Yup, fraid so. Olympics are where it is at for an Athlete surely?

He did snap his pole once though.

Can you blame him, it's foooking massive!

In the history books it will matter, people will look back and say her bottle went when it came to the Olympics, the public are in love with the Olympics, forget marathons or world champs, if you do it at the Olympics you get the success and adulation of kelly holmes, you mangle it like radcliffe, you'll be on the boarders of being celebrated as one of the all time greats, people will have doubts, the public demand Olympic success of their sporting heroes in athletics.

Possibly.  I'm sure world records, world championships, and grand prix events are also important.  Does anyone remember who won the women's marathon in Athens?  Is she a greater athlete than Paula - she has an Olympic gold so she must be?

OK - so those who don't follow athletics except for one week every four years won't rate her.  I'm sure she'll get over that.

I'm sure she won't..which is why she was soo upset when she bottled it.

Interesting stuff

Personally, without Olympic gold a world class athlete's record cannot be compared with world class athlete's with Olympic golds

Just my view

i dont think she will, all the other titles and no olympic gold, not an easy thing to get over, i'm not really sure what you're saying here? the Olympics are a bunch of shit?

every athlete ive ever heard talk about their life/career has said that Olympic gold ranks far above everything else, world records, world champs, dominating the circuit etc, all anyone cares about is showing that Olympic gold to their grandchildren when they re 60 years old and telling them how they won it, who gives a shit about marathons in terms of prestige, it barley even gets a mention by the 10 o clock news that sunday.

also the Olympic success of Kelly Holmes made her an absolute fortune and and insta multi millionaire, you just wont get that public acceptance without the Olympic success, you mention those that dont follow athletics, theyre the ones that DO follow the Olympics, and cheer on their country, and hope for a new sporting hero, who's imagination was captured by kelly holmes two unexpected gold medals.

Unfortunately when you say the name kelly holmes you think of her amazing achievement, it's just the thought her name immediately evokes, whereas radcliffes name indubitably casts an imaige of failure, crying on the road side, consistent Olympic failure, theres always a cloud over her legacy when you say her name.

lol. athletics grand prix events are probs less important than darts

paula radcliffe would chop her arm off to be that women, no matter how mediocre she is/was.

no one cares whos better, no one cared then, now or in 20 years when theyre all retired and she's showing her medal off in a bar somewhere to all her friends and family, she turned up and did it on the day, no one cares about ranking and whos best at the Olympics, you get the medal you;re in the history books, end off.

like boldie said radcliffe seemed to give a shit about this one event that shouldnt matter when she pulled up and cried her heart out on the roadside and was said to be depressed for weeks after, sounds some reaction for just another race?

[  ] Paula radcliffe isn't a millionaire through her running

If Paua's in it for public adoration, then yes she needs to win an Olympic gold (and it still wouldn't be enough).  That wasn't the debate though, was it?

of course it would be enough, it would round off her career perfectly.

I know she's got dough, i was just making the point about how the Olympics is on a different level, kelly holmes wouldnt be where she is now if she'd done what she done at the Commonwealth, European or even world championships, set for life instantly.

if you are saying that to be an athlete you must compete in athletics I'd probs agree. As far as I'm concerned, many other sports competitors are athletes..........rowing,cycling,judo,boxing, gymnastics........ etc etc.

Therefore my greatest British athlete would be Sir Steve for greatness, longevity in the sport and of course, doing it when it really matters to the public.

Geo

PMSL

So funny, Dave is off his work sick bored out of his nut and you're all indulging him queueing up trying to get him to change his mind!

Its Scottish Dave ffs you should all know better  :D

Nice work Dave  rotflmfao

Bolt FTW. At anything. Ever.

I think it's enough that he's getting a tshirt. spoty as well would be ott