blonde poker forum

Just after a few thoughts on this hand.

Walrus is 71/43 over very small sample.
Dumbass is 22/18 over 450 hands. Generally plays aggro after the flop.

Pre flop is standard call oop. What about flop? Call, pass or raise? Anyone lead out?

sochita8 ($44.15)
Evilpie2 ($150)
Knuttn57 ($124)
walus1971 ($45.46)
YOUDUMBASS ($137)

sochita8 posts (SB) $0.50
Evilpie2 posts (BB) $1
walus1971 posts (BB) $1.50

Dealt to Evilpie2 Jd Ahrt 7d Th
fold,
walus1971 raises to $4.50
YOUDUMBASS calls $4
fold,
Evilpie2 calls $3

FLOP ($12.50) 9h 6d Kc
check,
walus1971 bets $13
YOUDUMBASS calls $13
Evilpie2 ??

fold

you have a double beely buster and 2 back door flush draws

dont like it at all in PLO

He has 2 nut belly buster draws 8 or a queen. As played id call flop and reassess turn, the short stack isnt gonna be passin if u reraise the flop.

this looks good, u want multiway action with a relatively weak nut draw, ur not fussed about protection and ur not gonna get shorty to fold.

i dont think you really want to be calling 10% of your stack with this blank comes on turn your fcked

even if a card like the 4d comes on turn you really shouldnt be putting more chips in but the weak flush draw makes your hand look stronger than it is

but 8 outs via one shorty and one deepstack doesnt give good enough implied odds for you to catch

this is cash. In cash you have to put at least 10% of your stack in with a hand this big

Also taking into consideration that Walus is playing the shortstack. I'd like to know how he got this. Did he sit down short and just double up? Is he down after sitting down with the max stack? Or did he sit down with a poor choice of stacksize? (maybe even his entire roll, looking for a double up??)

 I'd want to keep Youdumbass in the pot as well...deffo don't want to scare him away but that might again depend on Walus' situation.

Folding here is the only really bad move...I don't mind potting at all but flatting might get more money in depending on Walus' situation.

i'm calling the flop, see no reason to try to get dumbass out. Shortie is going to do the betting for you if the turn is good leaving dumbass in a dodgy spot and liable to make a mistake trying to push you out.
Alternatively if the turn is average for you, say giving you the FD but not completing your hand i like leading out for half the shorties stack.

Thanks for the responses so far. I make the call which I think is fairly standard here.

I don't want big stack to pass and my draw isn't big enough to want the lot in against shorty.

Iron I can't undertsand passing here. We've got 8 nut straight outs on a rainbow board. Do you pass a nut flush draw here because it's similar?

Anyway on to the turn card

 5h

Gives me the nut flush draw as well as still having nut straight outs.

What's our move? Lead out or check?

Thought you might say that.

Its a turn thats made our draw a lot stronger but it quietly easy has made dumbass his hand, you dont mind too much if the short stacks got there with 7 8 cos your obv calling that bet. But with you being oop i think you have to decide if your going through with the hand for all of your stack. Leading the turn will mean dumbass can get most of his stack in, whereas if you check..short stack bets and dumbass rr with the nuts your again stuck with the same decision, but if you lead out and then he shoves on you albeit with the nuts you'll be getting priced in. So in summary lead and then get in although the turn could have been better.

but its so perfect, i had to.

I think people leading 1/2 pot to price themselves into making a call is fundamentally bad poker.

Even with such a big draw? If you decide your playing for all you stack it doesnt really matter how you get it in, no?

Sorry only just responded guys.

In the hand I went for the lead out option.

I actually lead for full pot wanting to be up against shorty but get rid of big stack.

Big stack then shoves. I obv have to call because I've got loads of nut outs and I'm priced in.

Have spoken to a few omaha people and a lot don't like the lead. Others aren't sure.

Leading to deliberately price yourself in has to be a spew. If this is the plan then you're not getting the right price really.

If I check the turn, shorty shoves, big stack shoves and I probs have to pass although I hate it a lot.

I'm still not sure what's the right move. The stacks make it really awkward especially having shorty in the middle knowing he's going to bet pot if i check. Big stack could then iso raise with a worse draw than me because he's got the right price to be HU against shorty. I then pass even though I'm ahead.

Big stack had 78 for the straight.

I got there fortunately. HEM put me at 30% so I make the right call but the lead out is the bit I wasn't sure about and still aren't.

Yeah thats the bit that makes the hand ultra gay

If you raise half shorties stack on the turn then everything is a bit simpler i think, a fold.

If the bigger stack shoves we can make the assumption he has at least the nuts with no redraws, our best scenario in terms of putting the rest of the dollars in, but it's still a losing prop i think based on the stacks if we do call his shove. Something like 105 to call for around 95 return on ave? This is best case and can get uglier if he has similar draws to bigger straights or flukey boat potential.

I always thought people missed loads of opportunities to manipulate shortstacks to their advantage when i played a lot, i haven't played for ages though. Basically force the big stack to turn his cards over by having the shortie make the bigger raise for you.

Bet folding here seems really spewy and by betting so small I'd assume you were drawing as you'd put more money in if you had a made hand/nuts to protect your hand.

I'd often shove on you here with 2 pair for value as you've pretty much turned your hand face up.

If i do have the nuts and i bet pot here to protect i only get it in against another nut hand, big draws flat and do me on the river either by gettting there or bluffing me off my hand.

If the shorties shove is assumed by the 2 big stacks then you have to assume i am looking to keep the betting open back round to me at worse, forcing you to junk anything not good enough to see the river for your entire stack.

This way you have 1 chance only to bluff me off the hand and i seem very interested in keeping the betting open, a brave jam with 2 pair imo.

[  ] Makes sense

does to me.

maybe thats why you jam 2 pair into the probable nuts in this situation.

No competant player makes the bet you suggested with the nuts. I'll jam K9 and show a profit.

i think thats outright wrong. we'll just have to disagree.

If evil pie has hit the nuts what do you suggest his best action should be?