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Poker Forums => Poker Hand Analysis => Topic started by: Mitch on December 22, 2009, 05:42:35 AM



Title: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: Mitch on December 22, 2009, 05:42:35 AM
Ok hand from the DTD Monte Carlo Main Event (Min cash FTW!). 30k Starting stack, now on a 75min clock.

Blinds at 1k/2k/200a

Im sitting on around 80k

UTG limps, I limp in mid position with  Qh Th, button calls, SB makes up and BB Checks, so 5 way to the flop. (Pot 13.8k)

 Qc Tc 4c

Checked to me, i bet 9,800, Only the SB Calls, playing 60K. I have seen the guy at DTD before but never played with him and he has only just moved to the table about 2 orbits ago. Only info i have is that he 4 bet shoved with Queens and got called by AJ which hit the ace. He was titlted up a bit and was ready to shove his remaining stack in and leave, but since then he has trebled up with Aces that he limped under the gun and survived in a multi way pot.

The Turn brings the  4h. There is now 33,400 in the pot and villain has 50K behind, I cover him.

How do you play the hand from here...Pot controll or does the hand need to be protected on such a draw heavy board, obv he could also have a big made hand.


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: action man on December 22, 2009, 06:48:38 AM
assuming villain has checked the turn.. you can check behind and look for a blank to pick off a missed draw bluff, or you could bet/call the turn. If you are for some reason thinking of bet/folding the turn then check behind the turn and either call his river bet or make a value bet on the river.


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: Rupert on December 22, 2009, 07:10:22 AM
bet/call turn for value from worse q and for protection vs clubs.  if he jams snap.  i think checkings pretty bad here


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: Cottonbud on December 22, 2009, 07:26:41 AM
This is a really interesting hand so this is a limped pot so no-ones gonna have 10's or Q's here right, 4's maybe but turn just made that really unlikely. So chances are SB could have a hand like QX, KJ with the K or J of clubs, A4 with the ace of clubs, A10/K10 with the big club, the bare ace of clubs with no pair. Could he complete with a hand like Q-4/10-4 theres a good chance I guess. Flopped flush is a possibilty I'm not certain if he would raise the turn with a flopped flush when the board pairs though, but as you cant have Q's, 10's or 4's here their is a good chance he would if he's a decent thinking player.

Based on these range of hands I think you should bet the turn for value and to price out the Pair/SD + FD hands and get an extra street of value from QX as I doubt he is passing a Queen on this turn tbh. If he raises you here your gonna have to re-asess he knows you don't have QQ/1010/44, so depending on his ability I prob would bet/fold to a raise.


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: pleno1 on December 22, 2009, 02:31:19 PM
For sure bet the turn, it's a paired board so may foldflush draws, im happy to take the pot dow now and cant really see many good river cards apart from like 2-7 hearts/diamonds/spades.


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: jakally on December 22, 2009, 03:21:44 PM
Bet/fold the turn with top 2 pair and only 1.5x pot effective stacks is just massive spew. This is a pretty obvious bet/call imo so I'm guessing from the presence of this thread you probably got snap-shoved on by a flush and are wondering if you got owned. I think it's just a cooler tho, ul.

This is Mitch............... he doesn't do unlucky.


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: GreekStein on December 22, 2009, 03:55:21 PM
Bet/fold the turn with top 2 pair and only 1.5x pot effective stacks is just massive spew. This is a pretty obvious bet/call imo so I'm guessing from the presence of this thread you probably got snap-shoved on by a flush and are wondering if you got owned. I think it's just a cooler tho, ul.

This is Mitch............... I pwned him with QQ


Sorry Mitch.


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: Blatch on December 22, 2009, 04:19:20 PM
Bet/fold the turn with top 2 pair and only 1.5x pot effective stacks is just massive spew. This is a pretty obvious bet/call imo so I'm guessing from the presence of this thread you probably got snap-shoved on by a flush and are wondering if you got owned. I think it's just a cooler tho, ul.

This is Mitch............... I pwned him with QQ


Sorry Mitch.

This is Mitch ............... I pwned him with QQ too (and got a good slowroll in too)


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: Cottonbud on December 22, 2009, 04:46:20 PM
Bet/fold the turn with top 2 pair and only 1.5x pot effective stacks is just massive spew. This is a pretty obvious bet/call imo so I'm guessing from the presence of this thread you probably got snap-shoved on by a flush and are wondering if you got owned. I think it's just a cooler tho, ul.

I guess if you bet 20k here on the turn you cant pass, but if you bet like 13k I don't think its too bad if you fold to his shove its not a cash game you cant rebuy and hes like always showing you a flush here or A4 with the ace of clubs. I think maybe you bet too much on the flop but given how many players were in the pot, I'm not so sure. Maybe checking the turn isn't such a bad idea if we are expecting him to shove a good percentage of the time, then perhaps re-evaluate on a blank river.


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: kinboshi on December 22, 2009, 05:32:15 PM
Bet/fold the turn with top 2 pair and only 1.5x pot effective stacks is just massive spew. This is a pretty obvious bet/call imo so I'm guessing from the presence of this thread you probably got snap-shoved on by a flush and are wondering if you got owned. I think it's just a cooler tho, ul.

This is Mitch............... I pwned him with QQ


Sorry Mitch.

This is Mitch ............... I pwned him with QQ too (and got a good slowroll in too)

:D

Thread is useless without knowing what Mitch had just been eating, and what he'd ordered next.



Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: RED-DOG on December 22, 2009, 05:35:22 PM
Bet/fold the turn with top 2 pair and only 1.5x pot effective stacks is just massive spew. This is a pretty obvious bet/call imo so I'm guessing from the presence of this thread you probably got snap-shoved on by a flush and are wondering if you got owned. I think it's just a cooler tho, ul.

This is Mitch............... I pwned him with QQ


Sorry Mitch.

This is Mitch ............... I pwned him with QQ too (and got a good slowroll in too)

:D

Thread is useless without knowing what Mitch had just been eating, and what he'd ordered next.





Thread is useless without knowing what Mitch had just been eating....

LARD


and what he'd ordered next.....


LARD


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: Dry em on December 22, 2009, 05:35:36 PM
Bet/fold the turn with top 2 pair and only 1.5x pot effective stacks is just massive spew. This is a pretty obvious bet/call imo so I'm guessing from the presence of this thread you probably got snap-shoved on by a flush and are wondering if you got owned. I think it's just a cooler tho, ul.

Can't really see many live players check raising turn here and top 2 being any good....


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: pleno1 on December 22, 2009, 06:38:24 PM
Yeah, if we get raised we have to fold, beating nothing, he pot controls like 90% of his range and value shoves the other 10%


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: MANTIS01 on December 22, 2009, 07:32:40 PM
I agree the flop bet is too big. I know you're trying to thin the field but the speculative limpers hoping to catch a flop will release their hands pretty easy if your image is solid. You can take that bet down to 1/2 pot and you'll still get the same result. There is no urgency to turn our own speculative limp into a big pot situation here. And we wouldn't bet that much with the top of our range either. I think the problem with paying a lot to thin the field in these multi-way pots is you still don't know what you've thinned it down to. Having paid a high price for this shit information the pot is 35k and our oppo has 50k and our choices are limited. Check behind and call river imo.


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: AlexMartin on December 23, 2009, 07:20:41 PM
v 90% of the field bet fold turn. think i prefer check back tbh, might be a bit hindsight and need a bit more player info.



Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: Mitch on December 23, 2009, 09:59:45 PM
Cheers for the responses, at the time i just really didnt know what to do here.

I think his range is about equally as likely to be a flopped flush as it is a big drawing hand or pair and FD. I assume he would prob come over the top with a worse two pair and bottom set on the flop. Didnt want to just check back and then get bluffed off the pot when a scare card came on the river, which is kind of like 3/4 of the deck.

After a dwell I decided to bet 22.5k and he pretty quickly shoved the rest in for 27.5k more. Now theres 114.4k in pot and 27.5k to call.

I eventually made what i now feel was probably a bad call, although a few ppl have said that they would play it the same way. All those lovely green thousand chips staring at me from the middle of the pot were far more attractive than folding and grinding my arse off. He flips over  7c 2c and i need to catch any pair up to scoop. Thankfully earlier on in the day i had brushed my jacket past Blatch and therefore binked a  Ts on the river to rake in a nice pot. MBN?! Yeah it is.

i later found out the other guy is a massive rock and obviously if i have more info like this on the guy it becomes a pretty easy pass on the turn as played.

Cheers, Mitch.


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: Blatch on December 23, 2009, 10:23:11 PM
Cheers for the responses, at the time i just really didnt know what to do here.

I think his range is about equally as likely to be a flopped flush as it is a big drawing hand or pair and FD. I assume he would prob come over the top with a worse two pair and bottom set on the flop. Didnt want to just check back and then get bluffed off the pot when a scare card came on the river, which is kind of like 3/4 of the deck.

After a dwell I decided to bet 22.5k and he pretty quickly shoved the rest in for 27.5k more. Now theres 114.4k in pot and 27.5k to call.

I eventually made what i now feel was probably a bad call, although a few ppl have said that they would play it the same way. All those lovely green thousand chips staring at me from the middle of the pot were far more attractive than folding and grinding my arse off. He flips over  7c 2c and i need to catch any pair up to scoop. Thankfully earlier on in the day i had brushed my jacket past Blatch and therefore binked a  Ts on the river to rake in a nice pot. MBN?! Yeah it is.

i later found out the other guy is a massive rock and obviously if i have more info like this on the guy it becomes a pretty easy pass on the turn as played.

Cheers, Mitch.


Can I get my £20 back?


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: Mitch on December 23, 2009, 10:39:13 PM
Can i get my £20 back?

Unfortunately that note is locked in an guard surveyed safe and is to be used as part of the buy in for the next £1ker to ensure i have run good credentials throughout.

Thanks.


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: Blatch on December 23, 2009, 10:43:32 PM
Can i get my £20 back?

Unfortunately that note is locked in an guard surveyed safe and is to be used as part of the buy in for the next £1ker to ensure i have run good credentials throughout.

Thanks.

Why not just sell me 1%?

I buy %'s at 0.9:1 now for gtd run goodaments


Title: Re: Hand from Monte Carlo @ DTD
Post by: Cottonbud on December 30, 2009, 02:32:02 PM
Raise or fold pre FTW!