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Title: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: DaveShoelace on August 24, 2010, 07:03:22 AM http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/29/news-views-gossip/cheating-collusion-alleged-chat-log-between-sorel-mizzi-thorladen-x-mttc-859424/
Cliffs: Pretty damn convincing chat log posted between Mizzi and someone else where he details a plan to multi account a bunch of tournaments. Once a cheater always a cheater is pretty much the response from the 2+2 peeps, could be a good ;popcorn; thread Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: GreekStein on August 24, 2010, 10:23:16 AM wow that's real bad, what a POS.
Has he said anything about this since it came out? Have his site commented on his status as a sponsored pro? Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: DaveShoelace on August 24, 2010, 10:24:18 AM Not yet, I think its only just emerged overnight
Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: SuuPRlim on August 24, 2010, 10:24:33 AM Middy gave sorel a pretty good "dressing down" in vegas.
Hitthehole's constant march to the tune of ethical well-being continues. but yeah he's a scumbag this thread could be sick :) Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: paulpitchford on August 24, 2010, 10:26:08 AM The other guy involved has denied it and recons he's working with full tilt investigators to prove so. I think they've got to e very stupid to have chatted about this online somewhere IMO.
Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: kinboshi on August 24, 2010, 10:29:34 AM Not being funny, but surely this sort of thing is old hat and has been going on for quite a while? It's not anything groundbreaking to use some remote desktop connection to drive someone else's PC, and I've taken over for people in comps using teamviewer before. Not to cheat though, but surely loads of people must?
Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: AlrightJack on August 24, 2010, 10:35:55 AM Not being funny, but surely this sort of thing is old hat and has been going on for quite a while? It's not anything groundbreaking to use some remote desktop connection to drive someone else's PC, and I've taken over for people in comps using teamviewer before. Not to cheat though, but surely loads of people must? erm, isn't taking over for people a form of cheating...albeit less serious than other forms, but unethical nevertheless and against most sites' Ts & Cs Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: DaveShoelace on August 24, 2010, 10:38:46 AM Its not just taking over from people, there is planning on the chat logs to have 6 horses in each tournament, at some point they are going to draw the same table as each other.
Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: GreekStein on August 24, 2010, 10:54:05 AM [ x ] Karma scammed in Europe
:) Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: gatso on August 24, 2010, 10:54:59 AM Not being funny, but surely this sort of thing is old hat and has been going on for quite a while? It's not anything groundbreaking to use some remote desktop connection to drive someone else's PC, and I've taken over for people in comps using teamviewer before. Not to cheat though, but surely loads of people must? yeah, it's supposedly from 2 years ago Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: Boba Fett on August 24, 2010, 11:00:06 AM Middy gave sorel a pretty good "dressing down" in vegas. Details plz?Hitthehole's constant march to the tune of ethical well-being continues. but yeah he's a scumbag this thread could be sick :) Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: kinboshi on August 24, 2010, 11:15:16 AM Not being funny, but surely this sort of thing is old hat and has been going on for quite a while? It's not anything groundbreaking to use some remote desktop connection to drive someone else's PC, and I've taken over for people in comps using teamviewer before. Not to cheat though, but surely loads of people must? erm, isn't taking over for people a form of cheating...albeit less serious than other forms, but unethical nevertheless and against most sites' Ts & Cs Probably. If I'm not in the tournament myself, then it's only the same as me standing behind the player whilst he plays, or sitting on his machine and playing. Again, this surely happens all the time? Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: GreekStein on August 24, 2010, 11:21:14 AM Not being funny, but surely this sort of thing is old hat and has been going on for quite a while? It's not anything groundbreaking to use some remote desktop connection to drive someone else's PC, and I've taken over for people in comps using teamviewer before. Not to cheat though, but surely loads of people must? erm, isn't taking over for people a form of cheating...albeit less serious than other forms, but unethical nevertheless and against most sites' Ts & Cs Probably. If I'm not in the tournament myself, then it's only the same as me standing behind the player whilst he plays, or sitting on his machine and playing. Again, this surely happens all the time? knife crime happens a lot too. Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: outragous76 on August 24, 2010, 11:26:15 AM how do you get scammed for 1/2 mil?
what did they do? Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: GreekStein on August 24, 2010, 11:29:20 AM how do you get scammed for 1/2 mil? what did they do? HU high stakes PLO with marked cards. :) GTFO Sorel Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: wallysnooper on August 24, 2010, 11:33:51 AM Middy gave sorel a pretty good "dressing down" in vegas. Details plz?Hitthehole's constant march to the tune of ethical well-being continues. but yeah he's a scumbag this thread could be sick :) Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: snoopy1239 on August 24, 2010, 01:04:53 PM Not being funny, but surely this sort of thing is old hat and has been going on for quite a while? It's not anything groundbreaking to use some remote desktop connection to drive someone else's PC, and I've taken over for people in comps using teamviewer before. Not to cheat though, but surely loads of people must? erm, isn't taking over for people a form of cheating...albeit less serious than other forms, but unethical nevertheless and against most sites' Ts & Cs Probably. If I'm not in the tournament myself, then it's only the same as me standing behind the player whilst he plays, or sitting on his machine and playing. Again, this surely happens all the time? Hi. I'd be careful about this, it's definitely considered cheating on most sites I play on and it's not something you'd want to confess to in writing. Gary Clarke lost his Vegas package because he lost his connection and his friend took over for him for five minutes whilst he drove over to his house. Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: The Camel on August 24, 2010, 01:19:10 PM Not being funny, but surely this sort of thing is old hat and has been going on for quite a while? It's not anything groundbreaking to use some remote desktop connection to drive someone else's PC, and I've taken over for people in comps using teamviewer before. Not to cheat though, but surely loads of people must? erm, isn't taking over for people a form of cheating...albeit less serious than other forms, but unethical nevertheless and against most sites' Ts & Cs Probably. If I'm not in the tournament myself, then it's only the same as me standing behind the player whilst he plays, or sitting on his machine and playing. Again, this surely happens all the time? Hi. I'd be careful about this, it's definitely considered cheating on most sites I play on and it's not something you'd want to confess to in writing. Gary Clarke lost his Vegas package because he lost his connection and his friend took over for him for five minutes whilst he drove over to his house. In Stars Ts and Cs it specifically says if your internet connection goes down a friend can take over from you. Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: SirPerceval on August 24, 2010, 01:23:32 PM Not being funny, but surely this sort of thing is old hat and has been going on for quite a while? It's not anything groundbreaking to use some remote desktop connection to drive someone else's PC, and I've taken over for people in comps using teamviewer before. Not to cheat though, but surely loads of people must? poorly disguised "I have a friend post" IMO Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: NoflopsHomer on August 24, 2010, 01:27:03 PM Not being funny, but surely this sort of thing is old hat and has been going on for quite a while? It's not anything groundbreaking to use some remote desktop connection to drive someone else's PC, and I've taken over for people in comps using teamviewer before. Not to cheat though, but surely loads of people must? erm, isn't taking over for people a form of cheating...albeit less serious than other forms, but unethical nevertheless and against most sites' Ts & Cs Probably. If I'm not in the tournament myself, then it's only the same as me standing behind the player whilst he plays, or sitting on his machine and playing. Again, this surely happens all the time? Hi. I'd be careful about this, it's definitely considered cheating on most sites I play on and it's not something you'd want to confess to in writing. Gary Clarke lost his Vegas package because he lost his connection and his friend took over for him for five minutes whilst he drove over to his house. In Stars Ts and Cs it specifically says if your internet connection goes down a friend can take over from you. Was on Everest IIRC Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: tikay on August 24, 2010, 01:29:49 PM Not being funny, but surely this sort of thing is old hat and has been going on for quite a while? It's not anything groundbreaking to use some remote desktop connection to drive someone else's PC, and I've taken over for people in comps using teamviewer before. Not to cheat though, but surely loads of people must? erm, isn't taking over for people a form of cheating...albeit less serious than other forms, but unethical nevertheless and against most sites' Ts & Cs Probably. If I'm not in the tournament myself, then it's only the same as me standing behind the player whilst he plays, or sitting on his machine and playing. Again, this surely happens all the time? Hi. I'd be careful about this, it's definitely considered cheating on most sites I play on and it's not something you'd want to confess to in writing. Gary Clarke lost his Vegas package because he lost his connection and his friend took over for him for five minutes whilst he drove over to his house. In Stars Ts and Cs it specifically says if your internet connection goes down a friend can take over from you. Was on Everest IIRC That would explain the poor internet connection. Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: gatso on August 24, 2010, 01:33:21 PM In Stars Ts and Cs it specifically says if your internet connection goes down a friend can take over from you. isn't it slightly more in depth than that like there needs to have been a network outage and you need to be able to provide proof? I seem to remember reading that sometime recently Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: Bongo on August 24, 2010, 01:38:26 PM In Stars Ts and Cs it specifically says if your internet connection goes down a friend can take over from you. isn't it slightly more in depth than that like there needs to have been a network outage and you need to be able to provide proof? I seem to remember reading that sometime recently Something like that, but I seem to remember the case mentioned being acceptable (i.e. someone takes over while you drive to their house because your connection died). 'Proof' seems a bit lolworthy - you can always pull the plug out and say you had a powercut. Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: gatso on August 24, 2010, 01:48:53 PM ok, doesn't specifically mention requiring proof though maybe in some cases they'd request it
Quote Examples of things which are beyond your control and therefore allowed, subject to PokerStars being able to corroborate with evidence, include: 1. A thunderstorm strikes your location and takes the power down for the surrounding area, so you call a friend to take over your account while you make alternative arrangements. 2. Your child is taken ill and you have to attend hospital, so you call a friend to take over your account. 3. You are playing in a tournament and lose internet access in your home due to a failure of your ISP. You call a friend and he takes over while you make alternative arrangements. Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: kinboshi on August 24, 2010, 02:15:16 PM In the cases I was talking about, it was when someone had to go out unexpectedly.
That wasn't really my point though. I was saying it must happen all the time, and people's incredulity at his actions suggests that they think it isn't widespread. Poker players are hardly the most upstanding citizens (as a whole). Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: Cottonbud on August 24, 2010, 05:53:06 PM Pretty scary how easy that sounds to do! Hopefully online sites can develop a way to spot this sort of cheating?
Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: kinboshi on August 24, 2010, 06:28:13 PM Pretty scary how easy that sounds to do! Hopefully online sites can develop a way to spot this sort of cheating? How? The only thing they can do is to look for players who play in the same tournaments/cash games regularly and look for irregular betting that hints at collusion. If they can't do it this way, then there isn't anyway they can detect it. Using remote desktop software is the same as being in front of the other person's computer and using their keyboard and mouse. Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: Cottonbud on August 24, 2010, 06:45:55 PM Pretty scary how easy that sounds to do! Hopefully online sites can develop a way to spot this sort of cheating? How? The only thing they can do is to look for players who play in the same tournaments/cash games regularly and look for irregular betting that hints at collusion. If they can't do it this way, then there isn't anyway they can detect it. Using remote desktop software is the same as being in front of the other person's computer and using their keyboard and mouse. Worrying! Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: GreekStein on August 24, 2010, 07:24:51 PM Pretty scary how easy that sounds to do! Hopefully online sites can develop a way to spot this sort of cheating? How? The only thing they can do is to look for players who play in the same tournaments/cash games regularly and look for irregular betting that hints at collusion. If they can't do it this way, then there isn't anyway they can detect it. Using remote desktop software is the same as being in front of the other person's computer and using their keyboard and mouse. Worrying! Just keep playing on sky poker where the software is so bad and the players so terrible that even a cheat would be too tilted to try it! Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: gatso on August 24, 2010, 08:10:44 PM Pretty scary how easy that sounds to do! Hopefully online sites can develop a way to spot this sort of cheating? How? The only thing they can do is to look for players who play in the same tournaments/cash games regularly and look for irregular betting that hints at collusion. If they can't do it this way, then there isn't anyway they can detect it. Using remote desktop software is the same as being in front of the other person's computer and using their keyboard and mouse. they can ban the use of remote desktop software if they see it as a serious problem. should be able to detect it shouldn't they? Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: TightPaulFolds on August 24, 2010, 08:52:02 PM Pretty scary how easy that sounds to do! Hopefully online sites can develop a way to spot this sort of cheating? How? The only thing they can do is to look for players who play in the same tournaments/cash games regularly and look for irregular betting that hints at collusion. If they can't do it this way, then there isn't anyway they can detect it. Using remote desktop software is the same as being in front of the other person's computer and using their keyboard and mouse. Pretty sure you can scan for (and ban the use of) remote access software, no? Depends on how invasive the site wants to make its software I guess. FTP say they 'don't know even what you're browsing' but Party do (or did) admit to the likes of screen-scraping, which is an incredible invasion of privacy. And could reveal some remote desktop usage. Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: kinboshi on August 25, 2010, 11:16:33 AM Pretty scary how easy that sounds to do! Hopefully online sites can develop a way to spot this sort of cheating? How? The only thing they can do is to look for players who play in the same tournaments/cash games regularly and look for irregular betting that hints at collusion. If they can't do it this way, then there isn't anyway they can detect it. Using remote desktop software is the same as being in front of the other person's computer and using their keyboard and mouse. they can ban the use of remote desktop software if they see it as a serious problem. should be able to detect it shouldn't they? How? The software itself is being 'used' locally. It's only the computer's display that is being transmitted from the computer via the RDP, and the keyboard and mouse input being sent the other way to the computer. How would the software distinguish between a local input or a remote one? There are probably ways of doing this with firewalls or other software being installed on the client machine - but can't see how this would a feasible option for a poker site. Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: CelticGeezeer on August 25, 2010, 11:26:20 AM They could incorporate the spying software in their poker client.
Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: StuartHopkin on August 25, 2010, 11:27:25 AM Pretty scary how easy that sounds to do! Hopefully online sites can develop a way to spot this sort of cheating? How? The only thing they can do is to look for players who play in the same tournaments/cash games regularly and look for irregular betting that hints at collusion. If they can't do it this way, then there isn't anyway they can detect it. Using remote desktop software is the same as being in front of the other person's computer and using their keyboard and mouse. they can ban the use of remote desktop software if they see it as a serious problem. should be able to detect it shouldn't they? How? The software itself is being 'used' locally. It's only the computer's display that is being transmitted from the computer via the RDP, and the keyboard and mouse input being sent the other way to the computer. How would the software distinguish between a local input or a remote one? There are probably ways of doing this with firewalls or other software being installed on the client machine - but can't see how this would a feasible option for a poker site. Terminate all known remote desktop software processes every five minutes. Sure would make them popular with people trying to work at the same time as play a comp! Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: gatso on August 25, 2010, 11:56:57 AM How? The software itself is being 'used' locally. It's only the computer's display that is being transmitted from the computer via the RDP, and the keyboard and mouse input being sent the other way to the computer. How would the software distinguish between a local input or a remote one? they already do it for a number of progs that are run locally, why not for these if they decided they were a problem? Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: kinboshi on August 25, 2010, 04:09:18 PM I'd love to see a way a poker site could stop me from RDPing into a machine that is running a different version of Windows in a virtual environment in which I've installed and am running the poker software.
Really don't see how they'd be able to stop me from doing this, unless they impose some ridiculously draconian rules on their software that stops it running unless it's in a very specific operating environment. To do this, they'd probably have to supply the hardware as well as the software! Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: thetank on August 25, 2010, 11:45:41 PM I'd love to see a way a poker site could stop me from RDPing into a machine that is running a different version of Windows in a virtual environment in which I've installed and am running the poker software. Really don't see how they'd be able to stop me from doing this, unless they impose some ridiculously draconian rules on their software that stops it running unless it's in a very specific operating environment. To do this, they'd probably have to supply the hardware as well as the software! Hide your comics? Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: Bongo on August 26, 2010, 02:11:15 AM Why bother with remote desktop just buy multiple PCs and multiple internet connections. If it's that profitable to cheat the cost won't be prohibitive - would only need dirt cheap PCs to play poker on and a decent server to host your tracking db.
Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: AlexMartin on August 26, 2010, 04:09:09 AM just wanna hear more about the middy story tbh- sounds quality, i met sorel once, thought he was ridiculously rude and a bit of a cock.
Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: DMorgan on August 26, 2010, 04:15:10 AM I'd love to see a way a poker site could stop me from RDPing into a machine that is running a different version of Windows in a virtual environment in which I've installed and am running the poker software. Really don't see how they'd be able to stop me from doing this, unless they impose some ridiculously draconian rules on their software that stops it running unless it's in a very specific operating environment. To do this, they'd probably have to supply the hardware as well as the software! They know when you're running prohibited software like ICM calculators. You get a popup message in the lobby telling you to close it. Could they not just do the same for the programs/processes that make this possible? Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: SuuPRlim on August 26, 2010, 01:06:28 PM just wanna hear more about the middy story tbh- sounds quality, i met sorel once, thought he was ridiculously rude and a bit of a cock. fraid it's been prohibited from display in the public eye :( Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: Bongo on August 26, 2010, 01:29:18 PM I'd love to see a way a poker site could stop me from RDPing into a machine that is running a different version of Windows in a virtual environment in which I've installed and am running the poker software. Really don't see how they'd be able to stop me from doing this, unless they impose some ridiculously draconian rules on their software that stops it running unless it's in a very specific operating environment. To do this, they'd probably have to supply the hardware as well as the software! They know when you're running prohibited software like ICM calculators. You get a popup message in the lobby telling you to close it. Could they not just do the same for the programs/processes that make this possible? Not when you run it on a different instance of windows. Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: JBravo on August 27, 2010, 09:04:46 PM I'd love to see a way a poker site could stop me from RDPing into a machine that is running a different version of Windows in a virtual environment in which I've installed and am running the poker software. Really don't see how they'd be able to stop me from doing this, unless they impose some ridiculously draconian rules on their software that stops it running unless it's in a very specific operating environment. To do this, they'd probably have to supply the hardware as well as the software! They know when you're running prohibited software like ICM calculators. You get a popup message in the lobby telling you to close it. Could they not just do the same for the programs/processes that make this possible? Not when you run it on a different instance of windows. If i was gonna do something like that then I'd pay to get the sharing software written (well i'd nock it up in 4 or 5 hours), no way anyone can tell what the process is using freely or commercialy available software is just stupid. I'm in no doubt that this is going on now accross all sites, there is too much money to be made for it not to be happening. Where there's money there will be a crooked eliment looking to get their mits on it. sorel is a tool if this is true. Title: Re: Sorel Mizzi Thread on 2+2 Post by: thetank on August 31, 2010, 01:33:49 AM (well i'd nock it up in 4 or 5 hours) oooOOOoooOOOooo |