blonde poker forum

I've been playing live £0.5/£1 cash for a living now for almost 3months, I've had pretty good results, winning about 5k for that period. However I've had bills, rent etc to pay, enjoy spending money having a good time, treating the missus etc and my roll seems to constantly hover around the 2-4k mark. I'm getting really tilted playing with players so much worse than me and am really keen to move up to £1/£2 or £2/£5. I am confident the games are soft enough that I could win at them, but not so soft as to drive me insane. So my question is, how to move up? I reckon if I don't do anything different I could be playing £.50 £1 for a year and never reach a 5figure roll.

I've come up with 3 possible options:

1) Look into getting staked for bigger games
2) Play online MTTs (5-50$) for a month to try and bink a decent 4figure score
3) Take a few random shots at bigger games eg put 1k out of 3k roll into a £2 £5 at DTD this week, hope to run good and never look back...if I lose, grind again for a while, take another shot in a month or something...

4. Put Jamie in the monte Carlo and watch him bink me a 5 figure.

On a serious note, shots ftw

Grind online cash.

You are doing pretty well support to yourself playing £.5/1 live imo. The problem is that this isn't a particular solid strategy from the get go and there is very little chance of you getting out of this "rutt" as the ceiling for your earnings isn't particularly high.

Online is the pretty obv answer, but the games are a lot lot harder online and .5/1 live plays like .05/.1 online. If you are good enough I would go online and grind your arse off to get a roll moving.

I have to ask - why on earth would playing players worse than you tilt you? They are your income.

Playing better players might be more satisfying in some ways, but it would certainly reduce your profit.

50p/£1 is way too small a game to make a genuine living from. Like you, I played this game full time for about a year while I was out of 'proper' work and what a grind it was. Incredibly easy to beat, but variance still hits you wherever you play and with profits being small (they have to be - this is 50p/£1 remember), when you run bad and still have bills to pay, it snookers you somewhat.

It's frustrating I agree not being properly rolled to play higher, especially when the £1/£2 games are even easier to beat in many ways with the straddling and deep stacks, but you have to cut your cloth accordingly..

I always worked on the basis that I would move up if I ever luckboxed a decent sized tournament but that has yet to happen as I seem to run comically bad in coinflipaments.

So I get stuck playing 50p/£1 with the occasional short-stacking forays into £1/2.

I sympathize mate, without at least £20k ring-fenced behind you you're pretty much wasting your time. I would be wary of your profit so far (is it accurate? Be honest)  - 3 months live isn't very many hands really. Wait till you have a horrible downswing - it doesn't matter how good you are when that happens my friend and a 2-4k is pitiful bankroll in real terms as you will probably discover sooner or later

...and online poker... well for me it doesn't do it - it's so, so , so tedious and more importantly definitely not a level playing field. That probably is the route for anyone who seriously wants to play full time but I'm not sure if I can be bothered to dodge the cheaters, colluders, hand history stealers and 24-tabling teenage math geeks living with Mummy.

Ho Hum.

I typed out an almost identical the same reply, but then decided not to post it. - The virtual equivalent of biting my tongue.

I see the same thing in chat boxes all the time: "I hate this site, all the players are donks"

Live a less extravagant life style and save some money?

Also one shot at 2-5<two shots at 1-2

Have u considered playing cash else where? That's what I did when I was doing this in manchester

Sure, I understand but this isn't the same thing. Well it's slightly different at least. It's just that some of these guys are so clueless I'm getting tired of spending 8hours a day with them listening to the same crap day in day out. I'd much rather play in a game that is still very profitable (im not suggesting swapping bad players for good players, more like awful players for bad players). So rather than earning x per hour at 0.50 1, I could earn say 1.8x an hour playing 1 2, or 3.5x an hour playing 2 5 for example.

Thanks for this. I have the same qualms about playing online - and playing online entirely for a living isn't an option for me. Fwiw, why would I make a post like this and lie about how much I had earnt? I am aware that 3months isn't a big sample and that I have ran ok in that period, but I was just stating the figures. I have had a a couple of short lived downswings during that period and wouldn't say that I'd ran particularly hot overall.

yeh ive been playing in gala for most of the past 3 months and yeh maybe a change of scenery is a good idea. I can play cash at DTD now so I'll be back there (i used to work there and have had to have a 6month cooling off period...)

So you won't play online because you believe it is not a level playing field but have been playing live at Notts Gala!

Lol

Playing at Gala. Wow. You've done well to avoid the third dimension. Get down to DTD quick. The games at DTD are probably a bit tougher (it is relative mind) but at least they're clean.

I wasn't having a go about your profits Alex, just trying to inject a bit of realism into the process. Any poker player is only a few beats away from the doghouse if he isn't rolled properly, even at lowly 50p/£1.

take it from a guy who's taken more shots than an alcoholic, this is not the way to go if you are playing for a living.

Grind for a few months, don't spend extravagantly, build ur roll that way.

Obviously a "glass half-full" man like tikay ;)

stop treating the missus imo.

I have been playing similar level live as you and my biggest piece of advice would be to watch what you are spending.  You may be a better player than me but 5k seems a lot unless you are putting in a lot of hours and even then it is only 20k a year.  That isn't going to cover more than your bills and the odd night out and if you have run pretty good you will need something in reserve for the bad runs that will come and if you have only played for a living for 3 months you probably have no idea how bad those runs can be.  A 2-4k bankroll is really not that much and to be able to take advantage of your skills and the good runs you have to be able to manage your bankroll.  i have been gambling for a living in some form for 10 of the last 15 years and all of my biggest mistakes have revolved around bankroll management and in that time all of the gamblers and poker players I have come across that have made significant amounts of money have been superb at BR management yet some of the most talented poker players and sports bettors I have known have consistently gone broke by being bad at managing rolls and have spent unwisely after big wins.

Great post.

I like you Alex. You are a nice lad and you think about the game in good depth, I'm sure you will sbe successful no matter which route you go. For someone who comes across so intelligent your view on online poker really does confuse me. I think you should grind online if you really do want to move up the levels.

Whenever me and you talk about poker Alex I always get all nostalgic as its how I started kind of, so I feel like the story of how i built and lost my bankroll/started playing full time might be slightly useful for you.

When i was 19 I had a decent job and a nice amount of money behind me, I was always playing lots of poker but was so bored i decided I was going to live in cyprus (random lol) so 3 days after deciding this Id handed my notice in at my job, booked flights and paid for 6 months accommodation I had a bunch of money on full tilt and was gonna grind pokers out there to support myself. Unfortunately my interest in poker faded and my interest in getting drunk eating massive meals and trying (REALLY TRYING) to seduce the holidaying girls took over 8 incred months later there is no-one about any more I have 5 days left before I dont have a house anymore and most of my friends have gone home...I had $0 on full tilt, -£1000 in my bank account and -£2500 on my credit card and less than 40euros to my name, the cheapest flight home being about 140euro's. SO I worked on the harbour for three days striaght made enough for a flight home and got back to england. I couldn't tell my mum and dad i was broke because they knew how much money i had when i went to Cyprus and Id been lying whilst i was over there saying i was working (lol)

So I rang my old buddy Jamie Sykes up and asked him if he could lend me £150, which he said he couldn't cos he was skint as well, so i went to see Ray Illey who ran the card club i used to play at and asked him if i could borrow £150 to gamble with (lol) and he gladly handed me £150 - I  got in my car drove straight to leeds to play .50/1 and sat with the lot, won that night, played the next 15 nights consecutively and had about £3.4k (although i cant really remember) I paid Ray his £150 back (and bought him a bottle of magners to say thanks lol) and went to napoleons to play the £2/£5 game (lol) things go terribly and im in for the whole lot sat with about £1.3k when i get into this hand with Laurence Gosney. I 3bet JT and th board comes JT8, we get it in and he has Q9 and I bink a J, we then  go on an insane run and by the end of the month I have about £11k...I then put some money on full tilt and a couple of Euro sites, grinded the 1/2 game at gala and the Naps game when it ran and went from there.....

Now this might sound like an epic story, and it kind of is to a certain extent, but the problem with spin ups is you need to snap realise 1) when to stop spinning up! and 2) When you're loosing momentum, I never grasped either of these concepts and after my great success online at .50/1 and 1/2 I took to the 5/10 and 10/20 arena with the same reckless abandon that I employed during my live spin up, I never really looked back at that month and realised JUST HOW LUCKY I GOT. so that lesson cost me abut $60k and spiralled me back into busto-ness. I spent a bit of time staked, playing smaller etc but never really got back because I felt like my one time magical spin up had gone and the only way to actually get a roll was to go on a run like that, then this year i figured out Its not about the stupid shots, or seeming l;ike a bit of a balla payign high stakes stuff, its about working on your game all the time, good money management and putting lots of hours in...

So the point of the poitnless story is this....grind grind grind grind grind grind grind grind grind, squirrel money away and use it to take shots, when your doing well in your game, say your up £250 and have £400 in front of you, persaude everyone to play £1/£2, and get people straddling etc, speshly if there are a few guys loosing, stuff like this can turn good nights intpo mega nights (I remember one night this year at gala I started outplaying 1/2 and get everyone to agree to unlimited srtraddles etc, made it 2/4 and ended up running like jesus and winning about £4k lol) try limit ur spending obv, just like any other business and set monthly targets, but the MOST IMPORTANT PART OF these small stakes live games in game selection - DO NOT PLAY IN BAD GAMES!!! I try to get there abiut midnight when generally there is more money about and some people are tilting/ loosing - if the game looks shit dont play in it.

and ffs get urself learnign the 4carded game and start grinding along, stick $1k online after a decent week (euro site entraction or iPoker ftw imo) and grind the low stakes games hard during the day, cos man they are SO FKIN EASY! also try and play FTOPS/WCOOP etc cos u just need to one time. I firmly believe people who just play live will always be slightly behind the curve of the guys who play online, as there is so less motivation to improve and work on ur game.

spin ups are all well and good but you need to not get carried away in the heater, sell %'s for bigger games and look after your money, it might seem like there is a rutt, but at the end of the day ur paying ur bills so it's not a rut, this year i've grinded and its been a much better experience than the first time around + I wont make the same mistakes this time round. you tlk/think on a high level imo so you obv have the ability, just apply urself as you are are the heater will come.

More senseless drivel from me I know, but I wish you much much good luck and have every faith we will be both 3betting durrrr and ivey on high stakes poker season 7 :)

yes, very good. If only Id met you 3 years and you'd have told me this Id prolly have about $100k additional monies to my name.

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<3 Suprrrrr

Massive Dave are you basically saying that the best way to be a pro is to gamble hard and run good?

Why did no one ever tell me that and how they hell do you do the 'run good' bit !? ;tk;

You also fail to mention that sitting on my right and losing to me also elevated your game whilst also explaining the reason you moved to 4 cards :p

Also Alex realise that live games just have stupid amounts of variance, that you'll never get to the learn term really so you have to accept the stupid swings.

Also stop spending money on anything all monay spent is -ev innit. Take shots with good discipline but you'll also need to start improving your game by playing online and really step up the work you do away from the table.  You could try playing some of the smaller MTT's online but you need to know how to play them + run good + put in a decent sample + be able to afford it etc.

Another great post.

yep. horrible, was impossible to make a pair and peole kept betting more than the pot, was madness

I taught the kid everything he knows lmao.


Live is so com. hahahaha  Tennis ball keyrings ftw

truuuuuuuuuuue dis :)
Of my current £3.21 fortune, your responsible for over £2 of it.

 8)

its not that i think onlne is rigged or nething, i didnt mean that - ive grinded online b4 for a month or two here and there and I just miss the social interaction far too much and find it very antisocial and insular. I really genuinely enjoy playing live poker (even in gala notts generally lol) and I just couldn't play online for a living entirely. Also live is so soft and may remain soft forever, online is getting tougher and tougher esp in nlhe which is the only game im currently familiar...Maybe a mixture of online and live is a good idea though...

very entertaining dave! Echos of the summer I just had. Spent it having a wicked time in Mexico and Guatemala travelling about with these dutch guys, spending all my money except a carefully saved 7 or 8 hundred which got spanked in Vegas at the end. Was an absolutely awesome summer but left me broke. I owed my girlfriend £200 which she lent me when I got back. I got a job dealing in London for the world series of poker europe, and before my first shift dealing to ivey and durrr etc I went to the vic with that £200 and sat with it in a 1 2game. I limped two black aces utg, young guy made it £13, old guy flatted on the button, I made it £51, young guy folds, old guy calls.  Kh Qh 2h, I bet 65, He put me all in. I called. The turn came  4h, the river  Ks. My heart was on the floor I was gutted. The old guy proudly annouces two pair, and fllips  Ac Qs. I couldnt believe it! (Young guy thankfully folded his A8hearts he said...) For the rest of my spell in london I played £1 £1 everyday before work, crushed it (+ran like god ;) ) and the rest is history.  

Now I'm aware that I ran good in that spell and if I'd lost that hand then who knows what will have happened. I can also see the importance in knowing when to stop spinning up. Most ppl that know me say that I don't have a gamblers mentality at all. I almost never play blackjack or roulette or any -EV game, I'll do dinner flips and prop bets cos I think they're generally pretty EV neutral and they're a good laugh which makes them +EV in fact imo. But that's as far as it goes.

So Im sure that if I do end up taking a few shots in the near future, they won't be stupid and I will have no problems if they go wrong. I have a 4figure roll on stars and I can always grind HU SNGs again there to get my live roll back if I lose it. Thanks for all these responses though, a lot of food for thought. Hope to be posting in a weeks time after monte carlo with reports of miniftops FTs and stacking Rob Yong et al @DTD! Gl me.....

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Ha!!!! If I had met you 3 years ago it would have been shortly after the occasion I spent 40% of my roll on a night out at Stringfellows and then went on a big downswing.  Like I said I made so many BIG mistakes but it was fun and I wouldn't swap any of it for all the money others made from staying in but if you want it to be a sustainable living in the long run then you have to change and adapt.  The older you get and the more responsibilities you have the harder going broke becomes and you realise you have to try and be sensible and turn this into a profession.  

a lot of guys itt talk about their bankroll in the same way as they do their life monies.

You should keep these separate and not use one for the other

depends what u mean by -ev. do you count buying nice clothes as -ev? or taking your broke student housemates out for a curry once in a while? or nights out drinking etc? all these things have way more value than money and if you're not going to enjoy yourself and do these things then whats the point in having money anyway? id much rather stay grinding 50 1 for a for months more and still enjoy myself, than save all pennies and have a shit time and move up a bit sooner.

Ha!!!! If I had met you 3 years ago it would have been shortly after the occasion I spent 40% of my roll on a night out at Stringfellows and then went on a big downswing.  Like I said I made so many BIG mistakes but it was fun and I wouldn't swap any of it for all the money others made from staying in but if you want it to be a sustainable living in the long run then you have to change and adapt.  The older you get and the more responsibilities you have the harder going broke becomes and you realise you have to try and be sensible and turn this into a profession.  
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This is prolly the best line in the whole thread tbh.

and lol, perhaps you wouldn't have been any help to me at all haha

yh alex i railed your diary was cool, sounded EPIC

you cant buy things like that - in response to the -EV stuff discussion, that's not speicifc to poker like cos said, people with jobs/businesses w/e have money they cant spend for w/e reason (bills, paying staff etc) and money that is disposable to spend, you have to kinda take a wage and thats ur dispoable money, and I would deffo advocate spending that not on poker and enjoying urself, as you say if you dont what is the point.

If you;re trying to move up super fast then ud take less money out of poker.

sigh that it hardly ever really works like this but it defo should lol

There's essential spending and there's spending amounts that you can't afford to at the stakes your playing.

I don't see dinner flips as neutral ev either, unless you're going out with these people constantly and the bills are always relatively sized it's just added variance which to a small bank roll is not what you're really wanting is it! IS IT

Wsie words, just buy out unless you an afford to bank some slansky meals

Nits the lot of ya's

how many ppl are regs in the game u paly?

also is that chinese tom a winning player? he tilts the hell out of me. Has such a dirty tash and thinks he is awesome

LOL. Your my new favourite person Paul

Im not a nit im broke, its much better :)

r u like knish from rounders?

lol how all poker players must relate other players to someone from rounders.

lol me and him are probs the only 2 winning regs (not hard at gala though). but there's a bunch of other ppl that play there all the time, its quite a small player pool. i kno what u mean about Tom lol his betting action is enough to send anyone on raging tilt.

im outta there now though, dtd from now on :)

You got dealt too many cards and your super spin up heater ended obv. Welcome to realities. Need maneys for foods?

NO.

(yes please)

Why not just bink 4k Alex? Oh you did sigh... MBN   ;kneelsucker;

wiiiiiii lol