blonde poker forum

OK not a spot we're in all that often but they are becoming a little more frequent because some of the players on Stars now like limping although this guy in particular has been jamming. First time I've seen a limp. There's 10 left in the comp- all cashed. Hand for hand before final

What do we do on this flop?

PokerStars Game #61157987277: Tournament #417010235, $69+$6 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level XXIII (1500/3000) - 2011/04/22 13:34:51 WET [2011/04/22 8:34:51 ET]
Table '417010235 8' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: George2Loose (33708 in chips)
Seat 5: ilmister796 (67804 in chips)
Seat 6: Naropa (97539 in chips)
Seat 7: ladylv61 (35234 in chips)
Seat 8: scifo79 (20657 in chips)
George2Loose: posts the ante 375
ilmister796: posts the ante 375
Naropa: posts the ante 375
ladylv61: posts the ante 375
scifo79: posts the ante 375
scifo79: posts small blind 1500
George2Loose: posts big blind 3000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to George2Loose [3d Qh]
ilmister796: folds
Naropa: folds
ladylv61: calls 3000
scifo79: calls 1500
George2Loose: checks
*** FLOP *** [4s 5s Qc]
scifo79: checks
George2Loose:

jam pre

get it in now

Never ever ever jamming pre here.

dont like jamming pre, guess check/jam or lead brick turn if it checks

you have 11bbs and are picking up 30% of ur stack against a button limp and and sb complete - looks like it could rarely be a mistake tbh

with history of button limp/folding i dont mind, but without that i go to flop

Agree with Trigg. Amt of times people limp with like 4s thru 8s or KQ QJ and then snap of a shove is ridic.

nice range given teh board

what about Ax all broadways some suited connectors - so add the 30% juice to your price and im pretty sure it isnt terrible - plus add in the times that they fold - it just cant be bad given the info we have on the villain

Still never jamming. Think flop is more interesting.

lol guy.

dont jam this pre imo

well given the flop and any reasonable percieved range its a c/jam

I checked. Limper Jammed.

ive changed my mind, i think i prefer open jamming to make our hand look a little more bluffy, drawy, and still get paid by some of his limps

as played snap him off

wow he jammed, im not snapping this i probably fold

I did fold.

nitnitnitnitnitnitnit.

I honestly have no idea what he had tho. Remember kids- never go broke in an unraised pot.

prefer my line to both of yours

you are basically putting him on AA to fold right?

As I said not sure. Wouldn't be surprised to see KQ, QJ, Q10 suited etc if I had called

One thing I abso disagree with is pre. It's just spewy

sorry but teh maths says its close

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

 520,540,416  games     0.500 secs     1,041,080,832  games/sec

Board:
Dead:  

   equity    win    tie          pots won    pots tied   
Hand 0:    66.897%     66.15%    00.74%         344359141      3866976.50   { 99-44, A2s+, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, A2o+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo }
Hand 1:    33.103%     32.36%    00.74%         168447322      3866976.50   { Qc3s }

even if you include AA KK QQ JJ TT 33 22

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

 582,183,360  games     0.546 secs     1,066,269,890  games/sec

Board:
Dead: 

   equity    win    tie          pots won    pots tied   
Hand 0:    67.868%     67.16%    00.71%         390971614      4144925.00   { 22+, A2s+, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, A2o+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo }
Hand 1:    32.132%     31.42%    00.71%         182921896      4144925.00   { Qc3s }

Im better than the maths in this situation at this stage of the comp

lol

:D

Put in a slightly less twatty way. Don't think maths is the only consideration here

I would need a stone cold read on someone to say he has AA here, which is what you are doing

The only reason I can find a fold, is by saying "well if he jammed id have passed" - but im not sure thats good enough

Guy I don't think he folds as often as you think and I don't think Q3 plays well against his range when he does call despite what the maths say

Math is idiotic

i took low suited connectors out of his range making it tighter than I had said

but given he might have 66 77 88 99 TT JJ here why are you folding? - does he not jam those too?

I fold pre but probably call flop (only because I opr'ed him just now rotflmfao )

fold pre?

yeah as in not jam. you know what I means.


open fold ftw

Maybe I've been burnt too often when I call and he has the hands I listed. I agree he probably does have those hands a decent % of the time

I only checked in case the flop came QQQ or 333. See how I mucked top pair, premium kicker?

im sure you could find this a +EV shove preflop

but ur hand does very bad vs a legit limp calling range

post flop?

Like the nit nit nit nit play here.

Do it without telling people and feel fine :)

I'm talking from very recent experience re checking here.

Amt of times I've jammed A7 or suchlike here and got snapped by better/flipping leads me to believe that in this spot we can check

U know that's not the right way of thinking about it though george...

quoted 1million

All I'm trying to convey is that Euro players limp wider and call wider. Yes if I jam and we get a fold a certain % of the time then I jam here all day.

However, in this spot, I don't think he's limping to fold and Q3 plays really badly against anything I get called by. Now if I had maybe 98 sooooted I may jam here. Make sense? Or is my reasoning flawed?

Jam pre, call as played. Neither are close IMO

I'd bet 3.7k.

was gonna spoof post - but this is guy  - and its all right there!

wiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii

I dont like jam pre.

Check/jam post for me, button should be cbetting 100% of flops here.  I call a jam too, he can be jamming draws/2nd or 3rd pair enough that he doesnt always have you crushed imo

I agree with Dubai :)

dubai wrong here imo, he kills high stakes mtt but not seen him slumming it down midstakes for a while

About jam pre or call post or both?

about jam pre, having said that history is paramount in both

Played 7 $80 hyper turbos, won 2. People limp fold all the time, and since the US thing even more so