blonde poker forum

Deepstack day 1. Blinds 100/200.

UTG limps.

I bet 700 from 15k with  Ad Ac

Sb calls, bb calls, limper calls.

Flop  3c 4d 8c

Sb moves all in for 4.5k.

Bb flats from ~ 17k.

Limper folds.

Me.... ?

Hi, pretty sick spot, ld make it at least 950/1025 to play after the 1st limper.

This hand is pretty tough, Imo, I'm not giving the sb much credit for a hand, if he's got like 77/66 or fd/sd, then he's shoving for his last 4.5k - the 2nd guy is a little more tricky imo.

He could easily be flatting the SB's all in with 99/1010/JJ, we should rule out QQ/KK here, as I think he nearly all of the time 3bets you pre with these 2 holdings, If he reshoves with 99/1010/JJ, he is effectivly trying to bluff u out of the pot, with the best hand, as what would u call with that he is beating if he has one of these hands? - so Flatting he could easily have these hands - also, he could easily have a set, as it would pave the way for you to reshove with an overpair, and him to hopefully scoop a big pot.

I think he never has a FD in this hand, as he would prob reshove to try and get a big pot together with outs if he's behind to u both, or try and get u to fold a big pair, and gambling vs a short stack.

In all honesty, I don't think it's a bad re shove all in, if that's what u decide, I think u can only reshove all in or fold tho, and I really don't mind the fold either, as A, u get to see anyway, and B, the nature/structure of this comp, u will always have another oppourtunity to get chips, saying that for me, I would probably reshove and hope for the best...

What happened?

I like your pre-flop bet. As a general rule, i find that if you dont get heads up with aces and then you get heavy action you are usually behind. I think that the small blind is prob shoving a flush draw such as Kc Jc.
 I would expect the small blind to check-raise a set and i can't see what else he can be jamming with here, other than the flush draw. If this assumption is correct, this possibility, and the fact that you have the ace of clubs, leads me to believe that the big blind may well be flat calling with a set.
 I suppose the big blind could have some sort of flush / straight combo draw, but i would expect him to fold most drawing hands to the small blind's shove.
 I may well be over-estimating the strentgh of your opponents hands, but, your hand is highly unlikely to improve, so, i feel that a FOLD is the best course of action here.

Think the BB has to be wider than a set here.  Surely he wouldnt fold 99-JJ and maybe not 8x too

fair point Bobba.  It is a pretty big shove from the small blind though, i wouldn't expect the big blind to call with top pair here. I dont think that calling with the overpair is such an easy call either, if he suspects that he's up against a flush draw with overcards, and two other players still to act. It's certainly an interesting spot though. Cheers for posting it Red-dog.

I'd shove

same

Shove for me too

Reads on SB/BB?

I know in the update it said who BB was, which would certainly influence my decision in a certain direction.

I think it's player dependent, and could change the decision from a shove to a fold, or vice versa.

Busy, moderately aggressive but reasonably solid.

I do agree that is very much read and player dependent, and also, to some extent dependent on Red-Dog's image. If the big blind  appears to flat call reasonably quickly, without too much genuine soul searching, i would say that a set is far more likely. There is an UTG limp caller who is probably set mining, plus Red-Dog, who is probably playing fairly tight at this point in the tournament, still to act.
Also, if Red-Dog jams here, surely he is never getting called by any hand that he's ahead of, so, he's risking his entire tournament with one pair, which is unlikely to improve, and he still has to beat the small blind who probably has a big draw (31% equity).
 Based on information available, i will stick with the Fold as the best choice. Not an easy game though. The more i play it, the harder it seems to get.

i dont know what Red-dogs impression were of the SB, but given what he had, I'd say that RedDog abs crushes his range. It's definitely a jam, not even close.

Shock as the rage suggests folding!

Alex, you were on the rail mate, so it's easier for you.

I went with the fold. I would have called had he jammed to isolate the sb but flatting worried me.

I figured that I was either ahead but not a huge favourite, ahead, but second favourite, or a big dog.

I only had 700 involved. If I'm putting my entire tourney on the line that early, I want to be reasonably sure that I'm ahead, with a better than evens chance of staying ahead.

As it turns out the SB had no hand no draw, just two red overs.  BB had middle pair and a flush draw.

Board came club - club.

The SB jams for 1.5x pot which yeah he can do with a set but he can also have every overpair and all the draws. Wouldn't be suprised to see him show up with a hand like 66 or 77 here either.

The flatter is slightly concerning and having some sort of read here would be helpful. Against your average villain in this tournament though its still a jam. I disagree that he's going to jam all of the draws that we're 70% against and only flat sets.

I'd be more worried if he jammed ahead of you not flatted.

Players here often flat hoping you'll fold behind not vice-versa

I know i always seem to find a fold on the PHA George, but that was my calculated assessment. I guess i'm giving the DTD 300 regulars far too much respect. As it happened Red-Dog got there on the river after falling behind on the turn, although i'm not sure the big blind would call the shove.
 I guess another generalization comes into play here though, which is, 'if in doubt what to do, choose the most aggressive option'. I think it was Jake Cody that said that. It certainly seems to work for him. GG.  :)

So, with hindsight, knowing what he has and assuming he is calling, do we shove? Bearing in mind that we are only like 5/4 fave,  are in decent shape, and like our table.

Deffo, not only are we favourite but there is a big overlay in the pot. No matter how soft the table not going to get many spots like this.

Surely if he jams his range is weighted more towards draws than sets and makes it more of an instacall?

A thinking player maybe but from what I've seen when live players have draws they would rather call and probably don't mind a call behind.

If they have a made hand they want to protect it at all costs so they jam.

+1 great post

I agree with kinboshi that whether this is a call or fold is entirely dependent on the 3 players in the hand. There isn't nearly enough information in this thread for me to figure it out either way but I can help you with a couple of things.

First, unless you have a specific read on this particluar player, I really don't think you should use "I was scared that he didn't raise" as a reason to fold. It's usually a mistake.

Second, you said that you would only want to put your chips in if you had a greater than 50% chance of staying alive in the tournament. You asked if you should call knowing that you were a favourite in a 3-way pot with dead money. The answer is that if you value the experience of staying alive in the tournament then you should fold. But if you value being good at poker you should call. Passing up a good opportunity for possible future opportunities is a risky business, and chances are you are overvaluing your edge versus the table.

me too, but i'm terrible.
good luck

you tell me this after i have a tickle with staking. sigh.

bluffing.