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Poker Forums => Poker Hand Analysis => Topic started by: celtic on March 14, 2012, 04:23:27 PM



Title: KK oop
Post by: celtic on March 14, 2012, 04:23:27 PM
Live cash 1/2 @ Luton.

Playing around £180, covers villain.

Villain is solid, never really gets out of line.

Random limps for £2, villain makes it £7, I make it £19, random folds, villain calls.

Flop  2h 4h 5c I bet £28, he calls. Turn  5d Check Check River  6c Now what? c/c? c/f? bet?

Also, thoughts on bet sizing pre, flop and what I shoulda done on the turn please. Harsh as you like...



Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: AlexMartin on March 14, 2012, 04:25:47 PM
bet turn, bet river as played. pre is fine imo.


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: jakally on March 14, 2012, 04:26:55 PM

Make it about £24 PF, bigger if you think he will call.

Bet turn 100%, you get calls from all pairs plus A hi sometimes.
As played bet river, then decide based on sizing / opponent / reads.


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: rbolt2 on March 14, 2012, 04:50:07 PM
I would probably have bet the turn, If you don't think he will bluff if you check the river I would lead out into him.

Im thinking of playing cash at Luton at some point so I was wondering what time the games start normally?


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: cambridgealex on March 14, 2012, 05:18:11 PM
Pre is defo too small, 22min, usually I'd go for 25-30.

Defo bet the turn as well, I almost never alter from bbb lines with big pairs on low flops, you can't go wrong.

You're missing out massively on value by not betting the turn.

River is a bet/decide dependant on villain with bc or bf.


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: polaroid83 on March 14, 2012, 05:37:37 PM
I think the bet size pre is ok

Defo bet the flop Maybe £30-£35

Like the check on the turn as it gives him a chance to bet hands that he over values like jj ajhh

As he checks behind I'm betting the river. £70-£80

Not folding to a raise as I think if you're beat he's betting the turn.


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: muckthenuts on March 14, 2012, 05:38:09 PM
Pre as big as you think your opponent will call. Would bet turn, as played bet/decide yeah.


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: pleno1 on March 14, 2012, 05:48:03 PM
pre is too small, make it around £25 one chip if possible.

As played b/call turn and b/f river. Lots and lots of small denomination chips to get around £63


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: cambridgealex on March 14, 2012, 05:50:40 PM
What's the thinking behind one 25chip and then lots of small change for the 63, when in both cases we're betting for value?


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: Bully87 on March 14, 2012, 06:13:37 PM
What's the thinking behind one 25chip and then lots of small change for the 63, when in both cases we're betting for value?

Easier to count for villain on later streets. Plus it looks slightly more baller flicking ponys in rather than 5x5s ha


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: pleno1 on March 14, 2012, 07:30:30 PM
What's the thinking behind one 25chip and then lots of small change for the 63, when in both cases we're betting for value?

First one looks like ok its easy to see a flop, second one looks like we're trying to rep really strong by putting more chips, when you get to 52ish, look at the pot and find a new denomination and start adding this to get to 63 ish


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: nirvana on March 14, 2012, 07:49:28 PM
When we've counted the 63 do we slide it in neatly, splash it in, or kinda give them a jaunty flip over the line (very casual like) as so many do these days


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: pleno1 on March 14, 2012, 08:53:25 PM
double first push into the middle, knock chips over to look nervous, go to pick them up then be nervous and put hand near/around mouth.


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: kinboshi on March 14, 2012, 09:25:50 PM
With some fake shaking too, or would that be too much?


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: pleno1 on March 14, 2012, 09:49:56 PM
With some fake shaking too, or would that be too much?

too much. im deadly serious btw.


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: AlexMartin on March 14, 2012, 11:29:39 PM
With some fake shaking too, or would that be too much?

too much. im deadly serious btw.

hahahahahahahahah you actually are. the science of chip denoms by pleeeeno.


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: DMorgan on March 15, 2012, 06:53:59 AM
I used to do the trying to look weak when I have it and vice versa thing but let it slip for a while and people still called and folded when I wanted them to for the most part. Most of the time when you're using certain sizings to own someone its because they're not very good and probably won't be paying attention to physical tells anyway.

v. important to have a balanced shaking range though. Get on an diet and exercise regime that'll have you weighing between 10 stone and 10 stone 5. Then you'll be skinny enough to be cold in almost every cardroom you'll find and you'll have a perfectly balanced shaking range.

i'm deadly serious btw.


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: stato_1 on March 15, 2012, 07:10:26 AM
I used to do the trying to look weak when I have it and vice versa thing but let it slip for a while and people still called and folded when I wanted them to for the most part. Most of the time when you're using certain sizings to own someone its because they're not very good and probably won't be paying attention to physical tells anyway.

v. important to have a balanced shaking range though. Get on an diet and exercise regime that'll have you weighing between 10 stone and 10 stone 5. Then you'll be skinny enough to be cold in almost every cardroom you'll find and you'll have a perfectly balanced shaking range.

i'm deadly serious btw.

I went with 10 stone + 10 stone 5 for a well balanced if overly aggro wobbling range


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: rfgqqabc on March 18, 2012, 12:36:37 PM
Brilliant thread.

Pre bigger, and I'm probably smashing all three streets with an increasingly bigger bet until all of my betting discs have disappeared  in front of me.

However, you can only do this if you occasionally bluff. If you don't start going nuts with AK when 3betting until it shows down. Then just vbet in the live games.


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: Junior Senior on March 18, 2012, 09:45:56 PM
Cant see any possible way we are losing to this villain. Bet the river and he calls off with QQ


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: pleno1 on March 18, 2012, 10:35:44 PM
Cant see any possible way we are losing to this villain. Bet the river and he calls off with QQ
what?

its a paired board and a one liner in live cash where people play 40%+ vpip as super standard


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: rfgqqabc on March 19, 2012, 06:53:33 PM
Cant see any possible way we are losing to this villain. Bet the river and he calls off with QQ
what?

its a paired board and a one liner in live cash where people play 40%+ vpip as super standard

He cant have a 5 man. And if he is one of those droolers hes likely to raise the flop with a 5 ^.^


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: Junior Senior on March 19, 2012, 06:54:20 PM
Op says villain is standard never really gets out of line. I just cant see how with that description and the action in the hand this isnt just a standard play to bet river. Should have bet turn too. If he plays back on river then we are beat but i would fully expect this to go bet call on fifth


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: AlexMartin on March 19, 2012, 08:39:03 PM
we dont need to be good 100% of the time to value bet......of course we can be losing.


Title: Re: KK oop
Post by: pleno1 on March 19, 2012, 10:45:18 PM
we dont need to be good 100% of the time to value bet......of course we can be losing.

yer exacrly, in live cash this is 100pc b/f