blonde poker forum

I have a question which may appear to have an obvious answer ( play lots and win ). But, how do all these Internet players go from being a beginner to playing on the high limit tables so quickly. I will give you a few examples Jenifer Leigh(Jennicide) and Justin Bonomo(E.P.T player). Are they just naturals or is it backers who help with buy-ins on the sites which they play. I play quite alot of poker these days between 0.50/$1, $1/2 and occasionally $2/4. Surely playing at these limits it would take me about 15 years to win enough to sit at the high limits like those on VC $150/300 and Pokerstars $100/200. And then there is Full Contact where the limits are even higher. Alot of these players who play at these limits are really young(20 years old ). At the moment I am more than happy to play at the limits which I do. Since starting in October last year, I feel my game has really improved from what it was at the start while playing on the play money tables. I may never move up to the high limits, but how these players do it so quickly is a mystery..... anyone have any ideas?....Is it just a case of studying books, viewing forums like this and playing for 70 hours per week?...Thanks...

Mainly because they are not bankrolled right for the game.

For every one you see 5 others have busted out

I would think that its a case of getting a really good win via a satellite and then it takes off from there. In theory you can win the WSOP for a few dollars via satellites and get $7.5m for it.   You only hear about a few of them and there are hundreds of thousands of people playing on line that aren't like that.

I've only been playing about the same time as you and I'm also way off these dizzy heights.  This year I'm going to play some satellite events in the hope of qualifying for something bigger.  I have qualified for the £10k on Crypto a couple of times and whilst I haven't won any cash in them, I've been close and had lots of poker experience for only £3.  When I end up winning, its a couple of grand in the bank ;)

...and every one that has made it has busted out at least 5 times.

Ive myself only been playing 3-4 months and also try to qualify for the cyrpto 10K, 15K etc by way of satellites, and was lucky enough to win a 3K cryypto during this time and also 6th (£608) in a deauville final on b/f that had only cost me £2 by playing in Round 1 satellite wiining a seat for round 2 and managed to qualify for final.

I think its the best way to learn, dont really like playing cash as a lot more at stake.

ditto.  I didnt mind cash when I started but playing limit cash games is really bad at the lower stakes.  Playing no limit can be too expensive for my bankroll.  Id rather spend £3 on a mtt and get a good amount of poker in than £3 in a cash game where it could easily be over in a couple of hands.

I bet they did not have a wife who spent their big wins on household furniture  >:(

All my wins go in my Vegas fund at the moment...I keep my bankroll at it's normal level, but any surplus goes straight to the savings account. I try and do it whenever I have doubled my roll (which isn't a lot )

Because of my slot machine problem, I need a ridiculous amount of money to push mindlessly into Wheel of Fortune for the duration of my stay.

Have a "squirrel away place" that no-one knows about<g>

I have 4 days money saved already .. only 10 more to find :)

Sark

At the stakes you're playing you can make a big difference by actively bonus whoring the sites.  If you get rakeback too this will make a difference.

Assuming you were playing breakeven poker at $1/2 or $2/4 limits you could still earn a few thousand dollars per year in bonuses and/or rakeback. whilst developing the experience and confidence to move up limits when your bankroll allows (for limit poker the standard 'safe' bankroll is 300 big bets).  Many players reach a point where they don't want to go higher (the biggest step to playing

Most people who have progressed quickly have either taken shots on a short bankroll and avoided going bust or they're doing so off the back of big MTT wins.  You can't count on this approach being successful and, as others have said, for every success there's probably 5 failures who you never hear about.

Sheriff

 ;iagree;

Thanks for the advice. After the play money I played 00.2/00.4 limits for about 4 or 5 weeks and sometimes won, sometimes lost. I found people making really crazy plays and however how hard I tried I couldn't win at that level consitently. Then spent a little time at a few limits in between before settling in the $1/2 limit level. I have been playing there for about 4 weeks now and touch wood it has been going really well. I sometimes jump to the $2/4 limit games ( only when there are 8 or more players, I hate 6 player Max tables). I find these limits not to different in style to the $1/2 to be honest. But after playing about 20 mins at the $3/6 limit game on pokerstars a few days ago, I quickly realised I was getting into waters abit to deep for my current ability level, so I took a step back. I know this may seem cowardly, but the way I look at it, you should play it safe and learn slowly in a proper way at levels where it feels easier. I will definately look at those mtt options discussed. I have played a couple of single table events at really low limits, but didn't enjoy it as much as cash games. But I think it was mainly due to not not being aware of the big differences between cash and tournament strategy. I have since read alot online about tournaments and want to play some this year. Again thanks and I appreciate your time.

Absolutely the right thing to do.  At 3/6 you are starting to meet decent players, including the multi-tabling pro's.  These guys are not mugs.  Read 4dam's 'done my bankroll' thread for the impact that variance can have even if you are good enough to hold your own - it's essential reading.

Also, you need a huge no. of hands before you can be sure you are really beating the game at any given limit and not simply benefitting from the upside of variance.

As an aside, does anyone on these boards play limit, apart from Sark, Sheriff and me??

i do!!

thanks 12barblues, i will definately check out the thread as you mentioned.

http://blondepoker.com/forum/index.php?topic=5803.0

Heres my link about how easy it can be to lose the lot.

Just be patient and let your roll build up and then dip your toe after you watch the table for an hour and put the guys on there hands a few times. Thats what i done with and it worked well and i have a very good data base on players at the level i play at and i always check it up to date


4dam

Cheers 4dam, I have just been on the link and this will definately help me. Thanks and good luck..

Sark

Just read your follow up posts and there is absolutely no shame in taking a step back or dropping down limits.  The players who go bust are generally the ones who are too 'proud' to do this.

I worked my way up the limits from $0.50/1 and have taken several steps back along the way to protect my bankroll when I've hit a bad patch or spent a lump of money.  One of the key abilities at the higher limits is having the ability to disassociate yourself from the amounts involved, think in terms of bets won and lost and continue to make the right plays (i.e. don't play scared because of what this pot is worth in 'real' terms).  Its much easier said than done and many players choose to stop at a limit they feel comfortable with when they have the ability to play higher.

Never forget that people play for different reasons.  Some want to play as high as they can and win as much as possible.  Others want to have a bit of fun.  Don't ever feel intimidated by someone else's apparent success.  As long as you are happy where you are and you know what you want to achieve, nothing else really matters.

Sheriff

Yea thanks Sheriff, that is good advice. If I was being totally honest I do look at the big limit tables on pokerstars and dream of one day playing there. But for now I am happy learning on the $1/2 limits. I have slowly built my bankroll to allow me to play comfortably there from my intial $50 deposit in October. If it is meant to happen It will happen. I will continue studying the books and playing the tables and most importantly enjoying it. Oh, and I forgot to mention reading forums like this to boost my poker knowledge. I appreciate your comments and will take them on board. Sometimes on pokerstars at the high limits, I see some crazy play( it probably has some reason, but I don't have the experience to spot it). I will give you an example, the other day on the $30/60 tables a guy raised from under the gun, he had 2 callers. Throughout the whole hand to the turn he kept raising and re-raisng. When the three hands got turned over after the last round of betting, he had pocket 9's. The board was J,8,10,3,2. I know he must have been going for the straight, but he ended up losing loads of money along the way. As I am reading "Championship Poker" by T.J Cloutier and T.McEvoy at the moment, T.J clearly says you need to know when to give up on something. I think even at my low limits alot of players wouldn't continue betting at this pot. Was he just insane or was there another reason which i can't see?.... the other 2 players held J,J and 10,10.. Thanks.. Sark79..

I had a run at the big games once, I won a multi for $1500, took it to $10/20 fixed heads up, won $1000, took it to $20/40 fixed heads up, won $500 then lost it all.  Don't try it you will do your bollocks.

I have played at every limit up to 150/300 sterling limit and $100/$200 NL on different sites mostly financed through my $150k's worth of MTT winnings on Pokerstars and over 50k sterling worth of tournament winnings in 2004 but i have still yet to get myself a sustainable cash bankroll because i always make the mistake of playing too big for the bankroll, going bust on numerous occassions. You need a phenomenal run because there is always a bigger game to go to. Ram has done the same thing for years and i'm sure he could still go skint in the $200/$400NL on Prima despite winning chunks in the last 6 months. I'll keep taking a shot and one day i might crack it but the longer more disciplined approach is probably much less painful.