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Title: Is this shove ok? Post by: Mordeca on July 03, 2012, 02:27:42 PM Wanted to get peoples opinions on this shove. Stack sizes between 15 - 20 bb semi deep in a tournies always throw me off a little. PokerStars Hand #82727153939: Tournament #579010517, $3.00+$0.30 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level XVIII (1000/2000) - 2012/07/01 23:40:38 WET [2012/07/01 18:40:38 ET] Table '579010517 142' 9-max Seat #5 is the button Seat 1: Kam1kazemaus (100648 in chips) Seat 2: Mordeca (34990 in chips) Seat 3: leo78rom (52125 in chips) Seat 4: imponderável (35725 in chips) Seat 5: archibaldAA (176840 in chips) Seat 6: WhiteAliii (102055 in chips) Seat 7: pimmie (58962 in chips) Seat 8: Hasan1907 (133928 in chips) Seat 9: Bigotinho02 (57041 in chips) Kam1kazemaus: posts the ante 350 Mordeca: posts the ante 350 leo78rom: posts the ante 350 imponderável: posts the ante 350 archibaldAA: posts the ante 350 WhiteAliii: posts the ante 350 pimmie: posts the ante 350 Hasan1907: posts the ante 350 Bigotinho02: posts the ante 350 WhiteAliii: posts small blind 1000 pimmie: posts big blind 2000 *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to Mordeca [Qh Ad] Hasan1907: folds Bigotinho02: folds Kam1kazemaus: folds Mordeca: raises 32640 to 34640 and is all-in leo78rom: folds imponderável: folds archibaldAA: folds WhiteAliii: calls 33640 pimmie: folds *** FLOP *** [7c Td 3d] *** TURN *** [7c Td 3d] [8d] *** RIVER *** [7c Td 3d 8d] [6c] *** SHOW DOWN *** WhiteAliii: shows [Kc Ah] (high card Ace) Mordeca: shows [Qh Ad] (high card Ace - lower kicker) WhiteAliii collected 74430 from pot Mordeca finished the tournament in 347th place and received $15.41. *** SUMMARY *** Total pot 74430 | Rake 0 Board [7c Td 3d 8d 6c] Seat 1: Kam1kazemaus folded before Flop (didn't bet) Seat 2: Mordeca showed [Qh Ad] and lost with high card Ace Seat 3: leo78rom folded before Flop (didn't bet) Seat 4: imponderável folded before Flop (didn't bet) Seat 5: archibaldAA (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet) Seat 6: WhiteAliii (small blind) showed [Kc Ah] and won (74430) with high card Ace Seat 7: pimmie (big blind) folded before Flop Seat 8: Hasan1907 folded before Flop (didn't bet) Seat 9: Bigotinho02 folded before Flop (didn't bet) Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: outragous76 on July 03, 2012, 02:31:12 PM there is nothing wrong with it at all
I personally raise/call to give em chance to get it in with worse Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: LeeMcshane on July 03, 2012, 02:41:11 PM I prefer to raise here, you will always notice when you shove for this amount like 20bbs your near enough always in trouble when you get called. By being dominated or on a flip vs a PP.
But i would prefer to shove AQ around the 10-15bb mark! Just having slightly less chips always induces a raggy ace or hands like KQ/kj to call in these games Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: Longy on July 03, 2012, 02:57:34 PM This is fine especially given the size of the antes.
Our adjusted bb here is like 8bbs and I am pretty sure we aren't r/c with a 1600 stack at 100/200 no ante. Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: outragous76 on July 03, 2012, 02:58:35 PM This is fine especially given the size of the antes. Our adjusted bb here is like 8bbs and I am pretty sure we aren't r/c with a 1600 stack at 100/200 no ante. silly comparison in an MTT as ranges vary wildly Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: BulldozerD on July 03, 2012, 03:11:06 PM I'd be jamming
Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: Mordeca on July 03, 2012, 03:29:41 PM I prefer to raise here, you will always notice when you shove for this amount like 20bbs your near enough always in trouble when you get called. By being dominated or on a flip vs a PP. But i would prefer to shove AQ around the 10-15bb mark! Just having slightly less chips always induces a raggy ace or hands like KQ/kj to call in these games yeh i think I would min raise with AQ if I had around 20bb, but then if we 3 bet, is it an easy fold? effectively if we get 3 bet, they know they are playing for my stack. Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: outragous76 on July 03, 2012, 03:40:39 PM I prefer to raise here, you will always notice when you shove for this amount like 20bbs your near enough always in trouble when you get called. By being dominated or on a flip vs a PP. But i would prefer to shove AQ around the 10-15bb mark! Just having slightly less chips always induces a raggy ace or hands like KQ/kj to call in these games yeh i think I would min raise with AQ if I had around 20bb, but then if we 3 bet, is it an easy fold? effectively if we get 3 bet, they know they are playing for my stack. Folding? You kidding right? This is a $3 MTT we have 17bbs and the ante is huge! Never fold this hand here to 1 reshove Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: Mordeca on July 03, 2012, 03:47:34 PM I prefer to raise here, you will always notice when you shove for this amount like 20bbs your near enough always in trouble when you get called. By being dominated or on a flip vs a PP. But i would prefer to shove AQ around the 10-15bb mark! Just having slightly less chips always induces a raggy ace or hands like KQ/kj to call in these games yeh i think I would min raise with AQ if I had around 20bb, but then if we 3 bet, is it an easy fold? effectively if we get 3 bet, they know they are playing for my stack. Folding? You kidding right? This is a $3 MTT we have 17bbs and the ante is huge! Never fold this hand here to 1 reshove just asking questions mate, I personally wouldn't fold to a 3 bet here with my stack. what about A10 / AJ? Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: LeeMcshane on July 03, 2012, 03:55:25 PM I prefer to raise here, you will always notice when you shove for this amount like 20bbs your near enough always in trouble when you get called. By being dominated or on a flip vs a PP. But i would prefer to shove AQ around the 10-15bb mark! Just having slightly less chips always induces a raggy ace or hands like KQ/kj to call in these games yeh i think I would min raise with AQ if I had around 20bb, but then if we 3 bet, is it an easy fold? effectively if we get 3 bet, they know they are playing for my stack. Folding? You kidding right? This is a $3 MTT we have 17bbs and the ante is huge! Never fold this hand here to 1 reshove I would never say to fold here if i get shoved on. i just said i raise as i prefer to rather then to open shove 20bbs raise to fold is a no go here Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: SubZERO on July 03, 2012, 03:58:55 PM Prefer a standard raise here, as already stated in the thread people can then 3bet with worse. Jamming folds out those hands
AT is quite interesting, what do poeple think? Jam or fold, pretty close imo Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: the rage on July 03, 2012, 04:19:27 PM I think that, nine handed, from that position, with 15 bb, i would shove with AT-AQ and 77-JJ and raise/call with anything better.
Like the person that asked the question, i'm really not sure what the correct range for shoving or raise calling in this situation is. Not even sure if we should be hjamming with any pair here? Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: MC on July 03, 2012, 04:32:01 PM This is fine especially given the size of the antes. Our adjusted bb here is like 8bbs and I am pretty sure we aren't r/c with a 1600 stack at 100/200 no ante. silly comparison in an MTT as ranges vary wildly [ ] silly comparison Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: outragous76 on July 03, 2012, 04:41:29 PM It is, because by default peoples ranges differ greatly pre ante in mtts as does game flow and potentially icm considerations
Given table dynamics I would gladly min raise fold a tonne of hands off 18bbs which I wouldn't pre ante off a similar effective stack Title: Re: Is this shove ok? Post by: MC on July 03, 2012, 04:43:53 PM It is, because by default peoples ranges differ greatly pre ante in mtts as does game flow and potentially icm considerations Given table dynamics I would gladly min raise fold a tonne of hands off 18bbs which I wouldn't pre ante off a similar effective stack Okay, I see your point, and you're right, I just don't think it is 'silly' :) ... it means a shove is viable because of this maths, and means we can legitimately shove AT rather than fold it if we wanted to. Fwiw I raise/get it in myself. |