blonde poker forum

Party Poker $50 Pot Limit Omaha Hi - 6 players - View hand 2070407 (http://www.handconverter.com/hands/2070407)

BB: $61.04
UTG: $46.43
MP: $72.27
CO: $82.89
BTN: $63.83
Hero (SB): $50.00

Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is SB with 5h 7h 8c  Ahrt
2 folds, CO raises to $1.75, BTN calls $1.75, Hero calls $1.50, 1 fold

Flop: ($5.75) Jc 9h 8s (3 players)
Hero checks, CO checks, BTN checks

Turn: ($5.75) Th (3 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $5, BTN calls $5, Hero raises to $25.47

CO is very aggressive both pre and post, and opens wide  (39/30, CB 62, AG 3.17).   He has definitely adjusted versus me lately, folding to 3B pre and C/F flops.
BTN is ultra passive, though I only have 30 hands on him.  He's 59/3 with AG 0.6.

My main concern on the turn is that I think the BTN would flat KQ, he's that passive.  But I think he's just as likely to call with two pair, a low straight or a set.
I don't give CO much credence as he didn't bet the flop.

I don't think I can raise fold, and I can't fold, so I just potted to get maximum fold equity.    Thoughts?

If you get it in here in my opnion you are always always beat and hoping to hit your heart on the river. I think i flat in this spot and get out of the pot if i dont hit the nuts on the river. If he has KQ he will probably pay you off on the river anyway!

i'd call turn fold river as we never get bluffed and he never value towns himself.

pre looks like a fold though.

There is a 4 card straight on board, so many hand combos beat you, you will rarely fold out straights, and lose a lot making this move, calling is the nut line and always will be here regardless of HUD as we can lead heart rivers and get called by worse

CO can check nuts OTF sometimes, in regards to get maximum FE you cant in this spot. CO is never bluffing andBTN is never calling with a worse hand than str8 set/top 2/redraw on theturn so check raising OTT makes no real FE and turns your hand into a spin up!?
i think if we had KQ we would lead the turn 100% looking to 3b the stack over the line

Disagree that we we will rarely fold out straights. Think we fold out Q high straights a lot of the time. Problem one of the guys (usually CO) will have QK a lot.

Also, pre is a very clear fold ainec

I wouldnt be folding a Q-8
as to me KQ would lead out very nearly all the time to get called/raised by worse
 Jc 9h 8s Th just forces KQ to lead

??????

Why would you not fold a queen high straight?

What is your usual game? Kinda confused by your thought process here

you can expect someone to gain alot of equity on the turn, so if we had KQXX oop we nearly always lead KQ and nearly always get worse to call. we dont want 2 pairs sets FD to check back.



 I love check raising here if we had KQ but we dont and rarely will.

Im an avid fanboy of PLO full/6/HU cash/SNG

Thanks for the responses, and I guess I had an inkling that I was overplaying the turn - hence the post.  Even though in this particular instance they both folded, I'm conscious that I don't want that result to influence my future play.

The CO was bluffing, which I know he does a lot, and I wouldn't be surprised that one reason he didn't bluff the flop is because he knows it hits my SB playing range pretty well.  And I can only think the BTN had a weak made hand.

 

I generally play tight from the SB and I can see that this hand can catch a lot of the low end of straights, as it did here, and it's hard to get paid with the nut flush OOP,  but I disagree that it is a clear fold.   I know the CO well and there's a good chance he will bluff two streets on many boards, so if I had the flop I will still get paid.   And I think the BTN's passivity won't cause me too much trouble.

I think that's a bit of a more NLHE approach, against players who'll play aggressively being OOP with weak hands in PLO is a virtually impossible disadvantage to overcome, unless the player is incredibly weak, I think 3beting is better than calling here personally.

As for the hand defo chk/call the turn as played it's really difficult to run these plays on uncapped ranges (i.e. either hand can have KQ) also a lot of 2p/set combo's OTF will have Q's with them so it's also pretty easy for them to have like QQJ* Q889 etc or even if they have juat a Q high striaght with hearts they wont fold either and the pots getting much bigger thus reducing your river FE (YOU HAVE to bluff the river as well here)

I think leading might be a better play than chk.raising as only KQ will raise you and all the other hands will just call, you might not have as appealing a river bluff (you wont) but you can control the tempo and realise your equity with the initiaive which is always cool.