blonde poker forum

Stacks:
- Me : 15k
- Villain : 27k

Blinds 150/300/25. Raise from UTG to 600, CO calls, I CALL on button with X X, SB calls and BB completes. Flop  Ad Kh 2s, checked to me who bets 1300 into 3200. SB calls, rest fold. Turn  9d. SB checks, I check. River  Ts. SB checks, I bet 1800 into 5800. He tanks for around 5 minutes looking like he's going to call then raises to 7200.

What is our calling range / what do we do with:

1)  2c Ac
2)  Kc Tc
3)  Ahrt Jh
4)  Ac 5c
5)  2d 2h
6)  Ac Tc

Villain is young, has seen to be fairly aggressive in the orbit or so we have been at the table, however seems competent and we have yet to see him do something crazy.

1.  Why would we not barrell turn? as is, sigh call, K10/K9 possible here
2.  Not sure what we beat here apart from K9 and bluffs, but sigh call probably
3.  Again would like barrell turn, as is close but may fold, although your turn check gives implies weakness, so villain dependant
4.  Fold, unless read regarding float/bluff is active
5.  Barrell turn, as is, shove or snap call if your suspicious, as you smash most of the hands he has here, and really hope he would not call for a gutter on QJ
6.  See number 1 but quicker and less sighworthy

I would be wondering in game if sizing looks bluffy, your bet looks like very thin value to me on a bare ace, his large pot size raise into your stack implies if you shove he calls which would have me thinking bluff or nutted, you have repped weakness, although K9/K10 may think hey are miles ahead here.

I'm the villain in this hand not the hero fwiw

On the river, are hands 1-4 not exactly the same?

Reverse hands suck! The only value hands it makes sense for you to have are AT and A9s here. Did you really tank for 5 minutes?

Ya this. Can't see myself folding anything I've bet esp as you want me to think your strong, thinking of calling then raising- from a fish I'd fold vs anyone good I'd be super surprised to see it. Pretty much mashing the call button a lot though, it tends to be something stupid here imo with these reads.

Pretty tough now you've said your the villain. Still calling a lot, not sure about A5.

Ok, so if you guys are the hero in this hand and after checking turn behind and villain check raises river - what do we think he (me) has? And yes I tanked for 5 mins haha (More 'Hollywood' then anything, calling never entered my mind').

I think all the options of what you can have are: A9s or AT, or a hand that includes an ace that you have turned into a bluff.

I'm trying to work out if the Hollywood was intended as a level :)

When he doesn't bet the turn why would I want to turn an ace into a bluff though? Surely I would just call with an ace getting 3 to 1? Villain in this hand is Julian Thew. The tanking was intended as kind of a level as he'd previously seen me tank then 3 bet click the turn back with A K on 7 7 10 A vs Ben Jenkins ( was trying to make him spaz it in with all his 89s...etc - AK was basically the nuts here.. He nearly moved in then folded..sigh).

I don't think you're turning an ace into a bluff, it's just the only logical hand that you can have that isn't for value..

I thought there was a small chance the thread might have been because you made some sick move with A8s, which I don't think ever wins at showdown, but didn't really see why you'd get quite that funky.

But realistically you always have to have it here, it being AT or A9s as I keep mentioning. That's what u had right?. So hands 1-4 should fold and 5 and 6 should 3bet.

fwiw I don't think that Julian can have AT and possibly even A9 too. Just because his river sizing is small doesn't make it necessarily thin value, you just have such a weak range he can be inducing knowing that you just never really have a hand that he can get 3 streets from.

I bet the turn with half of those hands, fold all of them now

I'd decided to turn  Kd Qd into a bluff, was pretty shocked to see Julian snap and roll over  Ahrt Jh

Pretty much what I expected. Julian knows his range is pretty capped here and that given your appearance, you probably know that too so it makes no sense for you to use this sizing with a value hand. Just repping way too thin vs a thinking player.

Surely fold flop?..

Sigh that you didn't have A9s or AT! I assumed you could never have JQ or Kx here.

he's obviously decided the only hands you can have that wouldn't bet the turn is AT+KT and you're capable of turning something into a bluff, so he's bet small to i) save money vs your AT/KT raise, ii) try get a crying call of a weaker Ace/KQ/KJ or iii) try make you raise with something as a bluff - OTR he's calling 5400 to win 20k so needs to be winning 25% of the time.

If he ACTUALLY believes that AT + KT are your only value hands, given there are only two combo's of AT and KT suited (you'd not always call the offsuit hands to an UTG raise) and that you'd bet the turn with AT a reasonable amount of the time, and KT some as well (allbeit less) then he really doesn't need to give you many combo's of a bluff AT all to make it a striaght forward call for him.

I think the turn is the point in the hand where you decide how you're gonna proceed, if you think once he checks the turn he's capping his range to AQ and worse, and you feel like you can take him off a large piece of that range on blank rivers then you should bet turn/river big (obviously would be nice to just make a flush/K/Q OTR - although be prolly have to just call, or bet/fold on a Q river) you could decide to abort the bluff on the river after betting the turn as well if you had a read/reason as your equity on the turn will be higher enough to just bet for value.

Once we check the turn I think we're committed to just making our hand or trying to show down, as our value range on most brick rivers when we check the turn will be far too thin, if we want to raise the river as played then we need his range to have a fair few bluffs/razor thin VB's in it himself and is that's the case then I think we have more than enough equity vs this bet-size to just call. I personally would fold this river to Julian though as I don't expect him to be value-cutting himself ever here.

with river sizing im not folding 22 and AT, he can have worse for value.

We're out of position Dave, I assume you aren't advocating donking the turn...

Oh, wow I really can't read HH's can I. AH yes we're the "villain" who's in the SB. Yes, defo not advocating donking the turn, yh chk-fold flop, chk-call turn, chk-fold river (I'm sure you could make a case for calling actually but I dont like it vs Julian)

Erm yh well I don't know then lol these switcheroo's are very confusing.

I think after he checks the turn we'd be value-betting our good hands a decent % of the time.

+1000000

check/fold flop and there would be no confusing thread :)

I fold this fop like 99/100.. Really unsure why I peeled at the time and looking back it does seem pretty bad.

I dont think your line is going to get much credit for being anything other than a bluff most of the time.  

Julians line has his range fairly capped at Ax, maybe KQ/KJ unless he improved on the river so I dont think we can expect him to bet river often enough to make c/r a better option than just leading out for value so your range is heavily weighted towards bluffs and I think its an easy call for anything that he decides to go for thin value with.

edit-  hadnt read the responses but this is a better way of saying it