blonde poker forum

So I witnessed this exchange today:

Player 1 asked on facebook if anyone had any dollars for Vegas in exchange for Stars/Euros/Sterling

Player 2 replied I can do it for Stars money with 3% vig.

Do poker players not do stuff for other poker players out of kindness? Sometime in the future player 2 is going to need a favour, and to be frank, he doesn't deserve anyone to help him out if he's so damn nitty.

Or am I totally out of line, and what player 2 offered was fair enough?

Ah this reminds me, sorry to hijack thread, but i am going to be in the UK arriving the morning of the 27th May.  I will likely have about $2.5k US that anyone going to Vegas is welcome to them at spot but I don't really want to go out of my way to save myself like a score or something so would have to meet me in Central or East London or at Gatwick. 

I heard a near identical story over the weekend.

A player, very well known, and popular, was trying to buy some dollars for Vegas, and was offered up to x thousand at 3% above spot by a fellow poker player.

Needless to say, he declined the "offer".

Is it really even kindness? Its just at some point player 2 will need the favour/you are helping someone out (maybe even helping yourself if you want the stars $) so do it at spot.

Yep, if it's a pain or a nuisance or will be a struggle to do it just don't offer.

In general this is something poker players are way more helpful with doing than the average joe public. Not many people who you didn't really know that well would be up for bank trfr 1k for money online.

Agree with the point made though, just saying.

Definitely off to charge vig. A favour's a favour, no-one should benefit. Often these transactions are mutually beneficial e.g. one party needs $ cash for Vegas, the other party has spare $ cash he's not using, they trade- everybody wins.

I heard this today too and was amazed. I don't see it as a favour to others, I  thought the point of selling at spot was that both parties get a better deal than if they sold somewhere else, so both are getting an edge? If u don't wanna sell em don't, but to offer with a 3% tax? Do people do this with Stars $$ too these days? If not why not, same thing isn't it? Sometimes it's harder to get Stars $$ if you've maxed your limits, u can get real $$$ anywhere, maybe not at such a great rate. Maybe these guys should charge 5% on Stars $$

The only way I can see where charging vig is even remotely justifiable is if Player 1 had directly approached Player 2 and asked him to change it up and it didn't really suit Player 2.

So player 1 offers a little bit of vig to sweeten the deal for him.

The way player 1 threw the offer open to everyone on facebook - definitely seems out of line Player 2 asking for vig.

Do a transaction with a total stranger it is somewhat different.

Player 2 is assuming a small amount of risk - so charging vig in that spot is fair enough I think.

Is common to charge small amounts of vig for online money

Games are getting tougher ... edges getting thinner

Edit: Doesn't seem that out of line, just offering a service and putting an offer out there. Can't go to M+S bureau de change and use Stars cashier.

Just don't offer player 2 any favours in the future if he's not prepared to do it vig free though

Real World money is worth more than online money.  That is not only my opinion, that is where an established transfer market on 2+2 has it also.

Without going into too much detail, if you post on FB or on 2+2 that you have real World money and would like Stars money at par, you will get knocked over in the rush.  If you post that you have Stars money and would like real world money at par, you won't get knocked over in the rush.  Friends might help you out and if it suited their purpose as well, I'd definitely expect it to be done at par, whichever side of the coin I was on.

This is very much true. Think I know the player Tikay talking about and quite happy to swap at spot with him rather than have a few K $ lying around as not in Vegas this summer.

 I was thinking about this recently. A guy that lives in Dublin was offering players coming for the Irish Open euros for sterling at 3% vig. A guy in Oz used to make a shitload selling Aus$$$ every January for Stars money to all the international pros who came in. He had a good rep with Stars and got people's limits upped and stuff really easily. He also dealt t$$ for cash and for reg Stars $$$.

 I sort of thought that was all quite scummy.

 It used to be very easy in the Vic to buy money at spot but the obvious problem is that all players want to buy euro before the EPT Monte Carlo, Barcelona and the Irish Open and straight after that they want to sell it. When it's Vegas they want to buy $$$ and in July the lucky few want to sell.

 At Scoop time the guys with big Stars balances can find buyers from infrequent players who are giving the bigger buy-ins a spin.

 The guy who holds money in all currencies and is wealthy enough to not need to keep changing his bankroll back and forward is able to provide a massive service. There should really be a cost for services.

 In the past I have been very generous with my time and efforts changing money back and forward for people. I used to have a regular steady stream of people who came to me to collect money.

 I have found that when it comes to the time I want to collect my favour, the record of it does not always seem to be logged. I also find that when it gets to June many players just cannot understand that I may actually want $$$ myself and I perhaps don't want to sell them. Some people ask me at least three times when I say I haven't got them.

 I have never charged vig, but I do question if it would be wrong to "punish" players for the fact that they can't be arsed to be organised and they just expect me to do that bit for them.

 If you are asking about attempting to earn from selling lammers at the WSOP then I would say those people are scum (also people that refuse to buy them when they are in the queue waiting to buy-in in cash).

tx simon  ;whistle;

glad you posted this keith, i was chatting to tony & jaffa about this as i was shocked & disappointed that two well known players were offering to sell dollars in vegas but wanted 3% on top.

i'd rather pay full whack on the high street.

i go to vegas for 2 weeks mid june, should i be lucky enough to come back with a suitcase full i'll be selling at spot

I guess when you are in comminuty like poker (i excude the likes of myself, i mean pros dealing with this all the time), you need to take the view that its a yin and yang thing.

There is probably going to be a point where you want this (is it really a favour?) returned. As such, do unto others etc. What about the day where you just need an " insta-lend" because your money is in the safe at the venetian and you are stood at the cage in Rio?

Its the line of friends and business. If you see it as a business transaction  and you are never gonna see the guy again (maybe what Neil refers to in part), then i guess charging vig is your perogative. If you do this to a friend then you probably need to reassess a few things, especially when you might need the favour returned in the near future.

Something to be said for being under it, and never having to worry about such things :D

The only way both those sentences can be true simultaneously is if the guy is doing it to his International mates.

I could be wrong, but I think Neil started his post with what he used to think and then progressed to what he thinks now.

Personally I agree with most of what has been written itt, if 2 people both need opposite currencies then swap with no vig, then both are better off.  That's how the world works, and if one person wants to be a douche about it, then the other person probably won't swap with them and then they end up worse off because of their greed.  However, when one person needs the transfer and the other person is either going out of their way or even indifferent to it, then surely it is their right to decline a swap at spot rate, yet accept a swap for some vig?  Thinking of it in terms of "punishment", "favours" and "karma" is wrong imo, think about it in terms of the utility to the other person, if you're asking them to do it for free and they don't really need the swap, you're asking them to give you something for nothing when you don't really need it.  Save your favours for when you're under it imo.  If you're swapping these amounts it's not like you can't afford to spend the 3% on top, right?

IMO it is an utter piss take on the part of the person selling the dollars for spot + anything.

The person selling is already getting the better of the deal, just look at any money exchange on the high street.

Buying $ you usually get a rate around 4-5c off spot.

Try selling them back to the high street vendors and it will be 15-20c off spot

Dont think there's anything wrong with it, I personally have a network of friend where we'd all be prepared to slightly put ourselves out to help each other so have no need ever to have to pay a vig. But I don't think there's anything un-ethical or "wrong" about it. Often these exchanges are slightly inconvenient or cause a little hassle anyways.

Could write a long post but basically some people are far more organized than others, it's not that hard to get money at spot rate, charging vig isn't douchey if the person has to go out of their way to do the transaction + it costs them some + they would never expect the favour returned + they take on risk when at least half of the players in the UK are huge slow-payers.

Spot rate USD
Go to your bank and ask to open a USD or EUR bank account. I have mine with Lloyds TSB Offshore, I've previously had accounts with Citibank and HSBC. Friends have accounts at Barclays. The accounts are nearly always free. Mine has a min of £2k or equivalent to be left in there otherwise its £20 a month. Use a service like OANDA (others about) that you bank transfer GBP to and they bank transfer whatever currency you desire. Costs around $30 and you get more or less the spot rate. Wire money to casino of your choice.

Rupert is right, the amount of money people light off being disorganised with currencies is really dumb, it's not that hard to do, very cheaply.

As I said earlier, if Player 1 had gone to specifically to Player 2 and asked him to do it, then yes, maybe it is fair enough.

But to make a Facebook post asking if anyone wanted to do it and replying yes, if you pay me a fee seems out of order to me.

Pretty sure Flushy has posted here numerous times that his company or whatever will change money at (a really high) vig. Also pretty sure there are companies that say they will book your hotel room at a vig too that are directed at poker players. What's the difference? If the said person (I assume we are talking about my housemate here) signed up a facebook account and called it "MainEvent Foreign Exchange" and posted it would that be better? It's no different IMO, if people want to offer a service they can - at least it gives the consumer more options!

The difference is they are companies/businesses trying to make a profit as opposed to friends trying to make money from their mates for zero work.

The world is a curious place.

Some people need to re-watch Bill and Ted.

YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVXGC896Jdw

Be excellent to each other.

I'm gonna assume this was about me offering Julian USD at 3% for x amount.

First of all I did not initiate contact with julian, I just wrote on twitter explicitly stating that I had unlimited USD and wanted vig. He replied to the tweet so I followed him on twitter and PM'd him. THEN he was suprised it wasnt at spot. If he had no intention to pay vig he should have read my tweet more closely.

Second of all I've had so much demand that I've had to move the price from 3-5% to 4-6%.   I started off pricing incorrectly low.

6% for under 2k
5% under 12k
4% more.

vig could also depend on what type of chips you would be willing to receive instead of cash.
get me on facebook or on twitter. https://twitter.com/realandrewteng

this should be available ALL summer, although if sending from stars pre plan to be able to send it in america.
I take stars/ftp/skrill/£ bank xfer.

I will also be buying USD back near the end of the summer at much lower rates for the above methods if people have excess or a big score. HELL, maybe even spot if I have too much online.


Thirdly whether or not it is standard?  Yes it is.  I try to put myself in the situation of having currencies that people want on purpose, not to just give it away for nothing.
I'm more than happy for people to turn down my action, it happens all the time.

Some people just see and treat things differently to others, Andrew and Rupert treat everything like a business, and do very well out of it I might add, both are nice lads too.

However not everything in life is a business

"Second of all I've had so much demand that I've had to move the price from 3-5% to 4-6%.   I started off pricing incorrectly low."

Not everything is about reaching the correct price equilibrium. There are such things as mates rates, favours etc. Just because you are inundated with requests doesnt mean you should increase your prices for something like this, life isnt all about profit maximisation. Sometimes its nice to be nice and you are still earning a few quid whilst helping a bunch of people out who may in turn help you in the future.

Agree and I do lots of favours for friends as does Andy (inc tons of occasions when I give friends money vig free at whatever inconvenience to me). But when a player I've heard of but don't know that well etc asks in a more or less public forum if anyone has $$ available I think it's pretty reasonable to say "yes, but there's a vig" then they can take it or leave it as they wish.

I dont think charging VIG is that bad, but ive seen Andrew selling it on 2+2 for several years and others doing similar for other currencies. But i think its bad to think you misread the market and therefore increase the VIG because of demand. Bearing in mind you are supposed to be charging VIG to cover the costs, hassle of getting the currencies, these costs dont change. Only the sellers profit does.

I also think someone like Julian would fit under some sort of mates rates profile even if you dont know him that well- maybe its a bit old fashioned but he is a nice bloke, been around in poker years, British etc. Just the sort of person id go out of my way to help if could rather than try to "extort" him for the max.

Plus he got 4 kids! The vig is their dinner and clothes :)

I will say charging VIG is pretty standard on 2+2, its not on here because people know each other. It does make a difference when dealing with stuff

is there a big difference between charging a premium to get staked and this?

imagine in the old days people were just swapping %s or selling at cost to be able to afford to play a comp. obv things change and get more businesslike.

No it wasn't you I was talking about.

Andy def takes more of an aggressive approach and gets shit from us for it. If I think people won't be receptive to vig I normally just tell them that I don't want to do the transaction. Agree Thewy fits the bill for most people...

this is disappointing

It does tilt me when people are queuing up in travel agents, tescos, post offices etc to buy/sell Euros and Dollars at complete joke rates. You could honestly make a fortune just standing next to the queue picking them off and undercutting the rates, still leaving a massive margin in your favour. Obviously some people in the queue, generally females or older people, will ignore you and just cost themselves money still

Typical Wednesday afternoon- Middle age woman A walks in with a bundle of notes in an envelope carefully looking around always fearing that she is about to get mugged carrying this huge sum of £700. Asks for dollars, gets 1.428 for 700 getting $1k. Old man 2 walks in 10mins later after a lovely trip to the states with his grandkids, has $1000 left over, hands it in and happily walks away selling them at 1.666 collecting £600.

2 happy customers and £100 basically stolen from the local economy.

Yes, there's a massive difference between this and charging juice to get staked.

To play a live comp the player has got expenses, sometimes they are very high. Selling with 0% juice means the player is covering all of this.

Charging vig for for something that costs zero is a business.

By all means say no if the transaction doesn't suit.

But a mate who tried to charge me vig on a currency transaction wouldn't be my mate for very long after he tried that.

As Dubai said, life isn't just about profit maximisation.

As a raging capitalist, I can buy the argument (and sell it for a profit) that things are worth as much as someone else is prepared to pay for them.

Basically, you can do what you like with your money.

Would I charge an uplift on currency to someone I knew? No. But then I do all sorts of weird shit. I'm probably in the majority on this one, tho, in saying I wouldn't feel comfortable adding vig

not really any expenses playing online and everyone sticks a vig on that?

I would never charge anything for people I know, but I don't have a problem with those that do, its pretty easy to say no. There is probably enough of us on here that are willing to trade for nothing anyway I think.

it's insane -- also the effective swing from these 'buy back price gtes' is absolutely mental as well. might as well burn money.

now that's no problem at all to charge (capitalists gonna capitalist, etc) but when it's sooooo easy to sort out a much better rate (even for small 'taking the family on hols' amounts of money) that I sometimes do wonder if travel agent forexes are just darwin taxes ^^

 /derail

Decent sideline until somebody comes straight through the front door.

It's so very very easy to be organised with currencies tbh a decent part of me thinks if people dont do it for w/e reason then they should be charged for it, laziness costs money.

The next logical step is to charge mates interest when they need to borrow money.

I'd quite like to buy some dollars off somebody actually. Anybody know anybody that will sell at spot?

u say this like i havent already thought it up and done it. tbf i only did it for one guy cos i was wiping credit card debts and those apr are even more absurd than me.

LOL

I hope you can sleep well at night.

If I had friends like you I wouldn't need enemies.

im one of the best people in the world to be friends with.

Ego, much?

nah just like everyone else. elevated sense of self worth

Whilst most people were saying how poor form it was, I didn't think you'd done much wrong.

You're essentially running a business and that's fine. I sometimes swap GBP or Online money for Thai Baht and when friends can't do the trade I occasionally pay a vig for someone to do it. It's down to my own poor organisation of my life and money so I accept it and don't begrudge the people who earn a vig from it. In fact, if you're swapping money with people through forums etc who are not your friends irl then what you're doing is pretty smart and in ordinary circumstances I'd wish you luck and hope you earn plenty from it.

Not that you care because (and apologies if I'm wrong, I'm just basing this on your posts here) but you seem like another one of internet poker's breed of social retards that puts money above everything. I hope the credit card story was a joke or some extreme exaggeration because you should be ashamed of yourself if it wasnt.

What I find socially retarded is when people make sweeping judgements about someone's character based on a few lines of text on t'internet.

errm what now?

It isn't a 'whatever' it is a business with 2 high street locations.

As for a 'really high vig' dunno how anyone could ever consider 1pt really high, the time where we served poker players we ran to 0.5% profit margin so a $100k bank xfer we would charge $500 and typically offered anything from 2-5% better than the banks. When it came to live cash as 3 good examples we turned up at properties as far reaching as London, Leeds and the south west collected 6 figures in cash and had it in customers bank accts hassle free within 1-3 days. For this we charged the insanely extortionate rate of 1%, after the travel costs/staff hours we nearly made some money.

Was it always possible to beat the banks at our rates, no not by any means but all we did was provide options, every single time i had 2 people offering me matching currency i put the 2 in contact with each other so they could just do it at spot yet somehow i am getting mugged off by someone who doesn't know what he is talking about, of course though just like your mate Keys you are happy to come on here and bash me about a service i am providing which makes me far less money than the hassle is worth whilst also using this very same forum to further your own ends (the same forum that ive stuck tens of thousands into i might add)

Tufat I hope squeezing every little penny out of a 'community' you are supposed to be part of makes up for the fact you probably have 5 friends. I dont think there is too much wrong charging a bit of vig if the deal is putting you out, but to keep pushing the vig % up until you realise what the maximum people will pay is wrong. You may think your actually making the money, but the reason why your staking threads on twoplustwo are mainly filled with tumbleweed probably has a fact nobody wants anything to do with you. Carrying on increasing the vig is the same as people who post on the staking thread who just keep increasing their mark-up and staying 'oh this comp is super soft, satellite entries' etc etc. That's not the reason your increasing your mark-up, the real reason is you think people don't know what's going on so you can take advantage. We all saw what happened when that guy started trying to take the piss

 Mr Keys was right on his reading of my post.

 I used to think it was scummy and now I'm not so sure.

 I would generally let people deal with me at spot for large amounts. I put myself out, travelled to places I didn't need to go to to meet people, I carried currencies I didn't really need accross the border just because I'd done someone a favour and it was all generally hassle. I did it because I like the idea of a community where people build up credits of goodwill and it makes you feel like a nice person.

 I am starting to think I am a little naive.

 I am generally going to be less generous with people, both with my time and money.

 I don't think I will be changing money for vig, but I think from now on my stock snap-answer will be "I don't have any".

 It is interesting because there is the whole thing of exploiting people in poker, which presumably people here are comfortable with, and most poker players are prepared to pay for services, (massage, tournament vig, drinks, nightclubs, hookers), but on this one they just won't.

 Five times this year I have lent people money and they offered me interest which I declined. It didn't feel right.

 Not really going anywahere with this, just find it interesting the way people can feel so strongly about payment for services.

 I did follow the thread where Alex tried to sell at "too high a mark-up". Total bollocks I thought. Firstly I think that there is way too much thinking that there are standard rates like 1.25 or 1.3. I think the amount they should vary from tournament to tournament and player to player are much more than people seem to think. I personally think a lot of people undersell. On the other hand I see losing players trying to sell on Facebook all the time.

 On that subject and slightly derailing...it strikes me as totally ridiculous that players went to Monte Carlo and sold in High-Rollers and now they are home and selling in WSOP packages. I can guarantee that most people were a terrible bet in the tough fields in the EPT ahnd they are massively under-pricing themselves in WSOPs. They should have not played in Europe and saved their money to put themselves in Vegas.

 (that was not a dig at any individual, just an observation on the staking market).

Doing nice things for people is the measure of the person you are. I wouldn't really compromise who I was because other people do something different. I wouldn't become less generous because others may see me as naive. If I believe in community where people build up credits of goodwill and do something which makes me feel good then I would carry on with that belief regardless of others.

It is who YOU are. I hold the door open because I'm a gentleman not neccessarily because she's a lady.

 Of course you are right Mantis. I have just had a long run of people taking advantage of my good nature.

 I feel a bit like the nice Blackadder in the Christmas Carol one.

 Everyone is stuffing themselves with my turkey.

"Where's the milk of human kindness?"

"It's gone off, Baldrick. It stinks"

It doesn't surprise me that a moron like you would think I'd not spoken to several people about Mr Teng before making the post.

You're one of the most judgemental people here and I'm sure you don't meet too many blondes at the tenner rebuys in walsall.

what are the tax implications for this little business?  Sounds quite lucrative

 ;carlocitrone;

Well I don't wanna implicate anyone I've spoken with and I'm not going to post skype conversations here.

Can one of you or your friend Mantis tell me why I can't judge someone's character based on their own posts and comments and actions?

I know Mantis always just wants to pick an argument with me, which is fine but door's open if you want to as well?

This whole thread is becoming a bit distasteful.  I don't care how many people you claim to have spoken to calling people morons and social retards isn't ever the way to win an argument.

I know practically zip about Mr Teng, but charging interest for borrowing money is pretty much accepted as the fair thing to do in this part of the World.  Having said that I think it is better for the borrower to always offer and leave the lender with a right to refuse.  So long as nobody is doing a wonga.com then it seems a strange thing to get on your high horse about.

This is all barely far removed from the concept of lending money to play poker and sharing the spoils that there must have been some serious collateral damage to the glasshouses of the World these last few days.

Welcome to Blonde Mr Teng.

Hi Flushy,

Unfortunately for both of us I did know what I was talking about when I 'bashed you about a service you are providing'.  I sent a horse to you and you left him high and dry in Vegas with no money for the best part of a week, during which time you ignored all your phone and facebook messages from either of us.  I had to sort the situation with recourse to some friends who naively swapped money for free.  And, when you finally did show up with the money, the vig was still there, didn't seem like such a good deal really.  Hence I discouraged any other friends or horses using your 'service' because I didn't want to have to sort out the mess again afterwards.

Also, the 'community' lectures are a bit rich coming from a former full tilt pro, how much did you make out of that before they folded?  Where do you think that money came from?  Remember when you posted to the members of this forum that full tilt were "if anything safer than stars"?  Pretty lucky that 'stars bailed you out on that one really, now everyone can forget all about it.  GL with IveyPoker tho.

As i explained to everyone at the time we had massive problems dealing with the Rio, whereby the money was at the Rio but they would not give it to me and insisted on sending it back to London. I admit this was exceptionally poor and it was my fault for not anticipating potential hiccups, i had naively thought the Rio would operate the same way as the Bellagio and the Wynn.

As for full tilt, in what possible way was i to envisage what happened at full tilt? i personally made no money from full tilt, i played some tournaments for free and cashed in 0 of them. Since then though i believe those not breaking the law have had their money back no? And those that did have a channel to recover it, i may be wrong though.

Obviously the stars/tilt comment was clearly in error but lets not forget the reason the whole thing came crashing down was stars buying that bank in the US and committing fraud there.

Hardly standard.

I have never heard a poker player charging interest when lending money to another player.

Until this this thread.

I'd rather pay another player a vig than the sodding banks!!!

Barclays are utter shit for foreign currency fwiw. just a bunch of inept skanks.

 ;boldie;

Yea don't do Barclays!!

I sat and listened while the advisor told me I could have a USD account.  I asked if I could withdraw from it in USD.  I was told that was not a problem... they would have to give me GBP, but as they had an fx bureau in branch... I could move over to that and change it back to USD....

opening a usd account with barclays does not open a usd account with barclays. it's hilarious.

they then send you letters demanding money for nothing, saying come into branch to sort it out, go to branch, they look at you like you've killed their children and tell you to phone the company you took the account out with LOL I THOUGHT IT WAS BARCLAYS U FUCKS

you're taking the fucking fees but refuse to acknowledge the account.

I cant even shut the fucker now. geniuses.

also they fail to mention you cant DO ANYTHING with the account. inept fucks.


also turns out, that Poland may be a large country but million do barclays realise it has it's own currency, woman at the till said "oh but it's not on the drop down menu of currencies are you sure they don't use euros....."

TWATS!

interesting 

Having a USD account is useful (if you don't like paying vig) just make sure to ask a couple of questions before opening it  ;D

Account charges (pref none) account functionality (pref some) with particular emphasis on w/d'ing in USD.

Standout advice this, also, part of my checklist is:

a) Do they take d/ps'ts ?
b) OK, you got the fundamentals but can I make x/fr's ?

Anyone can feel free to PM me if they need to know more

Feel free to write some useful advice on making USD transfers Glenn.

bonnet la douche Rodney, bonnet la douche

Pretty suprised at some of the posts itt.

If anyone wants to give me a 5k loan at high street bank quotes I'm all ears, the fact I expect nobody to want too is why I think people charging vig when lending money is super standard and fair enough, whether you know them or not.

Ive never charged vig and If I didn't know/trust someone enough I just wouldn't do it

If anyone wants to prove how nice they are then I am willing to let them prove it by giving me USD at spot!

I have to say I was perfectly happy with using fliushy to get money out of Vegas last year (brag), although he hasn't replied to my PM this year about getting money there! I have tried to sort it out myself this year in getting money to Vegas but HSBC haven't managed to open the USD account with them that I asked for (expat with Internet banking etc.) but I think what they have offered is ok but I haven't checked up on it as much as I should with the limited time left. I did also charge no VIG at all when I had money in Vegas and other people needed USD but maybe I was being naive?

If people have limited time and are lazy/stupid like me what wold people say are the best options? A company like ICE delivers the foreign currency and sound like they will offer a better rate over the phone for larger amounts and will be generally fairly fast with this.

If I am just being stupid with what I have said at all I am happy to be told as much, hopefully with an alternative being offered.

cliffs on ICE forex company? Anyone used them? Flushy also not replied to my pm about using his service, but did only send yesterday :P

They will use Royal Mail Special delivery to send you your currency and it looks like they charge about 1.6% VIG online for USD (if my maths is correct) but will reduce that if you phone them up and buy over £4000 apparently.

yeh ice was good rate for a large chunk relative to the amount you'll get skanked by banks etc.


last year flushy was hassle for the first 2 weeks because of the rio third party schenanigans but given that hassle would assume it'll all be plain sailing this year.


I has some $ left over still if anyone near london/essex wants some at like 475% vig 'ish'

These people are pretty good imo. Always visited in person so can't make any representations about any postal services

http://www.thomasexchangeglobal.co.uk/

Anyone else giggle at that web address?

Like pen island and others.

Chortle


Edit: turns out pen island no longer has a pen-based website! Damn you, society!!!

Buy that man a large g and t.

Good to hear.

My sister can beat xe, for a favour I'm sure she'll do £10k.

That's how nice I am :)

Sorry guys but we can't do it this year, lots of problems relating to last year and other issues. Was really hoping would be up and running again in time for this years WSOP but its just not going to be possible.

Word of warning though if you do wire money to the Rio, you have to do it from your own personal account or you will not be given the money, they will also take over a week to send it back to the UK. Also on that note if sending money to the Rio be advised that you must take it all when you go to collect, you cannot leave it on deposit at the poker cage. Boxes are available but be quick.

Much much better off wiring your money to the Bellagio or the Wynn.

100 times more efficient to the Rio.

Used them a few times by post and never had any issues.

See that we've dropped about 3c on the dollar in the last week or so too :(

Very sound advice

+1

Plus if you wire $20k etc, you can withdraw $1k-$2k at a time or whatever. Can also use the chips in other casinos i.e Rio for WSOP buy ins, they just give Bellagio/Wynn a quick call to confirm.

Are there any issues in wiring the money from say your HSBC account and sending the remaining cash back to a different account?

There you go m8 :)

yes i'd like to know this. might be worth wiring it over as taking more than $10k in cash can cause issues at customs right? Or is it just a bit extra hassle/questions and not really a big issue?

No hassle whatsoever at customs AS LONG AS YOU DECLARE THE MONEY!

Just tick the box and when they ask you why you have got so much money, say you're playing poker at the WSOP and they have never asked another question.

Further, you can normally get the paperwork done with the customs guys in reclaim before the conveyor belt even gets started up.  So for reasonable sums that you are happy carrying, zero wires, zero vigs, zero time delay.

Rate depends on your bank not the casino. When spot was £1 = $1.55, I found Natwest (1.52)> Barclays (1.49) > HSBC (1.48)

Just send in $$$, pay the bank fees (around £18-£30) and the exact amount of dollars will be waiting for you at casino cage. Call/Skype the Casino cage for wiring instructions.

Haven't read the entire thread but I don't see there as being anything wrong with this. If you're in a business relationship with someone then you give them it at spot as you can reasonably expect the other party to help you out in the future but if you don't, you have no reason to expect you'll get anything back. There is always effort and risk involved in helping someone out, and they are in need, so why wouldn't I charge them a small vig? If it's cheaper than you would get from a commercial service then we're both better off, and saying that you'd rather pay more just because you don't like the idea of paying an individual for a service rather than a corporation is simply spiteful and means you both lose out. If the guy is charging too much then market forces dictate he won't get any custom anyway.

I get that we're in the habit of trying to help our fellow poker players out but at the end of the day this is business.

Sorry for part quoting you, but as I posted in my post, i guess this is the line.

For many people dealing with mates, or even just poeple they associate with in poker, it shouldnt be business. Poker is a tough world and you are going to need help occasionally.

However, if you solely see it as business and maybe even it is, then i guess Vig away!

There was a point made in the thread about "spot" being good for both parties, and I totally agree with this. Unless you are wealthy enough to hold rolls in 3 or 4 currencies, then not facing high street exchange rates should be good enough for most.

Right, and as I said, I wouldn't charge mates a vig, but that's because a) as a mate I like the guy and b) I can reasonably expect him to do favours for me in the future.

It's not like charging a vig is holding a gun to someones' head. There's nothing deceptive about it either. There is lots and lots of very dodgy stuff going on in poker, to draw attention to this and claim it's dodgy is drawing attention from all the actually dodgy stuff people do.

be a fun celebration night out if some on this thread won a bracelet

$300 per person, home by 1am

"Right, Alan had a starter, but Bill had a pudding - so that equals that out near enough, but what about Carl's brandy? That was $25! Sorry mate, you're going to have to add a little extra to your portion of the bill"

Wazz have you never done someone in this industry a favour not in the hope that you get something back?

I pray to god i leave the poker world having done more favours than having received more, pretty sure Trigg, Camel, Julian etc would all fit into that bracket as well. Seems to be the 'newer breed' don't fell that way and always need to make sure they get the best of it.

Of course I have and of course I will. But I won't get f***ed over again, tyvm, like I have done time after time when I'm too generous. On the whole I won't do for someone else what I wouldn't ask them to do for me.

I'm not looking to make sure I always get the best of it, I'm just looking to make sure I don't get the worst of it. A lot of the time these two goals will overlap.

Brilliant!

Isnt it funny though.  Since I joined here about 3 years ago there are a handful of guys I have done business with and would happily do anything for.  Dubai, Camel and Trigg.  Every dealing I have had with them has been totally straight and, honestly, everytime I maybe haven't been paid immediately but I always know it is fine and they are always at the end of a PM or phone and I trust them all completely.  There are a few others but you just know you are good long term.  There are others but amazing how you from only dealing with people online you know you they are safe and good guys.