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Title: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: david3103 on July 15, 2013, 11:51:43 AM .25/.50 table
Villain is capable, and starts the hand with around £200 I cover with c£400 almost all of it from a hand where he opened to £4 and with three callers I 3bet KK to £22 and picked up three callers to a 10high flop, all of whom called £41 I shoved the A turn for £76 (yeah, I know) Villain here folded and I got two callers both and scooped on a deuce river. So - villain opens in mid position to £4 (range for this is wide, very wide), two callers and I pick up Jh Jc in SB and 3bet to £21 Folds to villain who makes it £42 (range tightens here and is maybe 1010+ AQ+ and some funky stuff maybe. Folds to me, I call - I'm not just setmining but I'm wary Flop is Q high rb, I check, Villain checks Turn is a 10, I check, Villain bets £40 Call Raise / call Raise / fold Fold Also, what to do IF we call turn, and a 'safe' river card arrives Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: George2Loose on July 15, 2013, 11:58:13 AM Probs call once and fold on most rivers
Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: theprawnidentity on July 15, 2013, 01:07:11 PM Probs call once and fold on most rivers Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: pleno1 on July 15, 2013, 01:11:54 PM lead turn?
Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: stato_1 on July 15, 2013, 02:05:32 PM Calling the turn is okay, so is leading but you just have to be prepared to give up the pot on the river when called. If you lead the turn and villain raises, you have an easy fold. If you check/call the turn, then I'd fold to a river bet. You're only ahead of AK in the 4-betting range that you have assigned them. Why do we have to be prepared to give up on the river when called? Leading the turn isn't a bluff. Think if we lead the turn and get called, we're more likely to have the best hand than not Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: david3103 on July 15, 2013, 02:31:57 PM Calling the turn is okay, so is leading but you just have to be prepared to give up the pot on the river when called. If you lead the turn and villain raises, you have an easy fold. If you check/call the turn, then I'd fold to a river bet. You're only ahead of AK in the 4-betting range that you have assigned them. Why do we have to be prepared to give up on the river when called? Leading the turn isn't a bluff. Think if we lead the turn and get called, we're more likely to have the best hand than not ?? because we get raised by better? Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: Pinchop73 on July 15, 2013, 02:52:55 PM Calling the turn is okay, so is leading but you just have to be prepared to give up the pot on the river when called. If you lead the turn and villain raises, you have an easy fold. If you check/call the turn, then I'd fold to a river bet. You're only ahead of AK in the 4-betting range that you have assigned them. Why do we have to be prepared to give up on the river when called? Leading the turn isn't a bluff. Think if we lead the turn and get called, we're more likely to have the best hand than not ?? because we get raised by better? Because with villain as described, when we lead turn and get called he has just as much if not more Tx/lower pairs/draws in his range than Qx/over pairs. As played, depends how clever villain is. Is he capable of checking Qx+overpairs on the flop? Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: rfgqqabc on July 15, 2013, 03:07:21 PM Anyone i know? I like c/c turn, not that much worse he can call with. Might as well let him bluff.
Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: pleno1 on July 15, 2013, 03:24:47 PM its a pretty big part of his range though, especially considering than he didnt cbet id say he has over 50% of the time ak in this spot. maybe closer to 80%
Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: david3103 on July 15, 2013, 03:33:43 PM Calling the turn is okay, so is leading but you just have to be prepared to give up the pot on the river when called. If you lead the turn and villain raises, you have an easy fold. If you check/call the turn, then I'd fold to a river bet. You're only ahead of AK in the 4-betting range that you have assigned them. Why do we have to be prepared to give up on the river when called? Leading the turn isn't a bluff. Think if we lead the turn and get called, we're more likely to have the best hand than not Well OP has assigned villains range as TT+ & AQ+. We only beat AK in that range... I did add in the chance he has some funky stuff too. Also, he's just seen me play KK aggressively postflop. I think my question is about working out how often he's bluffing/semi bluffing here. It's £126.50 to win £210 Anyone i know? I like c/c turn, not that much worse he can call with. Might as well let him bluff. Tony, don't know surname but he's more a Gala reg than G. Older than you, younger than me, 40something maybe. Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: pleno1 on July 15, 2013, 03:49:48 PM Do people never check back strong TP, sets and overpairs on dry boards? They do otherwise idsay he has 100% ak Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: david3103 on July 15, 2013, 05:31:43 PM It's live and this is my second 3bet in around two hours, but it's only been an orbit or so since my first.
I'd been dealt garbage for the first hour and a half plus and it was a table of 'those who do not fold' with three or four shortstack jockeys just waiting to chuck £20 in with half decent equity and a couple of serial non-believers. I sat and waited for a hand, and found it with the KK hand described in OP. Since the KK hand I've been more active in opening pots because a) I've had better hands, and b) a few of the calling stations are away. Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: david3103 on July 15, 2013, 06:03:27 PM It's live and this is my second 3bet in around two hours, but it's only been an orbit or so since my first. I'd been dealt garbage for the first hour and a half plus and it was a table of 'those who do not fold' with three or four shortstack jockeys just waiting to chuck £20 in with half decent equity and a couple of serial non-believers. I sat and waited for a hand, and found it with the KK hand described in OP. Since the KK hand I've been more active in opening pots because a) I've had better hands, and b) a few of the calling stations are away. I presumed it was online. Never seen a .25/.50 live game before! Don't really think they will have too much funky stuff in their 4-betting range if you haven't 3bet too often. you've not been to the North East then? Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: paulhouk03 on July 15, 2013, 07:27:21 PM In Manchester they had 25p 25p tables
Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: david3103 on July 15, 2013, 08:26:20 PM It's live and this is my second 3bet in around two hours, but it's only been an orbit or so since my first. I'd been dealt garbage for the first hour and a half plus and it was a table of 'those who do not fold' with three or four shortstack jockeys just waiting to chuck £20 in with half decent equity and a couple of serial non-believers. I sat and waited for a hand, and found it with the KK hand described in OP. Since the KK hand I've been more active in opening pots because a) I've had better hands, and b) a few of the calling stations are away. I presumed it was online. Never seen a .25/.50 live game before! Don't really think they will have too much funky stuff in their 4-betting range if you haven't 3bet too often. you've not been to the North East then? Nope, I haven't. Any good? Nah, would be boring for you DTD regs. Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: Rexas on July 15, 2013, 08:34:30 PM The first live cash game I ever played was a 25/25 game in the luton G, with a max buy in of £20. I ground it out for about 7 hours after busting the pub poker final tournament while my lift was still in, and ended up about +£10, and felt on top of the world.
Relating to the hand, I probably lead/fold the turn and lead most safe rivers, as played I call the turn and re-evaluate the river, probably check folding but that often depends on bet sizing and any ninja stuff. If in doubt, just river a set, and lol sick when he has AK. Title: Re: I erred preflop, but what to do now? Post by: rfgqqabc on July 16, 2013, 01:51:36 AM Calling the turn is okay, so is leading but you just have to be prepared to give up the pot on the river when called. If you lead the turn and villain raises, you have an easy fold. If you check/call the turn, then I'd fold to a river bet. You're only ahead of AK in the 4-betting range that you have assigned them. Why do we have to be prepared to give up on the river when called? Leading the turn isn't a bluff. Think if we lead the turn and get called, we're more likely to have the best hand than not Well OP has assigned villains range as TT+ & AQ+. We only beat AK in that range... I did add in the chance he has some funky stuff too. Also, he's just seen me play KK aggressively postflop. I think my question is about working out how often he's bluffing/semi bluffing here. It's £126.50 to win £210 Anyone i know? I like c/c turn, not that much worse he can call with. Might as well let him bluff. Tony, don't know surname but he's more a Gala reg than G. Older than you, younger than me, 40something maybe. |