blonde poker forum

5p 10p PLO cash table on sky.

I am dealt  7c 9c Ts 2s on the button, and it limps to me. I call, SB completes, BB checks and we see a flop 6 ways.

FLOP (Pot .60)

 Jh 9d 8s

Hijack leads for .30 playing £9.80, we call covering, and utg calls playing £4.65.

TURN (Pot £1.50)

 3s

Checks to us and we lead for £1.10, utg folds, Hijack calls.

RIVER (Pot £3.70)

 9s.

Hijack checks, we check back.

General thoughts? Should we value bet this river card (game is very station-y), should we bluff this river, raise flop, raise pre, fold pre.....

Turn there seems no reason to not pot. At plo10 I probably raise vs a half pot bet I assume this to be more sets/2 pairs than the bus.

River seems like a slam dunk check back though.

If you're raising the flop, is it a full pot raise? And are we raise - folding (I assume so)?

Now that I have no idea about nor pre flop :D just tried to post the obvious things I could see from the hand. I think potting turn and river is a kind of merge because sometimes he calls worse, sometimes he folds chops and he basically never has us beat.

The river is one of those kinda weird cards, because it improves our actual hand but strengthens our opponents range. Even weirder because we have a 9 blocker... Don't expect him to have a straight very often here, think he can have a flush and an FH though.

Prolly gonna start putting up a fair few PLO hands, if it's a spot I'm not 100% on :p

they should change the rules, we have trips, a straight and a flush! got to win!! :D

Fold pre for sure

Hi rexas,

Why are we even in this hand? It's a muck job, pre-flop, for me.

We then flopped a bad straight, & back-doored a bad flush.

Honestly, only trouble & pain awaits playing these sort of hands, imo.

all of this, absolutely fold pre.

Once we are in multi-way, even when we flop the straight, we have to just get to showdown as cheaply as possible. Think I like to check back the turn and call/pot if checked to most rivers, though I admit this could be a little passive.

We don't ever have Q10 here, as we certainly don't limp any hands we like with these cards in on the button. (although, I guess you likely would looking at this hand  ;))

However, I think he CAN have Q10 if the game is station-y....

just to play devil's advocate, what about potting pre here due to being on the button and double suited?? - would obv be potting the flop as well in that case.

MMMM. Always the case but i don't mind pre-flop, yeh pretty ropey hand but I think OTB we can just about get away with this for a limp - raising, when there is a legit chance of getting limp - re - raised and no-one is going to fold (even if they call we have a hand that does pretty poorly vs even limping ranges) so if we're putting money into the pot we don't wan't to be putting any more than 1 big blind in. ANYWHERE but the btn this would be a slam dunk fold.

Sounds silly, but i'd actually just go and fold the flop, you against what 16 cards seems pretty likely someone prolly has QT, or at the worst the same hand and we might not be able to show it down, or a set and me have only 60% and cant make any aggressive action really to protect our equity. Also we're not closing the action.

The turn, I would check back, we kinda have the best bluff catcher and there is a chance we can manage rivers a bit better, we're not really scared of any river card that doesn't pair up and  maybe induce a bluff or a Vbet from top set or something, don't hate betting though and the sizing is fine, would prolly go bigger if anything.

River is a check for SURE. If you bet here then you are bluffing, imo, and it's not a terrible spot to be bluffing with naked T79 but i think you high enough up your range to just check and try win - chances are you aren't folding out a bigger flush anyways (even though POT should) and there is a chance someone has checked like 88 and should prolly fold that too but I fancy no-one is folding the NF or 88 in these games.

I like Ruuds point about us never having qt here. It's a fold flop for me too.

I think we can get to the turn here as played with QT, obviously the face we limped P/F and just called the flop does reduce the chances somewhat.

I think no-one in this hnd has QT TBH, which makes me think - well what are they c/c the turn with? Spades, T7, or a set/2p?

I just think that, over time, we are never going to make money playing these sort of hands.

It sounds to me like we played it because we are bored, & need some action.

I'd open two or three Tables (assuming they are running, I know the liquidity is thin), & that way, we can be more realistic with our starting hand criteria. It's amazing how much better we play if we have 2 or 3 Tables on the go, & don't play hands just for the sake of finding some action.

Quite right tikay. Win a small pot or lose a big one?

But the button is so much fun for repping funky stuff it's worth a shot. I never thought about the fact that playable hands with a Q and a T will nearly always be raising the button here. Good stuff. I have learnt something in 2014 already.

Yes, I agree, it is a good point, but that is after the fact, we have caused ourself to be in an awkward spot because we played a hand we should have binned pre. IMO, of course, we all play different, & I'm super nitty, but personally, I like winning money, not giving myself repeated headaches. If I lose, I don't mind, but I don't want to be thinking "bugger, that was a daft play by me". I really don't mind being outdrawn, not a bit, I'm a grown-up now, but I loathe making unforced errors. The decision we should concentrate on is the first decision - "shall I play this hand?". That's where the problems begin. All imo, obv.

IDK if lose a big one or win a small one is the big issue with this type of hand, main problem is that in a multi-way pot we're never really gonna flop magnum enough to put a lot of money in fast and put people under big pressure. Thing is though multi-way pots pretty tend to play tighter/straightforward and we have the kind of hand we're gonna be able to stab quite a few flops/turns OTB - so I think you CAN make a lil money limping along - you're absolutely right though, these sort of hands in multi-way pots is really not where the money is made in online PLO.

I actually think you'd limp enough QT** hands OTB here, and you should do as well, hands like QT65, even dbl suited will play a lot better as a limp here given that we might get limp/re-raised and no-one is folding really. KQT6 stuff like that, all plays better as a limp behind here, imo.

Wouldn't be ISO'ing here all the wide from the btn, mostly just big cards with a suited ace - where we can flop bigger draws and get people putting money in bad etc.

yes yes yes!

Hmmm... Well, I'm going to post my logic for playing this hand pre and see what people think of it.

Firstly, its likely to be a 6 way limped pot, so in that sense we have to put in 1bb to win 5. We have a reasonably playable hand, if the two didn't double suit our hand I wouldn't play it. We have a 3 card run with a gap at the bottom, if the gap was anywhere else I wouldn't play it. Even though we are most likely to be winning a small pot with this hand, I think the fact that we are IP can give us enough information and/or control over the pot to be able to win that small pot and make us far less likely to lose a big one (we're unlikely to get stacky with the second nuts in a 6 way limped pot, as we did not in this instance).

Preflop fine.

Calling it 10nl PLO not fine lol.

Fml :p Edited :)

we're on the button :P

Hehe.

Why?

I disagree at these stakes

I'd assume people pot with the nuts and bet smaller with medium strength hands, similarity to no limit they will often bet a % of the pot that collie rates with their hand strength.

On the turn he should have never have the nuts

I agree he almost never has QT when he checks the turn.

What pleno said.