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Is it worse to be knocked out of a World Cup by Wales at rugby, Bangladesh at cricket or Costa Rica at football?

(https://metrouk2.files.wordpress.com/2015/09/wales1.jpg?w=748&h=501&crop=1)

(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/03/09/267686B400000578-2986092-image-a-35_1425897436230.jpg)

(http://i2.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article3756084.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/Costa-Rica-v-England.jpg)

Seeing as Wales are ranked higher than you in the Rugby I guess it's one of the other two.

And we're actually ranked higher than you in Football as well. Not bad for three Million people. What's England's excuse?

the rugby because it was at home, though beaten by two very good sides

the cricket can happen, plenty of variance in the short formats. any top ten side can beat any other

we were already out before we played costa rica. the national team gets marginalised by the focus on the premier league, so was inevitable despite the media ra-ra before hand 


all three have/had structural problems in coaching, domestic game structure and selection that contributed

the virulent anti-English stuff from various other countries whenever England get beaten is extremely tiresome, i have to say

perhaps if the English matched the rabid nonsense emanating from others, they'd get more fired up...

The ODI cricket WC under Moores was dreadful.  All that embarrassing stuff about "need to look at the data" when their batsmen had imploded (again).    I think that was the worst out of the three for me, simply because the coach came across as so utterly idiotic.

I was going to start a thread regarding this they other day, quite obv the rankings are a joke, and both Wales and England are overrated re the rankings.

But which team realistically will have better prospects next Summer in the Euro's, England I'd say are literally drawing dead and can not win, Wales obv very very unlikely also, but the fact they do have one legit World Class Star in the team means they could always provide a shock, think I'd have more hope as a Welshman than an Englishman next Summer.

That's assuming Bale isn't injured for the rest of the qualifiers otherwise you won't even make it  ;nana;

Actually Tighty I think you will find that Tal's opening line about how little old Wales managed to beat mighty England is the offensive line and extremely tiresome for the rest of the World. Unless Bangladesh and Costa Rica have suddenly shot up the rankings to be second only to the greatest team over the last eight years then why is losing to Wales such a shock? It's not as if England have ever achieved anything under Lancaster? Grand slams? No. Have they even won the six Nations under him?

And what is extremely tiresome is all the press saying that the World Cup will be less of a spectacle without En-ger-lund there. Why? You're not good enough so why would the rest of the World want to watch you play? John Inverdale is the epitomy of all that is wrong with the English Media. "So Ireland v Italy is poised on a knife edge. Now Sir Clive, where do England go from here". Who cares? Not the Irish or the Italians forced to watch ITV and not the rest of the World looking forward to the quarter finals.

And Tal, if you were fishing then you caught a whopper. WP.

Losing at home to a Welsh C team is a shock. Like it or not, Wales fans.

Literally drawing dead?  Carlisle drew with Liverpool the other day and the gap between us and Germany is a lot less than the gap between us and Germany is way less than the gap between those two.  One off games can and do produce upsets, other wise betting would be very straight forward. For instance, Bradford City recently got to the league cup final, and we are, and were, a lot worse than Sunderland.

I don't think the rankings are "obviously a joke" either.  Of course the randomness I referred to above can produce odd results, but they simply reflect the performances of England and Wales over recent history.  

I think your view of England is common though, so instead of getting terrible value like you always used to when backing England, you can actually find some decent prices.  

FWIW I have backed England, Wales and Belgium for next year's Euros, all above the current best prices.  

I think Bangladesh is likely worse off the top of my head.  Suspect that must have been bigger than 3/1 (which was the Wales vs Endgland price I think) though can't be sure.

Not if you continue to pick your own C teams.

Nick Abendanon
Manu Tuilagi
Dylan Hartley
Steffon Armitage
Luther Burrell

All five should be starting and if Lancaster could have grown a pair he would have insisted that they were in the squad. Michael Cheika knew that he needed the likes of Matt Giteau and he insured the Australian Rugby Union allowed him to pick who he wanted.

As for the Football, our ranking is a joke but if we keep on wining then we have to go up not down. To be above the likes of Holland, Italy and France is a fallacy as we would surely struggle against those sides.

Mr Rubbish, you're wide of the mark.

The nation seems to have gone mad this week. We lost to two teams ranked higher than us. Whilst we should have beaten Wales from the position we were in and whilst there are clearly substantial issues to address on and off the field, it's highly questionable as to whether it's as bad as the other two recent, English sporting examples I gave.

Hence, I started a thread to gauge opinion. Nothing more, nothing less.


To address Tighty's point, England drew with Costa Rica, having already been eliminated, but Costa Rica finished top of the group at our (perceived) expense.

A shock is now defined as an event that happens 25% of the time?

Highly questionable?

Surely, seeing as Australia are ranked below Wales, you should have asked - "Is it worse to be knocked out of a World Cup by Australia at rugby, Bangladesh at cricket or Costa Rica at football"?

And in actual fact you're doing Costa Rica a huge disservice as they beat Italy and Uruguay which was something En-ger-lund couldn't manage.

Well I could have done, sure. But the hysteria was really from the Wales game, as the reaction from the Australia game has been largely "We were beaten by a much better team", as opposed to "how did we throw that away?"

Ranking alone doesn't determine likelihood of outcome. Unlike the other two, England were at home in both rugby games and were second favourites to win the tournament. Rightly or wrongly.

And you're not reading what I wrote, so I'm not sure where that leaves us for a debate.

Please don't take offence where it isn't intended to be given. Some of us out there would like a home nation to win the world cup and will be supporting them. Some English people have Welsh, Scottish and Irish blood. Some of us just like seeing northern hemisphere teams doing well.

I'm not really one for starting rucks on this forum. I very much don't intend to start now.

English sport has been awash with failure and perceived underachievement in recent times. All I did was start a comparative thread.

And some of us abhor the ABE approach to sporting events.

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/oct/05/england-drop-eight-world-rankings-following-exit-rugby-world-cup (http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/oct/05/england-drop-eight-world-rankings-following-exit-rugby-world-cup)

By the time the tournament kicked off on 18 September, Australia were at No2, England No4 and Wales No5

I think you and Tal are getting confused about how rankings work.

We lost to one team ranked lower than us (Wales), and as a result we fell below them. 

Australia were ranked above us before the tournament began and still will be after they beat us.  I haven't seen current rankings, but suggest it is likely Australia will be back in 2 when they are revised following Saturday's result. 

Australia were best priced 13/10 to beat us, Wales were 3/1. 

My bad, guess we were lucky.

Probably want to find something worth getting all abhorred about

Blimey, that must have taken some foresight. Well done.

I don't really care one way or the other if England sports teams do well or not.

England's most vocal supporters are usually insufferable twats, so it's nice to see them lose.

I'm really glad the Rugby boys sang they hearts out singing the national anthem.

Cricket world cup capitulation was the worst.

At the risk of stirring up bad blood on the thread, this is basically it. In my experience most Welsh people will cheer on the England football team in a major tournament, or at least not actively want them to lose, and obviously cricket they are supporters. The attitude of SOME English rugby fans and indeed some players really really grates. That's what people react to. Is it daft? Yes. But let's face it pretty much every other rugby playing nation feels the same way. Just ask Ali Williams.

Think the Scottish just hate you regardless mind...

Although that said when it's stripped of humour or context it's ugly and unpleasant.

A large chunk of this current Welsh team is either born in England or has one English parent so think that tones it down a little. I've met plenty of Welsh people who just instinctively hate England. They are also insufferable twats for the most part.

Much like the rabid Wenger-bashing that occurs after every Arsenal defeat.

My experience is the complete opposite. I can't think of any Welsh person I've ever met who doesn't want England to lose every game they play, and I used to live in Wales so that's a fair few of them!

Same here, they arent as twatish as the Scots about it but they still love to see a good England trouncing!

We do like to see you lose at rugby (see the emboldened part of Keith's comment) but I and loads of Welsh people I know support English teams and sportspeople and are happy to see them succeed.

I am Welsh but live in England.  I support the England sports teams as long as they are not playing Wales.

I do think it is a shame England got knocked out of the Rugby World Cup, it has taken some of the shine out of it.

They love to wind up the English about it. That's very different.