blonde poker forum

This happened to me earlier today: I'm Foaming_H in seat 4.

Game #612745904: Texas Hold'em No Limit (100/200) - 2005/07/02 - 14:56:08 (UK)
Table "Tourney 762697 - 2" Seat 2 is the button.
Seat 1: rober (3335 in chips)
Seat 2: ProdigyNH (3110 in chips)
Seat 3: __dog__ (5070 in chips)
Seat 4: Foaming_h (5582.50 in chips)
Seat 5: Pasbesoin (12655 in chips)
Seat 6: donross (2785 in chips)
Seat 8: Dougyfish (6810 in chips)
Seat 9: Toadave (6915 in chips)
Seat 10: Tito123 (5495 in chips)
__dog__: posts small blind 100
Foaming_h: posts big blind 200
----- HOLE CARDS -----
dealt to Foaming_h [Ks Kh]
Pasbesoin: folds
donross: folds
Dougyfish: raises to 400
Toadave: folds
Tito123: folds
rober: folds
ProdigyNH: folds
__dog__: calls 300
Foaming_h: raises to 1200
Dougyfish: calls 800
__dog__: folds
----- FLOP ----- [Ts As 5c]

Now, as I have to act first, what bet would you make?

with the money being that shallow i would have gone all in preflop

because you have a raiser and a caller meaning afull raise would have been 1600

nearly 30% of your stack once you are willing to put 30% of your stack in

you are really commiting yourself to the pot and therefore should be the

raiser not the caller and get them all in picking up the money preflop or getting all

in as a 2-1 favourite vrs Arag or bigger favourite vrs pocket pair or suited connectors

once you made the mistake of underraing preflop you have 2 choices on the flop

represent the Ace and go all in or check fold

Yeah, I did end up check-folding, fortunately I picked up Kings again later and doubled up against the same guy who had 9's.

I'd bet half the pot 1200, if you are reraised throw it away you are still ok with 3200ish and you either win it or know you're beat.
If you check he bets and you can't call, if you go allin you are hoping he ain't got an ace and that's a big hope-suicide really.
Ian

I dont think check fold is a bad move, assuming he bet fairly stiff. as Ironside said, your only other bet was allin before he gets a chance. if it's a medium A he might even put it down

also perfectly reasonable advice

I'm always very wary of minimum raises, I don't like to use them personally because you tend to be inviting the call from rags in the BB.

Moving all in is far worse than check calling.


You need to make a decision here, either u are miles ahead or miles behind, so the only options are check call a bluff, or check fold to the ace.

any call on the flop is waste of chips as you have 2 more bets to call (the turn and river)

either bet or fold

Well either he has an ace or he doesnt.

If he does your fecked.

If he doesnt then why would u want to push him of the flop when u are miles ahead, far better to call a bluff.

It depends on the size of the bet, if he moves all in i think a call is a better move, if the bet is around the 1/2pot-pot size then a fold is a better move.

lets say he bets 1200 you call
then 1800 on turn you call

then you call all in on river

if your going to put another chip into pot bet all in on flop

ior personal i would check fold

And all I can add is.....welcome to blonde, noflopshomer!

And I would not have played KK either. I just wait for Aces.

My point is if you check he almost certainly will bet and you can't call, you may as well have a pop at the pot than just give up.
You can't go allin cuz if he has got an ace you will lose and you just gave 3200 chips and your tourny away.
If you bet half the pot and he flat calls then you get to see if a king comes or a spade and then rethink.
His initial raise and subsequent call does not suggest a rag ace but it is the internet after all!!
Ian

The guy's raised and then called the reraise. You have to think about what he might have from that series of events. Unless he's an erratic player, of which should be noted in your notes, he's got aa, ak, aq, qq, jj. Maybe 10s or aj, but it depends on what type of player he is. Anyhow, taking those options into consideration, there are quite a few possibilites that involve the ace.

My opinion would be that you should just accept that you should have made a bigger preflop raise, swallow your pride, and check. Like you said, you doubled up later. Is it really worth risking the all-in when there is a pretty good chance he has the ace?

I wouldn't halfbet the pot either. This is often a tell-tale sign that someone is weak, so you may get reraised whether he has the ace or not. If he calls, have you really learnt that much? You've still got to play first on the turn.

The worst thing you can do in my humble opinion would be too check and then call it down. Sometimes you've just gotta let it go.

I would of shoved it all-in, pressed the pannick button on the 4 street.
Hit the king on the river then waited for the abuse.

   

Subtle as a house brick, our John.

"Shoved it all-in".......

Tikay
Odds on me getting a upgrade on Virgin. Made a mistake on the net booking my ticket.

Spelt Mr, Dr

Silly me

Good Luck

John

You travelling with Professor Shalson?

Where were you for the last longer on bfair tonight Tikay ?

See you Tuesday.

Proff.(emeritus) Shalson

this has what to do wit  kkk??

brag elsewhere re vegas trips please.


raise stronger,and be pepareed to release if ace flops.after all,ur not married to   kk  thank god !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What exactly is "wit kkk??" ?

And I always say "if you've got it, flaunt it" !

Sorry Portfolio, but that's the way it works on blonde. We meander. It's that sorta site, see?

caught en flagrante  !!

my bad.

The first ever live hand I played was pocket aces in a small tournament at Walsall, and I lost to a KJ. He was one of those awful players who kept rebuying, shoving all his chips in every hand hoping to get lucky. Anyway, that's why I'm "No Flops".  :D

I would always bet the flop if I am the original raiser or re-raisor whatever comes on the flop. If you go by this rule, you will make profit in the long term by being aggressive and the amount of pots you steal will compensate for when you get called. If you normally bet 50% of the pot when you hit, bet 50% when you do not hit, this way you cannot be read. if you always bet full pot however, you must bet full pot as good players will smell weakness. In this situation I would bet because you still have outs (2 kings), If he just called I would check on the turn hoping to get a free card on the river, if he bet again, I would pass. You've got away cheaply with KK in my opinion. Also, when you play KK v AX, it in not a bad play to see the flop, rather than go all-in, so you only give the Ax player 3 cards instead of 5 to hit his lucky Ace.  In Phil Helmuths book, playing like the pros, moves his chips in post flop with KK against a good player, who will actually fold AJ and lower. This seems a bit risky though.

i tell ya what!!
That is some bit of advice there Rob for playing kings, "so you only give the Ax player 3 cards instead of 5 to hit his lucky Ace".
Never, ever occurred to me that one, thanks a lot. Definite strategy change for me with kings.
cheers,
Ian

Would be very interesting to see some more of the better players opinions on this thread.

A friends of mine live by this rule with KK.

Never play an un-raised pot, but never re-raise (unless its multiway or v early)

The point being that you get to take the safe flop first, ok so occasionally u will fold to QQ JJ etc on Axx flop, but more often than not u save urself from an outdraw. And a player with AK AQ AJ is still going to bet a missed flop or if they caught a pair.

You may only give them 3 cards to hit but you also get less of their money into the pot, so I guess it depends on the situation as to which would be preferable.

Yes, but he could also fold his ace to your preflop agression.

folks very rarely fold AK to preflop aggression, and if someone with aq hits the q then you will get their chips.
I agree though it's horses for courses but how many times do you see an Ace on the turn or river against your queens or kings when you're allin?