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Poker Forums => The Rail => Topic started by: mikee_j on March 13, 2006, 04:15:46 PM



Title: Building a bankroll
Post by: mikee_j on March 13, 2006, 04:15:46 PM
at the moment i only play small stakes STT and MTT ($2, $5 & $10) and have a small bankroll. what advice can you give me in order to build my bankroll so i can play in the bigger guarenteed tourny's and cash games?

any advice on bankroll management and building a bankroll appreciated


thanks

Mike


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: stallyon on March 13, 2006, 04:31:27 PM
I also play these low limit games and managed to build my bank roll up to about $150 from a starting bank roll of $10 in about 6 days purely from money finishes in 9 and 6 seater STTs and the odd MTT money finish here and there. My bankroll took a dramatic nose dive last week when I entered a MTT after MTT only to get knocked out just before the money by fish and calling stations. My bank roll plummeted to just over $1 by last Saturday so I now have the task of starting from scratch. Its up to about $6 after 3-$1 STTs so will stick to $1 for the time being until it gets to about $44 then I'll move up to $2. This would give me about 20 attempts at $2 STTs before going bust. My money finish rate is quite good at these low limits so I'd be looking to finish in the money 7 out of 10 games.

I hope my way of managing a tight bankroll helps you to find your system.


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Sheriff Fatman on March 13, 2006, 04:48:48 PM
at the moment i only play small stakes STT and MTT ($2, $5 & $10) and have a small bankroll. what advice can you give me in order to build my bankroll so i can play in the bigger guarenteed tourny's and cash games?

any advice on bankroll management and building a bankroll appreciated


thanks

Mike

The simple answer is bonus whoring, and ensuring you get rakeback at the sites which support it.

At the stakes you play, the various deposit bonuses will add a significant proportion to your bankroll.  Its simply a case of depositing at sites offering bonuses, working off the requirement then moving onto another site and starting the process again.  To give an example of the amounts available I can think of the following re-load bonuses which are currently available on a few sites:
Stars - 20% upto $120, available until the end of today.
Party - 25% upto $100, with 2 further matching bonuses available if you clear them quickly, available upto 16th March

Also, most sites (except Stars) have initial deposit bonuses available for new accounts.  Examples include
Doyles Room - 110% upto $550
Eurobet - 100% upto $600
Full Tilt - 100% upto $600
Party - 20% upto $100
Absolute - 100% to $300

T&Cs vary from site to site.  Some bonuses expire, some don't.  Some can be cleared from tournaments/SnG's, others can be done only via ring games.  Some sites count raked hands differently to others.  Consequently, some bonuses are harder to clear than others.  Ideally, if you can make deposits to get the full bonuses (so ~$600 available to deposit into some sites) then you can clear the bonuses without putting much of those funds at risk.  At the end of the day, just taking the above bonuses into account you could potentially make $2,570 even if you didn't make a single cent in actual poker profit!

Rakeback is generally done through an affiiliate who pays you back a proportion of their income from you signing up through them.  You can only do this for a new account (so existing accounts don't qualify) and some sites (e.g Stars, Party, Paradise) don't support/allow it.  However, at the sites where it is available it guarantees you an additional payment each month based on the volume of your play, again enabling you to play break-even poker and still make money.

Basically, this is the easiest way to boost your bankroll at low limits.

Sheriff


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: thetank on March 13, 2006, 06:42:09 PM
Bonus whoring is good, it also lets you try loads of sites and decide upon which you like best.

Try pyramiding your bankroll up to interesting levels playing  your STTs.

Say you've a roll of $300 play $10 STTs.

Level 1 -$10 STT
1st place-play a $20 STT (Level 2)
Anything else - Try again Level 1

Level 2 - $20 STT
1st place - Move to Level 3
2nd,3rd place - Try again at Level 2
no cash - move back to level 1

Level 3 - $30/$40 STT
1st place - Move to Level 4 ($50-$100 buy in)
2nd,3rd place - Try again at Level 3
no cash - move back to level 2

etc

Once your roll is at $600 do the same but not going lower than Level 2. Once your rolls over $1k again start at Level 3 and don't go lower etc.

A bad streak will not lose you as much as a good streak will gain you. I found myself short rolled early last year and built it back up sooner than I thought possible by using this method.

I'll commend you in a good choice of game. IMHO STT are the only option when short rolled if you're serious about building it up. Cash games and MTT require too large a roll to make the same money. A good MTT result could get you back on track, but then again there's a greater % chance of ruin playing them on a short roll.


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Jim-D on March 13, 2006, 07:29:30 PM
Bonus whoring is good, it also lets you try loads of sites and decide upon which you like best.

Try pyramiding your bankroll up to interesting levels playing  your STTs.

Say you've a roll of $300 play $10 STTs.

Level 1 -$10 STT
1st place-play a $20 STT (Level 2)
Anything else - Try again Level 1

Level 2 - $20 STT
1st place - Move to Level 3
2nd,3rd place - Try again at Level 2
no cash - move back to level 1

Level 3 - $30/$40 STT
1st place - Move to Level 4 ($50-$100 buy in)
2nd,3rd place - Try again at Level 3
no cash - move back to level 2

etc

Once your roll is at $600 do the same but not going lower than Level 2. Once your rolls over $1k again start at Level 3 and don't go lower etc.

A bad streak will not lose you as much as a good streak will gain you. I found myself short rolled early last year and built it back up sooner than I thought possible by using this method.

I'll commend you in a good choice of game. IMHO STT are the only option when short rolled if you're serious about building it up. Cash games and MTT require too large a roll to make the same money. A good MTT result could get you back on track, but then again there's a greater % chance of ruin playing them on a short roll.

Great idea Tank.

and listen to this guy as he is a STT Legend!!


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: GlasgowBandit on March 13, 2006, 07:44:51 PM
I agree Tank that sounds like a plan.

I think I will give that a go.

TBH I was finding my success rate was up when playing STT's but I tend to get bored and start pissing the money away in cash games or trying my luck at the  big MTT's.  I think I have to set myself a target, set some individual goals, realistic ones so when I reach them I am rewarding myself for being disciplined.


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: mikee_j on March 13, 2006, 11:57:08 PM
thanks for the advice. i'm going to try the pyramid method.




Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: thetank on March 14, 2006, 12:08:17 AM
I've posted it before, others have reported using it succsefully.

Definately going in the book.  ;)


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Tinsel Town on March 14, 2006, 12:20:36 AM
Well. Here's my tuppence worth.

I've only been playing poker online since July.

Started off on $5 tables and lost ,rebought and lost again playing STT and Mtt

Realised eventually that I was more suited to STT. More chance of a cash and I've worked my
way up the buy ins.

I now play the $20/$30 STT on Paradise mainly. I'm trying to get better at MTT
gradually by entering $10 two and three table SnG on Stars.
Stt is my favourite though. I've discovered the ladders tourney's on Boyle lately
and last week got my biggest win with an $800 payout for a $5.50 investment.

All the best
 Td Th


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Rod Paradise on March 14, 2006, 11:20:09 AM
Can someone explain ladders tourneys to me? Not come across them yet.


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Rusty on March 14, 2006, 02:37:18 PM
thats the best pyramid scheme I've heard of, i hope this helps my poker bankroll it could do with a boost, i just seem to be losing recently. Thanks Tank


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Rookie (Rodney) on March 14, 2006, 02:41:58 PM
Bonus whoring is good, it also lets you try loads of sites and decide upon which you like best.

Try pyramiding your bankroll up to interesting levels playing  your STTs.

Say you've a roll of $300 play $10 STTs.

Level 1 -$10 STT
1st place-play a $20 STT (Level 2)
Anything else - Try again Level 1

Level 2 - $20 STT
1st place - Move to Level 3
2nd,3rd place - Try again at Level 2
no cash - move back to level 1

Level 3 - $30/$40 STT
1st place - Move to Level 4 ($50-$100 buy in)
2nd,3rd place - Try again at Level 3
no cash - move back to level 2

etc

Once your roll is at $600 do the same but not going lower than Level 2. Once your rolls over $1k again start at Level 3 and don't go lower etc.

A bad streak will not lose you as much as a good streak will gain you. I found myself short rolled early last year and built it back up sooner than I thought possible by using this method.

I'll commend you in a good choice of game. IMHO STT are the only option when short rolled if you're serious about building it up. Cash games and MTT require too large a roll to make the same money. A good MTT result could get you back on track, but then again there's a greater % chance of ruin playing them on a short roll.

 ;tightend;  Great pyramid structure - i may give this one a go myself. Tank, you are just a fountain of knowledge!! :P


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Robert HM on March 14, 2006, 02:53:48 PM
Can someone explain ladders tourneys to me? Not come across them yet.

I'll use Ladbrokes Treble Chance Ladder as an example.

The bottom rung is a $3.00 + $0.30 buying to a 10 man STT, the last 3 standing get an entry in to the next Level

Level 2, $10 +$1, last 3 get a ticket to Level 3 and the fourth gets another go at this level


Level 3, $10 +$1, last 3 get a ticket to Level 4

Level 4, $100+ $10, pays £500 £300 & $200


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Rod Paradise on March 14, 2006, 02:59:43 PM
Thanks Robert, so it's basically the site doing what Tank is talking about.


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: TheJagster on March 14, 2006, 03:06:16 PM
The big difference Rod is that if you are in an organised ladders tourney you cant get out until you get to the top.

This means playing the top level which isnt too bad at Laddies but on some are higher.

If you do it yourself you can decide to amend it along the way...or take half out....or play an mtt or whatever.



Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Robert HM on March 14, 2006, 03:08:16 PM
Thanks Robert, so it's basically the site doing what Tank is talking about.

However you can't cashout half way through.


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Rod Paradise on March 14, 2006, 03:14:05 PM
Thanks Robert, so it's basically the site doing what Tank is talking about.

However you can't cashout half way through.

Cheers Robert, Jagster, got that - but are you stuck in front of the PC for 4 STTs in a row or can you take the place in the higher level when you want?


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Robert HM on March 14, 2006, 03:14:54 PM
yes you can buy in at any level


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Rod Paradise on March 14, 2006, 03:16:08 PM
yes you can buy in at any level

Thanks, I've seen these and stayed away becasue the explanation of them isn't too clear. Now I think I'll try Tank's way.


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: Robert HM on March 14, 2006, 03:17:03 PM
That would be a far better idea, gives you more flexibility


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: mex on March 14, 2006, 04:01:41 PM
I have implimented a system v similar to tanks with lots of success on 2 occassions.

I only use 20x buying buffer but i know this to work due to having a lot of stt records.

This leads on to the next thing you need to do this well ...... good record keeping.


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: mikee_j on March 14, 2006, 06:14:28 PM


This leads on to the next thing you need to do this well ...... good record keeping.


so what do you use for record keeping and what data do you collect?


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: mex on March 15, 2006, 03:31:01 AM
i use a basic stt spread sheet from 2+2 forum(boohiss). i'm sure someone has a link i lost mine.


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: mikee_j on March 15, 2006, 01:43:27 PM
i use a basic stt spread sheet from 2+2 forum(boohiss). i'm sure someone has a link i lost mine.


if anyone has a link it would be appreciated. i used to use a little book but have lost it! need to start record keeping on my pc so i can't lose it!


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: CelticGeezeer on March 15, 2006, 04:07:41 PM

Link Below

 http://www.bluefeetpoker.com/2p2SNGspreadsheet.zip


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: mex on March 15, 2006, 04:29:40 PM
Thats the chicken, just modify the tabs and away you go!


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: mikee_j on March 15, 2006, 05:12:25 PM

Link Below

 http://www.bluefeetpoker.com/2p2SNGspreadsheet.zip


thanks mate


edit: wow, thats a detailed spreadsheet. what do u mean by modify the tabs? just change their names and dates?


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: mex on March 15, 2006, 06:52:04 PM
change names to buy ins, change game buy in details players and structure and away you go, it auto records just push start tourney when you start and end when it ends, enter result, it does the rest.


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: mikee_j on March 16, 2006, 05:03:33 PM
i'm gessing the 'Vigourish' underneath the buyin is the regisration fee amount?


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: moritzey on April 04, 2006, 01:19:05 PM
Thanks for the link Celtic, that spreadsheet rocks. By the way, how did you find it? Been googling for it, but couldn't find a website or another link to it anywhere..


Title: Re: Building a bankroll
Post by: CelticGeezeer on April 04, 2006, 02:18:10 PM
it was on the 2+2 forum.