blonde poker forum

PokerStars Game #5163302875:  Hold'em Pot Limit ($0.10/$0.25) - 2006/06/05 - 18:48:15 (ET)

Table 'Ambrosia III' 9-max Seat #9 is the button

Seat 1: RazFolderson ($23 in chips)
Seat 2: paying--name ($2.75 in chips)
Seat 3: vancouver68 ($14.20 in chips)
Seat 4: SAFC2005 ($66.50 in chips)
Seat 5: bigb54 ($32 in chips)
Seat 6: CBubba47 ($16.20 in chips)
Seat 7: chelsea_1994 ($51.10 in chips)
Seat 8: live2ride69 ($56.05 in chips)
Seat 9: CC720 ($24.90 in chips)
RazFolderson: posts small blind $0.10
paying--name: posts big blind $0.25

*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to chelsea_1994 [ Ks Kh ]
vancouver68: folds
SAFC2005: calls $0.25
bigb54 is connected
live2ride69 is connected
bigb54: raises $0.25 to $0.50
CBubba47: calls $0.50
chelsea_1994: raises $1 to $1.50
live2ride69: folds
CC720: folds
RazFolderson: folds
paying--name: calls $1.25
SAFC2005: calls $1.25
bigb54: calls $1
CBubba47: calls $1

*** FLOP *** [ Tc Ts  5h]

paying--name: checks
SAFC2005: checks
bigb54: bets $3
CBubba47: folds
chelsea_1994: raises $5 to $8
paying--name: folds
SAFC2005: folds
bigb54: raises $22.50 to $30.50 and is all-in
chelsea_1994: folds
bigb54 collected $22.45 from pot
bigb54: doesn't show hand

*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $23.60 | Rake $1.15
Board [Tc Ts 5h]
Seat 1: RazFolderson (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 2: paying--name (big blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 3: vancouver68 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: SAFC2005 folded on the Flop
Seat 5: bigb54 collected ($22.45)
Seat 6: CBubba47 folded on the Flop
Seat 7: chelsea_1994 folded on the Flop
Seat 8: live2ride69 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: CC720 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)



was the fold the right move here?

No i don't think so. I'd have called anyway. I can't see how he could have a 10 playing the hand this way. If he has three 10s here he jus calls or raises double to invoke action. He dosent want to win the pot here and make just a small profit with 3 10s in my opinion.

I do put him on a hand though as he raised small amount pre flop out of position and for this and his post flop play i put him on a pocket pair lower than your own and probably lower than the 10s, probably 66 through to JJ, and here he is obviously assuming he has he best hand, which is fair enough given the flop.

You made a strong fold and i can't criticise you for it, but i only know i wouldve called, because i couldnt see him playing a 10 in this manner with no draws on the flop, so no reason for him to worry if he did in fact have three 10s.

Its all down to situational factors and the image and game of the player in question, but i know i wouldve definetly called here. Would it have won you the pot if you had. Probably, but not definetly.

From what I can see this is pretty 50/50 but I think I would have folded.
The preflop raise and subsequent smooth call probably rules out Aces. Assuming he fits into the way 80% would play pre-flop, that leaves us with
a) hands you are beating 77, 88, 99, JJ, (I discount QQ because he would prob re-raise pre-flop)
b) hands you are losing to 55, A10, K10, Q10, J10, 109,  108 (the latter would prob have to have been suited for him to raise)
c) a stone cold bluff (discount this if you haven't seen him bluff yet as there are 5 players in on the flop)
For me, the chances of you being beat look to outweigh the chances of you being ahead. So ordinarily I would say you are correct in passing.
 
However, one slight complication. Your raise on the flop of 'only $5' may have been construed as weakness. Your call will have left the pot at close to $10. So if he did have JJ (which is still one of the favourites the way this panned out) he may have led out 'testing the water'. Having seen a weak re-raise he may think you are holding 'AK' or '99' or lower pair
So this brings it back to 50/50...

EL Blondie, of course you're right with your summary, and in a tournament with your tournament life at stake i would have folded. But in a cash game, and only costing $22 more to win a pot of $52 i think its a call. I just cant see him playing a 10 this way instead of trying to make further profits.

I also believe its looks most likely he had JJ,9 9, 8 8 although i think you should be able to discount 10 8, 10 9 and J 10 given his pre flop raise of doulbe the big blind out of position.

I also agree with your conclusion where you state that the $5 raise could have been seem as weakness.

Good pint if its $22 all-in to win $52 then the odds may sway it into a call....but its still slightly more probable that the Kings are losing

Ok, lets work through it.

innitially il start with elblondies (b) hands,

55 - I dont beleive the player in question wouldve move all in at this point with such a large holding.

with 910 and 810 - i dont believe he would make a min raise preflop with that sort of hand.
neither would he do that with K10 or A10

I think the most likely hands he would consider doing that with that ur losing to is a J10 or Q10,
But the major point to consider, i he has led out with $3 on the flop...would he do that in a multiway pot on a safe rainbow board with a 10?

(a) hands, big pairs like AA or QQ, i agree with elblondie he would have reraised ur $1.50 preflop.
i believe the most likely hand he has is a pair 7's to J's...most probably JJ with his min raise preflop.

And as horneris pointed out, it is cash not a tournament, its a call from me,

LeKnave

thanks for the great replies.

i think one of the deciding factors into why i folded was that he was a tight player, i hadnt seen him play many hands. i also felt 'lost' in the hand, partly due to the number of preflop callers after my re-raise and his allin re-raise. i really didn't know where i stood and when i feel like this i usually fold to a big bet, something i maybe have to work on.

if this was in a tournament i probably would have called but judging from your replies that would probably not be a good call? why would that be?

thanks

Mainly as in tournament play, if u call and your wrong, your tournament is over..when u couldve folded and waited for a better opportunity to get your chips in with and saw urself move into the money.

In a cash game, if u call and are wrong you can simply reload and play with the same field hopefully with some newly aquired information about the player in question, information you can use to take your money back in the future.

I do agree about u saying how you felt 'lost' in the hand and with only a limited amount of time to make your decision it would be very hard to run through all of the aforementioned possibilities! 

LeKnave

i suppose with time and more experience i will be able to weigh up the possibilities quicker and posting on here has really helped.

thanks

I'd call. After a preflop reraise, you expect him to trapcheck a set here, especially when he's not sitting on too many chips.

I think you should raise a bit more preflop though to define your hand more.

 ;iagree;

I miss poker in 2006 :)

shrewdies really were ahead of their time!

 :D