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Poker Forums => Poker Hand Analysis => Topic started by: Enzyme_ on October 02, 2006, 07:01:38 PM



Title: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Enzyme_ on October 02, 2006, 07:01:38 PM
Playing Poker Live
9 Handed
Blinds £1/£1

Three players involved including myself

Me - £43
Player 1 (2 positions to Left Hand Side of me) - £160ish
Player 2 (Right Hand Side of me) - £44

Player 2 asks the person before him to stradle to £2, so he then goes £4, previously i had made comment on straddle so outa spite i go £8 and he dont look too happy!

Deals cards

i find

 Ks Kc

The guy to my left folds

Player 1 makes it another 10 ontop to go (£18 Total) folds round to player 2 who calls the £14

So i ship in my chips for another £25, Player 1 thinks about it then passes, and player 2 thinks about it and calls

Flop  7d  4c  9h
River  3h
Turn  Ac

He declares two pair 7's and 9's

Can anyone justify callin 14 with 79 then the other 25 quid??




Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Royal Flush on October 02, 2006, 07:08:10 PM
Yes, and player 1 is a mug for passing.

Also why straddle 8 when you only have £44?!?!

P.S. 50p please.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: thetank on October 02, 2006, 07:12:23 PM

 outa spite


Same place the call (which wasn't atrocious) came from perhaps?


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Enzyme_ on October 02, 2006, 07:13:41 PM
Yes, and player 1 is a mug for passing.

Also why straddle 8 when you only have £44?!?!

P.S. 50p please.

ill donate 50p but just wanted if anyone would agree with him calling me


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: cambo on October 02, 2006, 07:44:04 PM
he was a maniac , blinds £1-£1 and every single hand he made it £25 to go , he done all his money then went to the bank . not long after he came back i get aces , and to my frustration he raises only £6 1 caller. i tried to make it look like a bluff saying ok im sick of this make it 40, hopeing he had king 10 or something knowing he would call with a hand like that. shame they both passed . should have played it diff in hindsight.

the most annyoing thing tho was he won all his dosh back plus more with 6 2 against aces then got up and left straight away!


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: MrsLime on October 03, 2006, 02:23:54 AM
Playing Poker Live
9 Handed
Blinds £1/£1

Three players involved including myself

Me - £43
Player 1 (2 positions to Left Hand Side of me) - £160ish
Player 2 (Right Hand Side of me) - £44

Player 2 asks the person before him to stradle to £2, so he then goes £4, previously i had made comment on straddle so outa spite i go £8 and he dont look too happy!

Absolutely ridiculous.. I assume this is a 'joke' post.

If not, you should either pull up or find a smaller game. You are effectively playing 5 BB.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Enzyme_ on October 03, 2006, 03:54:51 PM
Lime,

Nope i had about 75 before but the muppet that is player 1 bought in well over the limit i did object but i was out numbered!


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Royal Flush on October 03, 2006, 04:10:25 PM
Lime,

Nope i had about 75 before but the muppet that is player 1 bought in well over the limit i did object but i was out numbered!

What is the limit in a 1-1 game?!?!


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Timaloy on October 03, 2006, 05:46:03 PM
There isnt a limit in this game, the 25/50 game had a 50 limit but the usually 1/1 games never had a limit.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Enzyme_ on October 03, 2006, 07:02:50 PM
There isnt a limit in this game, the 25/50 game had a 50 limit but the usually 1/1 games never had a limit.

yeh but its a big of a joke when everyone else is in for 30-70 quid to put up 180 then as you seen steve just re-reaise everything 10-20 quid


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: GlasgowBandit on October 03, 2006, 07:03:15 PM
Lime,

Nope i had about 75 before but the muppet that is player 1 bought in well over the limit i did object but i was out numbered!

What is the limit in a 1-1 game?!?!

Some players will sit down with £20 - 50

Some play with 40 - 100

Others may sit down with well in excess of this.

Personally having experience of this game i won't sit down with any less than £70 even when the average is say £50.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: GlasgowBandit on October 03, 2006, 07:04:22 PM
ohh and I dont see anything wrong with the call with 9/7 I think you should maybe have made the raise a bit bigger pre flop.  You know what some players are like in that cash game.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Royal Flush on October 03, 2006, 07:31:24 PM
Sitting down with 20-50 in a 1-1 game is surely a bad idea?


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: tantrum on October 03, 2006, 07:37:41 PM
Quote
Sitting down with 20-50 in a 1-1 game is surely a bad idea?
not if you play with your enemy's money


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Newmanseye on October 03, 2006, 07:43:47 PM
Sitting down with 20-50 in a 1-1 game is surely a bad idea?

You should try THIS game in particular Flushy, you would sit with £50 as well it limits the outdraws, most of the table are calling stations, no need for a big stack you wil get it at the table.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: cambo on October 03, 2006, 07:44:06 PM
most people will sit down with 60-70 flushy which stil isnt the best, as most of the time ur puttin all ur chips in on 1 hand, where it can work in ur favour for the good players like timaloy is sit with 60 then double through then with everyone constantly buyin back you can make a good few quid


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: temp0r on October 03, 2006, 08:05:07 PM
Yes, and player 1 is a mug for passing.

i second this notion.
in future i suggest not moaning about people calling when they have implied odds and finding a cash game with half decent structure.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: thetank on October 03, 2006, 09:25:02 PM
Sitting down with 20-50 in a 1-1 game is surely a bad idea?

You should try THIS game in particular Flushy, you would sit with £50 as well it limits the outdraws, most of the table are calling stations, no need for a big stack you wil get it at the table.

You get outdrawn, you reload.

I doubt Flushy would buy in for £50.

If you can beat the game, have a bankroll to stand it, sit with a stack to maximize EV.

Would you rather risk £50 as a 65% fave, or £200 as a 65% fave?


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Enzyme_ on October 03, 2006, 10:02:26 PM
Yes, and player 1 is a mug for passing.

i second this notion.
in future i suggest not moaning about people calling when they have implied odds and finding a cash game with half decent structure.

player 1 never called player 2 did the shorter stacked one, i wanted player 1 to call i would have taken out draw off him just player 2 caling i find odd but im only a newbie anyway :)


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: MrsLime on October 03, 2006, 10:25:29 PM
player 1 never called player 2 did the shorter stacked one, i wanted player 1 to call i would have taken out draw off him just player 2 caling i find odd but im only a newbie anyway :)

I know I'm not allowed to correct anyone's grammar, but this is surely the world's worst sentence.  What does it actually mean?  How can we respond meaningfully to such gibberish?


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: thetank on October 03, 2006, 10:45:12 PM
Well I suppose we'll let you off MrsLime, seeing as you did it in such a humble, benevolent and understanding manner.  ;)


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: thetank on October 03, 2006, 11:03:45 PM
Here's how I read it.....

It was not gentleman one who called, 'twas gentleman two, the shorter of the stacks don't you know.

I would have welcomed with open arms, and a drop of cognac, being outdrawn by gentleman number one, he used to skull for my brother at Eton. Sadly, he lacked either the stiff upper lip or testicular fotitude required to make such a call, and my chips were taken by the other fellow.

Most peculiar.

I'm a trifle new to this whole shooting match, my Granmama used to play bridge with the Duchess of Kent though.

To be fair, that doesn't make much sense either.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Royal Flush on October 04, 2006, 04:49:59 AM
Sitting down with 20-50 in a 1-1 game is surely a bad idea?

You should try THIS game in particular Flushy, you would sit with £50 as well it limits the outdraws, most of the table are calling stations, no need for a big stack you wil get it at the table.

You get outdrawn, you reload.

I doubt Flushy would buy in for £50.

If you can beat the game, have a bankroll to stand it, sit with a stack to maximize EV.

Would you rather risk £50 as a 65% fave, or £200 as a 65% fave?

Exactly, if the game is full of calling stations i want to be deep. The only time i want to be shallow is against players who i can't really outplay down the streets, but i am comfortable that i have an edge on the flop and pre flop.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: boldie on October 04, 2006, 09:16:30 AM
Here's how I read it.....

It was not gentleman one who called, 'twas gentleman two, the shorter of the stacks don't you know.

I would have welcomed with open arms, and a drop of cognac, being outdrawn by gentleman number one, he used to skull for my brother at Eton. Sadly, he lacked either the stiff upper lip or testicular fotitude required to make such a call, and my chips were taken by the other fellow.

Most peculiar.

I'm a trifle new to this whole shooting match, my Granmama used to play bridge with the Duchess of Kent though.

To be fair, that doesn't make much sense either.

rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Timaloy on October 04, 2006, 02:21:07 PM
Interesting hand from that night

Loonie player in question is on the button with around £400, you have £450. One of the few hands that isnt raised £25 pre flop.

8 Handed Ring Game

You: BB with 3h6h

5 way Hand Limped to you on BB, You call £1 straddo.

Straddo Checks.

Flop comes 3s6s8c

Pot: £10

SB Checks

You Bet £10

Folded to Button who raises to £25

Pot: £45

£15 to call......What do you do against this maniac player?



Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: boldie on October 04, 2006, 02:32:45 PM
what do you mean, what do you do? you bang em in there. I'd reraise him.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Royal Flush on October 04, 2006, 02:48:03 PM
Call.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Timaloy on October 04, 2006, 02:52:20 PM
How much do you bet, what do you put him on, your out of position against a hyper agressive and unpredictable player, whats your reason(s) for raising here?


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Timaloy on October 04, 2006, 02:54:55 PM
You call £15

Turn Ah

You to act.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: boldie on October 04, 2006, 03:03:08 PM
How much do you bet, what do you put him on, your out of position against a hyper agressive and unpredictable player, whats your reason(s) for raising here?

because I want him to be very sure I am ahead. I also don't like giving away free cards so I reraise him for about 45-55£ (slightly below the new pot)

I take him for either top pair (in which case he is beat)...or and even more likely as he didn't raise this hand (agressive players tend to freeze up when they actually find a hand better then AK) a high pocket pair maybe even just two over cards.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Timaloy on October 04, 2006, 03:07:45 PM
ok

Pot: £60

Board: 368A

You Check

He Bets £25 (Very Weak bet, Thinking we are still ahead here, this is where I make a small mistake I think, still trying to keep the pot small tho)

You to act, whats the play?





Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: boldie on October 04, 2006, 03:08:34 PM
You call £15

Turn Ah

You to act.

interesting now. As I said (admittedly after reading this...but that has no bearing on what I thought his hand was) I took him for a hand (as he didn't raise.)

So either he now has trip aces (high pocketpair hence no raise) or made his two pair (he had top pair with ace kicker even)n or just hit his ace with a big kicker (AK)..he could of course also have Q's or K's (still high pocketpair hence no raise..happy with the flop hence the reraise) in which case he wouldn't be happy with the Ace.

In only two of these circumstances are you ahead.

I would be tempted to think he either has A8 or AK...

(As i said I would have reraised him on the flop and then you'd have slightly more info but fair enough)

In this situation, I raise. No bollox. first to act wins. you need to make sure he has you beat before you fold to a maniac (even maniacs find hands sometimes) Raise the 45-55£ I would have re-raised on the flop.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: boldie on October 04, 2006, 03:10:26 PM
ok

Pot: £60

Board: 368A

You Check

He Bets £25 (Very Weak bet, Thinking we are still ahead here, this is where I make a small mistake I think, still trying to keep the pot small tho)

You to act, whats the play?





I just posted what I would do but after you do this I recko.

the mistake against a maniac is thinking he bets like a normal person would. his 25£ bet is supposed to signal weakness. He didn't raise pre-flop, now bets "weak". This would scream trip Aces to me.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Timaloy on October 04, 2006, 03:17:55 PM
Sorry, can only put it down as I done it but looking for ways others would have played it too. Can look back on it in hignsight and see how it compairs.

You call the £25

Pot: £110

River Card is 8d

Board: 368A8 No Flush

You Check the River

He moves All-In for £300

£300 to call into a pot of £410...





Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: thetank on October 04, 2006, 03:19:13 PM
Well that's a pass.  :D

You've kept the pot small for this reason. Not commited to calling off your stack when a bad card comes.
I don't fancy him having a busted draw often enough here to warrant a call.

We're beaten by any pockets 77+, any ace and any 8.

Big turn raise of around about a tonne might have been a good play.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Timaloy on October 04, 2006, 03:22:03 PM
Couple of other things, when he moves allin he pushing his mountain of chips over the line, dealer trys to push the back and tell him to leave them infront of him, he insists they stay over the line.

Now that confused things a bit, Is he trying to intimdate or is he expecting to lose them by sticking them out there instead of leaving them safly infront of himself.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: thetank on October 04, 2006, 03:25:06 PM
That suggests confidence to me.

I'd be surprised if he didn't have trip 8's. I'm glad he bet £300 and not £100, I don't have to sweat the pass.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Timaloy on October 04, 2006, 03:38:22 PM
Well that's a pass.  :D

You've kept the pot small for this reason. Not commited to calling off your stack when a bad card comes.
I don't fancy him having a busted draw often enough here to warrant a call.

We're beaten by any pockets 77+, any ace and any 8.

Big turn raise of around about a tonne might have been a good play.

That sums it up.

He moves allin , The chips in the pot thing makes me dwell up for a little but calling £300 to win £100 with a pair of 6s wasnt to appealing, the pots small we only have £50 in with a weak hand and the danger card has came (spades and a paired board and an ace).  Need to get this right %100 of the time for it to be a profitable call.

After finding out what he had the £100 raise on the turn would have finnished it, but the ace slowed me down not because I thought it made him 2 pr but because if it made him 1 pair I want to see the river to make sure the board dosnt pair and the spade dosent come because if he had a ace with flush draw hes not going anywhere and we have created a big pot out of position with a weak hand against a loonie player.

I fold and he flips over Jc7c.

Well played by him if he meant it but that sort of crazy play he was setting himself up for a big blow later.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: SupaMonkey on October 04, 2006, 03:55:36 PM
I know you were trying to keep the pot small but i think you could have found out a lot by reraising the flop. You have a very draw intensive board so he could have a variety of holdings. I would have raised to charge him and find out what he had.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: boldie on October 04, 2006, 04:51:44 PM
I know you were trying to keep the pot small but i think you could have found out a lot by reraising the flop. You have a very draw intensive board so he could have a variety of holdings. I would have raised to charge him and find out what he had.

exactly..that's why I don't like the  the call on the flop. (as stated earlier)



Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: boldie on October 04, 2006, 04:53:02 PM
btw..was this at cincin? and (assuming it is) I might have to show up there for a cash game with this guy.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: Boba Fett on October 05, 2006, 06:27:09 PM
btw..was this at cincin? and (assuming it is) I might have to show up there for a cash game with this guy.
Let me know when you're gonna be there Boldie, I could always do with the extra cash  ;)

BTW - Its a fairly decent game to sit in with around £50, its so easy to double up.


Title: Re: Can anyone Justify this call in a Cash Game
Post by: boldie on October 05, 2006, 06:39:06 PM
btw..was this at cincin? and (assuming it is) I might have to show up there for a cash game with this guy.
Let me know when you're gonna be there Boldie, I could always do with the extra cash  ;)

BTW - Its a fairly decent game to sit in with around £50, its so easy to double up.

lol actually you're not wrong...ever since my tourney and Hu play improved (and it has done very nicely) my cash game has gone to hell. I used ot be a much better`cash game player but now i can't win anything in them anymore.