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Poker Forums => Poker Hand Analysis => Topic started by: Indestructable on May 22, 2007, 07:52:29 PM



Title: Suited cards
Post by: Indestructable on May 22, 2007, 07:52:29 PM
I think (or rather I know) that there is a big hole in my game in that I value suited cards too highly.
I am sure that I value the strength of a hand too highly when suited. As an example if I had
  Ac Th

i could fold to a raise easily

But if it was
  Ac Tc

I am much more tempted to call raises or even reraise. Trouble is i have no logic as to what extent the fact that cards are suited should make a difference to my judgement.
Last night I called an all in move with half of my chips with
 Js Qs
Whereas if it had been
 Qd Js
I would have folded straight away. (I did lose my chips as the other guy had big slick)

Can anyone give me any general advice on this?


Title: Re: Suited cards
Post by: Indestructable on May 22, 2007, 08:57:01 PM
Just to back it up just pushed all in preflop and knocked out with
 Ks Aspades


Title: Re: Suited cards
Post by: Longy on May 22, 2007, 09:14:36 PM
I think (or rather I know) that there is a big hole in my game in that I value suited cards too highly.
I am sure that I value the strength of a hand too highly when suited. As an example if I had
  Ac Th

i could fold to a raise easily

But if it was
  Ac Tc

I am much more tempted to call raises or even reraise. Trouble is i have no logic as to what extent the fact that cards are suited should make a difference to my judgement.
Last night I called an all in move with half of my chips with
 Js Qs
Whereas if it had been
 Qd Js
I would have folded straight away. (I did lose my chips as the other guy had big slick)

Can anyone give me any general advice on this?


Lol, im not sure what to say. Stop overvaluing suited cards.


Title: Re: Suited cards
Post by: johnbhoy76 on May 22, 2007, 09:15:18 PM
I think (or rather I know) that there is a big hole in my game in that I value suited cards too highly.
I am sure that I value the strength of a hand too highly when suited. As an example if I had
  Ac Th

i could fold to a raise easily

But if it was
  Ac Tc

I am much more tempted to call raises or even reraise. Trouble is i have no logic as to what extent the fact that cards are suited should make a difference to my judgement.
Last night I called an all in move with half of my chips with
 Js Qs
Whereas if it had been
 Qd Js
I would have folded straight away. (I did lose my chips as the other guy had big slick)

Can anyone give me any general advice on this?


To be honest I think you've already answered your own post by recognising it is a mistake. The hard part is actually doing what you know is right in the moment.

I think in general terms people overvalue suited hands.

If I play connected cards I tend to play unsuited cards

7c 8c can get you into a world of trouble when the other guy hits a bigger flush. Also you often don't get paid off when you hit a flush as the board is screaming out FLUSH!!!!!! at your opponents.

However a hand like 7c 8d is much safer as you either hit it or you don't. there's usually no middle ground. If the board comes 5 6 9 A J  Rainbow then you've a much better chance of getting paid off here.



Title: Re: Suited cards
Post by: temp0r on May 22, 2007, 11:07:01 PM
it's not catchy but this always stuck with me.
some old bloke. dunno who he was. prob played a fair few fests or whatever. once said to a scandanavian kid who been calling any type of raise or reraise with suited connectors during gutshot's £100 freeze "you don't win tournaments with little flushes and straights kid. you win them with pairs and high cards." he'd called the scandi down to the river with A high. :)


Title: Re: Suited cards
Post by: MANTIS01 on May 23, 2007, 12:02:44 AM
It is more important to be aware of situations and how your cards might fit into those situations rather than focusing too heavily on the cards themselves.

Suited cards have about a 2-3% showdown advantage over their unsuited counterparts. So they do have a bit more potential. Yes, you could hit a flush or a straight...but this is a long shot. In this respect you want to be involved in a cheap multi-way pot if you are going to give yourself worthwhile odds to hit this long shot. When you have a big draw or flop a made hand your hope is to get paid by as many people as possible.

In your example you called off half your stack against one opponent whilst focusing on the 2% drawing potential. Your cards don't work well here. There is little or no chance you are ahead and could quite possibly be dominated. So by calling in this situation you risk half your stack to win half your stack with a weak starting hand. You are clearly not going to hit a straight or flush half of the time so this is a bad gamble for you.

And taking on bad gambles is not a formula for winning poker!