blonde poker forum

Ooer, time for my bi-annual post on PHA.  Playing in a £100 live freezeout last night. Blinds are 300/600/25 and I have 14k (average 17k). Just been moved to a new table where there are a lot of big stacks.  We're 9 handed. 2nd hand at the table I pick up  Ac Qs in mid/late position. UTG+1 has limped out of his 40k-ish stack, and I raise it up to 2.2k. Passed to the button (around 30k) who makes it 5k more on top, folded to me, and I pass too. Very next hand it's deja-vu. Limper from last hand, now UTG, limps again and it's folded to me. I have Ac Qs again, and raise to 2.2k. 3 better from last hand comments that he'd better be careful if he's considering re-popping again, and I tell him I'm not passing this time. He folds, as do the button and the blinds, and the UTG limper immediately announces 'all in'. Is this another easy fold (leaving me with 9.5k), or do we find a call here?

nah bang it in this time.  if btn jams after speech tho fold

luton £100, 20bb eff. not folding AQ. Get it in 1st time, i see ppl with ranges as wide as 55+/QJs here

Good question. With no background info on my opponent, I would fold this one. I know it seems weak, but, from what you said about this and the previous hand, i don't think he will be bluffing, and, even if he is, you are not a massive favourite.

folding here... Villain has ak... 15bb is enough to come back from,,, better spot imo...

First one I think folding is fine.

Second one I probably fold whilst going awkfjegnbesgebngieigoegnisgvs in my head.

9.5k is enough to go shoving with for a few hands to get some chips.

I know there's a limper but I still raise less in both hands.

2nd one I wouldn't beat yourself up about it if he has you beat. I mean the guy limps every hand, I don't think I fold AQ here.

Nice reply Skol. I did work out the pot odds. I also assigned the villian a range of hands, and had a rough, but reasonable idea about the chances against that range.
 I suspected that the villian would be unlikely to shove with a raggy ace, in the event that he was bluffing, so i came to the conclusion, rightly or wrongly, that the hero would either be a small favourite, or, much more likely, a big underdog.
 What program do you use to work out the percentages for the hand ranges? if you dont mind me asking.
 I'm pretty much at the bottom of the poker ladder at the moment, but i'm trying to learn from posts such as these.
  One of the reasons that i found this hand analysis question interesting was because it's a situation that i've been finding myself in quite often and been a bit unclear on. ie-when you have a decision on whether to call, but, if you get it wrong you're out of the tournament.
 How do you factor tournament survival into your calculations, or, do the pot odds still decide regardless of where you are in the comp?

PokerStove is the program you want. Just google it. It's free to download.

Thanks Cf. Hope the last post doesn't seem too silly. It was just something that was bugging me.

James you say all that but all i do here is think does than guy have small pairs, can he have AJ? If so snappington.

The standard of the average live donkament £100 is pretty appauling.

Surely Claw you must have some previous knowledge of this player.  I personally could tell you have 90% of the local players play at my local gala in Leicester and I hardly play there any more.  More often or not I wouldnt expect this player to show a small pocket pair.  Players I know that make regular final tables at the local would happily limp here with any suited Ace, any two pics and any pair. 

Does this person limp at this or other stages often?  How does the villian see you as a player?

I think saying you're not passing is a mistake. It's like when you hear a player ask how much an opener has behind before deciding what to do. They pretty much tell the raiser they don't have premium. You wouldn't intimate to your oppo you might be playing for stacks if you had A-A, you'd just shut up and make your play. And you wouldn't tell someone you aint passing if you had A-A, you'd just remain silent, look worried, and hope they push. Volunteering that bonus info exposes the type of hand you've got. That and the deja-vu factor widens villain's pushing range imo. I call.

Pretty sure i always ask the question if stacks are getting to 30bb or less.

Do you consider your level of thinking and approach to poker is on the same level as random live players?

I think assuming when people ask for stack sizes is a sign of weakness is a terrible idea.

Well I think if you sit down at a new table and put a decent % of your stack in raising the pot with zero info on anybody then whatever your thought process is about your oppos it's not going to be ideal. Using the experience you have from playing these events to make generalisations is not a terrible idea. It's not ideal, but it's not terrible. Blatch makes generalisations about the standards in these events from his own experience. You say you call this hand if you think your oppo has small pairs or A-J. How would you come to that conclusion first hand at a new table if you don't generalise from previous experience? Isn't assuming villain has such a range a terrible idea as well?

Everyone else in the poker world does :)

I have to admit i did find the verbals a bit worrying. But, without knowledge of the villian, i would still go with folding. Also, I would rather be shoving than calling, with my tournament on the line.
ps-Thanks for the additional reply Skol-and to the other folks that replied. And thanks again for posting it up Claw.
 Happy New Year and Good Luck to you all-Rage. :)

thanks for the replies folks.

Blatch - didn't recognise either of the players (or indeed most of the other players at the table - a lot of non regs in as it was Boxing Day), so I have zero info on them. Can only presume that as a woman unknown to them their default will be to assume I'm tight/weak, which has probs been compounded by my fold to the 3 bet in the previous hand.  

Actually Mantis, I think I DO say exactly the same thing whatever I'm holding in this situation, whether it's Aces or rags.

Yeah fair enough babe. But the point is none of the other players know that about you...so they might well make terrible generalisations like myself. Openly declaring you are playing this hand for your stack could lead people to wonder how genuine you are about that. So it doesn't matter so much if you do say it whether you have Aces or rags. What matters is whether your intention is to call a shove after you've said it. If your intention is to snap with this A-Q (as it would be with A-A) then sweet, your speech play is gonna illicit the respone you want. I do appreciate we're working on generalisations here but it's a marginal spot and we don't have anything solid to rely on.

It was my intention, and it's what happened. The reason for posting the hand on here though is I'm pretty sure it was down to stubbornness over having to lay down the last hand rather than being sure that my AQ is ahead of or (at best) racing with anyone else's 3-bet shove range. I convinced myself afterwards that a fold would have been preferable, leaving me with enough chips to make a few moves in the right spots and get back into the game, and I'm pretty much still of the same mind, but maybe that's results orientated. Doesn't seem to be a clear consensus here either, so I'm still not sure.

I'd have folded. Better to fold and make a move within the next 2 or 3 rounds of the table with them having to work out what you have rather than call with zero info on a new table with an easily passable hand.

hello. didn't you used to play poker? :)

I still dabble ;)

 :)up