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Interesting situation cropped up on the next pitch to the game Jake was playing on this morning.

It was a cup game and the two teams finished level. So they needed a penalty shoot out to see who went through.

After nine penalties, reds were leading 3-2 and blues needed to score their fifth to take it to sudden death.

The kid smacked his penalty aginst the post and it ran into the arms of the keeper.

The keeper immediately started to celebrate and threw the ball down, but the the angle it hit the ground meant it bounced down and up and into the net.

Do you think this is a goal or not?

No goal

If it has run into his arms, surely hasn't ricocheted into the goal?

Game over, and no goal, for me.

I know Longines is a ref, but I wouldn't want to be in amongst those parents when it kicked off :D

Penalty is finished as soon as ball has no forward momentum.  Rule was clarified I think after Brazil France shootout at Mexico 86?

I think the ref has discretion on when the process is completed. So in my mind it is a save as after celebrating the process is done in my mind.

No goal

Having been a ref for a few years when I was at college I would not have wanted to be a ref in that scenario

The keeper dived to his left and it hit the post and end up in his arms. It wasn't a well hit pen.

Ref said no goal and it meant the home team were out. That's when it all kicked off!

Quite clearly no goal

Sounds like the type you occasionally come up against who are so used to getting their own way and then it's mainly the parents kicking off. Remember a couple of those!

This is what the ref said.

It must be said the whole series of actions was so quick - the ball was in the net mere moments after it was in the keepers hands, I can see why there were complaints. Could be argued the keeper didn't have complete control of the ball.

Definitely felt sorry for the ref.

thats what the book says. I couldn't ref kids games, the parent pressure is immense. Correct decision in my opinion. However I am a keeper so might be biased

A million times easier to ref adult games than kids of any age (bar the youngest)

Easier to deal with a bit of dissent on the pitch than a lot 50 yards away and "pitch wanderers"

If its based on forward momentum, that would mean the goal where it comes out after hitting the bar then spins back into the net (facebook thing where keeper is off celebrating) or a pen where it comes off the post and hits the keeper who is off is line, then goes in, is not a goal.

I dont disagree this isnt a goal, and its pathetic any parent would teach their child to win in such a way.

Until I was 16 or 17 I was a ref for kids football.

I gave up when I asked a parent/asst manager type to not swear on the sidelines in an u14 game, he called me a ***** so I sent him off - he refused to leave the pitch area so I abandoned the game with his team winning 4-1 about half way through the second half.

He then tried to attack me and had to be restrained by parents of both teams.

As the match was quite local to me and I would never be able to ref that team impartially again I gave uo.

This is clearly not a goal either.

Very similar ending to me

Of the 4 people who took it up the same time happened to 3 of us and all with kids games parents.

Remember when I played youth football, and it was embarrassing how some of the parents behaved.

My old man never came much, so thankfully it wasn't my parents acting up :D

In Jake's game they was a long hoof forward and a striker on Jake's team raced onto the ball.

The ball wasn't going to reach the area, but their keeper ran out of his goal to try to clear it.

There was an almighty collision, although the ref didn't give a foul (and I'm pretty sure there wasn't a foul) the opposition keeper was obviously hurt and was in floods of tears.

For the last 10 minutes of the game one of the parents of the opposition team players (pretty sure it wasn't the keepers father) spent his time shouting abuse at the striker.

Every time he got the ball "hurt him, he's a dirty little bastard" and "show him what it's like to get hurt" and stuff like that.

Quite incredible when you consider these kids are under 10s.

absolutely ridiculous, parents stood apart from each other its just utter madness isent it?

I was going to start reffing at 15ish but was put off by the parents and knew I would not be able to get control if needed.

I remember when i was about 11 (14 years ago ish) my dad and my best mates dad being stood on the side of the pitch where me and my mate played. One of their coaches came over and said this is our side of the pitch you have to stand on the other, now this was the first time I had ever heard of this. Luckily my best mates dad was a bobby and a unit of a man. He very politely said to their coach, if you want to move me you can but im not going to move myself, I have come to watch my 11 year old son play football and not to be pushed around by you. The coach tried again to ask him to move but he turned his back and ignored him, in the second half when he moved to the other side of the pitch (when we swapped sides) the guy said "look that was not so hard was it" I really could believe that my best mates dad didn't launch the guy into row z

After this incident it was not long before I moved to rugby.

I was amazed when i started watching my little brother 6 years later that it had become common place for there to be an away side and a home side of the pitch with rope put around the pitch.

I continued to stand on the side of the pitch my little brother was playing on, I thought it was the most ridiculous thing ever.

"Hell is other people."

JP Sartre may have been a miserable git but he wasn't wrong.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uc3aokM2Pzk

Not directly applicable but funny none the less.

Not sure what this keeper was thinking;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pa9wyLYWcIE

I have some experience of this

coached teams up to U18

Reffed teams as both a neutral and the team i was coaching when minus a ref

saw my son in league club youth set ups

first things first, parents watch youth games for league clubs with no bad behaviour at all..because they don't want their lad to be shown up and his big chance lost because of their behaviour. obviously the same doesn't apply in local leagues

i've thrown a lad out of one of my teams because the parent was incapable of watching without swearing and worse towards his own team and opponents. the mum then asked me to take him back if her ex-husband didn't attend. seemed a reasonable compromise to me. the lad was immediately a better player too

I've also had to report parents to the league and had to take over from a 14 year old ref in tears, who then gave up refereeing

in my experience the home and away sidelines, barriers a metre back from the pitch etc do nothing

the essential story is parents trying to relive their own, perhaps unsatisfactory, childhoods through their own children and taking it way too seriously

Same age group that was my final game...

Very hard job at that age as a lot of players are just clumsy and  not intentionally trying to hurt anyone ....

However one "child" who I had reffed a few times before who certainly knew what he was doing in terms of knee high assaults.

A lot of parents hated the idea of showing a card at that level until their own little Jimmy was hurt/carried from the pitch then they demanded reds for anything.

Anyway this kid I had given the benefit of the doubt in a few previous games very cocky and on this occasion told me he was going to hurt someone (he was 9)...

He then went over the top after 10 minutes I thought about a yellow but showed a red when he told me to fuck off. All of a sudden his dad came from nowhere and threatened to kill me so the game was called off.

Once the game is called off suddenly the parents who don't say a think whilst he is thratening to kill you are astonished you have called a game of football of and say you are overeacting. ....

Good fun all in all

It's a real problem and no wonder so many refs give up after one season. At the time unfortunately 16/17 yo weren't allowed to referee men's football. I'd have preferred that no end.

There is no such thing as a bad kid - just bad parents.

YBA

My lad plays for Hanwell and I can honestly say the parents of both teams generally get on well.  The odd parent who gets aggro is spoken to in simple tones and given friendly guidance on how to stop being an imbecile.  Maybe I'm just lucky with our league.

There is no such thing as bad parents - just bad grandparents.

Everyone is lovely.

The second installment of this long running series!

So a situation came into my head after watching the Newcastle v Burton fiasco on Wednesday.

A penalty is awarded.

As the attacker is running up to take it, a defender starts sprinting towards the penalty box in order to get a jump start on any rebounds if the kick is saved or hits the post.

One of the takers team mates spots him coming and trips him up outside the box but before the kick is taken (yet after the whistle to restart play has sounded).

If the penalty is scored, what decision should the ref take?

See you in 2019 for part 3...

The penalty is retaken (and book the tripper if warranted).

Law 14
Once the referee has signalled for a penalty kick to be taken, the kick must be taken. If, before the ball is in play, one of the following occurs:
the player taking the penalty kick or a team-mate infringes the Laws of the Game:
• if the ball enters the goal, the kick is retaken
• if the ball does not enter the goal, the referee stops play and restarts with an indirect free kick

Part 3.

One from the Barcelona v Eibar game I'm watching which I've never seen before.

Barca are attacking (surprise, surprise).

Ball is played across the box to the far post to an onrushing forward who is running at full pelt. He gets a shot on goal but the keeper gets there just in time and blocks the shot.

Meanwhile the momentum of the shooter carries him beyond the dead ball line.

The ball ends up flying to a Barca player who attempts an ambitious volley but it heads more skywards than towards the goal.

The orginal striker is off the field of play when the volley is taken. But as the ball goes into orbit he sprints back on and controls it when it returns to earth.

Is he offside or not?

It's not 2019 yet...

Striker obviously is offside but I am guessing that the reason the question has been posted is that either the answer is no he is not offside or in the game you saw the ref didn't blow for offside?

I don't think offside, but I believe there is a rule that you cannot leave and reenter the pitch without the refs permission. There was an incident a few years back where a player hid behind the goalpost as the keeper dropped the ball and then ran infront of the keeper as he took a run up. The goal didn't stand as they player did not have permission to return to the pitch. The details might be wrong, but that's how I remember it

Yeah, a player is not deemed offside if hes off the pitch during the passage of play, which I guess with the current offside rulings means after the shot has been taken. And yeah as Teddy says players need permission to leave and re-enter the pitch and it is within the refs rights to book said player for each offence so techincally could have resulted in an Eibar freekick because the Barca striker has touched the ball illegally as was after his second bookable offence, with Barca down to 10. Ive never seen the leaving/re-entering the pitch bookings enforced in a "proper" game (is more intended to punish deliberate rule infractions such as illegal substitutions, and I assume deliberately hiding behind the goalpost as in Teddys example! Maybe him leaving the pitch wasn't deemed "deliberate" in that instance so he only received a single yellow for re-entering, who knows!) though the guy who ran my refs course years ago told me he had used it to send off a not very nice player in a sunday league game once!

He should be called offside.

You cannot leave the pitch intentionally and come back on without the refs agreement. However if you leave unintentionally as the striker did then you are deemed to still be in play as if you are on the dead ball line and can come back on without penalty.

See Van Nistelrooys goal in the World Cup 08 for an example where a defender off the pitch is playing him onside.

So if the forward we was off the pitch and the ball had fallen to an Eibar defender who rolled it back to the keeper, he could run on and intercept it?

Assuming he didn’t hang around off the pitch to game the situation, yes.

I've seen this happen. Was ridiculous. It was a Dover game with Wendy Toms as ref. One player from each side had a collision which required both physios to come on, so both players had to leave the pitch. Toms left them on the sideline for ages so the linesman told them both to go on. Toms then blew up, booked them both, and sent the Dover player off as it was his second yellow.

You know a ref has lost it when both sides are booing the sending off and clapping off the red carded player!