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16  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: Non premium staking? on: May 07, 2013, 10:34:47 AM
Markup is something that I think is somewhat misunderstood at times by some people, in that the value of a staking proposition is not absolute based on markup is some people seem to suggest/imply, different tournaments have very different attainable ROIs due to factors such as field strength, structure, etc. This is not a blonde specific issue although you definitely see it manifest here (anyone who ever dealt with the huge Russian staking funds on 2p2 will remember that they had some strange ideas about appropriate markups)

The WSOP Main Event always provides the best example of this, the nature of that tournament (incredible structure, field filled with recreational players, huge potential returns) means that realistic ROIs for good players in that tournament are far higher than many people understand, this means when good players sell the ME at 1.5/1.6, they are often providing a far better deal to investors than will often be provided when the same player sells a tough online 1k at 1.1 and yet many people will dismiss the former out of hand because the markup is 'too high' based on this strangely prevalent ideal that all markups should be within a very narrow range.

Why does this matter? I think that basically people are misunderstanding the issue when they say something like 'markups are too high', the real problem is markups are often being charged with little thought as too the relative value of the tournaments being played and also, frankly with little regard to the skill differences between the players charging the markups and how this with impact prospective ROIs.

17  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: Vouching for someone on: May 07, 2013, 02:56:15 AM
It's definitely a terminology issue and its clearly coming up repeatedly across the poker community as these types of rolled stakes are something that happens with unfortunate regularity (probably not here as much as in other places simply because of the nature of the staking for).

Clearly some people will use the word vouch without believing it has the specific implication it does to others, when really what they are providing is an opinion or a reference (either on someone's ability or on their character) with no intention for any sort of financial implications for themselves. Although even this is problematic because this kind of post from a respected poster will likely influence people's opinions of whether to invest and can often be based on minimal financial dealings and limited personal interaction.

The key really is to be very clear about why you are posting in these type of threads if you are not investing personally, as transparency eliminates these after the fact conversations.
18  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: Firaldoooooooo!! (Not Geraldo) on: March 15, 2013, 02:36:31 AM
What a boss, gl mate
19  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: Stato_1 and Railtard Warm-up Sweat on: February 25, 2013, 10:18:03 AM
Grats man,

What a life
20  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: "In the Well" with Simon Deadman on: February 07, 2013, 05:36:52 PM
Hi Simon,

To put a face to screenname, we met in Dublin (the Scottish guy you bust from 1a), hopefully that clarifies:

I don't know if you are comfortable sharing your thoughts about specific hands in a public forum, but if you are you should discuss the 4 bet pot you played against Sean from Ireland on Day 1a of the WPT, because that is definitely one of the more interesting spots I have witnessed/discussed recently.

Going back to not grinding online tournaments, regardless of your previous lack of enjoyment, do you not feel that you might be sacrificing a serious source of potential earnings and crucially a way to significantly reduce variance, especially because of the resources you have in terms of friends of yours who are good online regulars?

More general question: As someone whose main game is live tournaments, what do you think some of the biggest mistakes people who play primarily online make when they play live?

Yes I remember, we shared a beer and pizzza after too. Well Bobbafett ate most of it tbf ;-)

1) This hand your talking about is probably the most complicated hand I played of the whole tourney. So many different thoughts/levels throughout the hand it would take me forever to discuss it on here. Maybe one for the PHA?

2) Maybe, yes. But I really don't enjoy sitting on the computer grinding, also I feel my edge live is being able to see me opponent and I rely so much on my live reads I don't even know if I'd do any good online. I was probably break even when online when I was playing before. I still play the odd sunday schedule if i'm home though.

3) Concentration. I see so many really good online players who just get bored playing live, they have their heads in their Ipads all day then it comes to a spot where they have no info on villain because they haven't been paying any attention. I don't even listen to Music at the table because I don't want to miss that 1 bit of information that may be crucial to me making a big call/fold.

(1) I think it would be a really interesting hand to post, put it this way, usually when I bust a tournament I am not that interested in talking about hands other people played (as people I know can attest), whereas with that one I could have talked about it for longer than we did

(2) It has always been fascinating to me the way that these different perspectives exist because of the different ways people have come into poker.

I find your reference to enjoyment regarding online poker really interesting, while obviously on some level everybody that plays the game for a living started out because they enjoyed the game and its intricacies, I am not sure the extent to which anybody 'enjoys' the day in and day out of grinding online tournaments.

Clearly I can only speak for myself, I enjoy the freedom poker has given me in life, I obviously still enjoy the feeling of getting deep in a tournament but the everyday experience of playing, people don't call it grinding for no reason.

Anyway obviously you have had alot of success doing what you are doing so why change it

(3) I am definitely guilty of this, and I think it just stems from being used to playing lots of tables and making lots of decisions in quick succession, and basically having to re-train your brain for live poker where so much of the time you are not personally involved in hands.

I realise that this is does not really contain questions but just wanted to respond
21  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: "In the Well" with Simon Deadman on: February 07, 2013, 03:25:24 PM
Hi Simon,

To put a face to screenname, we met in Dublin (the Scottish guy you bust from 1a), hopefully that clarifies:

I don't know if you are comfortable sharing your thoughts about specific hands in a public forum, but if you are you should discuss the 4 bet pot you played against Sean from Ireland on Day 1a of the WPT, because that is definitely one of the more interesting spots I have witnessed/discussed recently.

Going back to not grinding online tournaments, regardless of your previous lack of enjoyment, do you not feel that you might be sacrificing a serious source of potential earnings and crucially a way to significantly reduce variance, especially because of the resources you have in terms of friends of yours who are good online regulars?

More general question: As someone whose main game is live tournaments, what do you think some of the biggest mistakes people who play primarily online make when they play live?
22  Poker Forums / Live Tournament Updates / Re: DTD February £150,000 Deepstack: Day1b on: February 01, 2013, 11:55:50 AM
The online figures will always be disproportionate that I can guarantee......

Of course they will it's a totally different game with a much higher proportion than usual of good players.

The good players will generally get rid of most of the crap ones 'til they get short handed.

At that stage the proportion of good players is even higher and none of them are going to sit around waiting for their stack to drop to dust.


This was not my experience yesterday at all fwiw and I am sure other people who played would agree

Throw Trigg in to a field of 85 rather than a Saturday field of 300 and you instantly have a higher proportion.



While I agree that there were certain people (myself included) who played the online Day 1a who would have been unlikely to travel to Nottingham, I still think it needs to be stressed that the field yesterday was hardly packed with online sickos and the overall standard felt pretty equivalent to the couple of DTD Deepstacks I have played previously
23  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: DTD February £150,000 GTD £300 Deepstack + Online Day 1A Special! on: February 01, 2013, 11:49:50 AM
Agree h. Also is it possible to have a time bank?

+1

This was a pretty massive inconvenience and definitely seemed a bit ridiculous given the tournament buyin
24  Poker Forums / Live Tournament Updates / Re: DTD February £150,000 Deepstack: Day1b on: February 01, 2013, 11:24:37 AM
The online figures will always be disproportionate that I can guarantee......

Of course they will it's a totally different game with a much higher proportion than usual of good players.

The good players will generally get rid of most of the crap ones 'til they get short handed.

At that stage the proportion of good players is even higher and none of them are going to sit around waiting for their stack to drop to dust.


This was not my experience yesterday at all fwiw and I am sure other people who played would agree
25  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: DTD February £150,000 GTD £300 Deepstack + Online Day 1A Special! on: February 01, 2013, 12:56:03 AM
This was a pretty good idea, would definitely play again,

Was mentally preparing to drive Glasgow-Nottingham to grind a sub 20bb stack, but unfortunately could not hold in the last hour

Although the Boss Network software was certainly 'interesting'
26  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: UKIPT Season 4: Includes Six Max Main event at DTD in December on: January 31, 2013, 05:39:36 PM
Have they actually announced the schedule/dates?
27  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: Markup?? on: January 14, 2013, 09:50:40 PM
There was a decent amount of discussion on 2p2 about similar issues this summer caused by Galen Hall's very high markups for various WSOP/Venetian events http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/184/staking-selling-shares-live/galen-hall-2012-summer-selling-1204267/

A good read if people can be bothered reading through a 200+ post thread
28  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: Markup?? on: January 14, 2013, 09:24:58 PM
I'm not having a pop Andrew, but

"I sold at 1.25 for the WSOP ME last year because I HAD To sell to play and it's a 10k and it's a one off tournament, + I have no specific record to show live, I wanted TO PROVIDE VALUE to people backing me not just spread the variance and pay 7.2% of the buyin myself."

1.25 (ie a substantial premium) doesn't really provide value does it? Yes I know the main is "soft" but there's a heck of a lot of "soft" roadhumps to get to over several days to even min-cash right

In my (observers) terms, value for an event however "soft" is at spot for someone without a long and successful record in the type of event they are seeking staking for, which you state you yourself had no specific record for

Of course we know the motivations of people staking can be not merely for "value"..people stake people who are mates, or who they respect, or because they want a punt when they can't play themselves

For John B, I feel much of the above is also a consideration.



I think its important to realise that the WSOP Main Event is a very different proposition than pretty much any other tournament, this is due to both the field size (and hence the huge prizes available at the FT) and the fact that there are significantly higher % of weaker players (thanks to the large amounts of satellite winners/people taking shots) than you would get in any tournament of equivalent size. Therefore any competent online tournament player is going to be able to justify a markup much higher than 1.25, markups of 1.4-1.6 are far from ridiculous for this specific tournament, and not taking this into account is a pretty big mistake.

Like anything else in poker, you have to consider the notional long run when you determine the value of markup and given the specific factors of the WSOP ME much higher markups can be justified IMO.

  
29  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: Markup?? on: January 14, 2013, 05:48:36 PM
There is no 'magic bullet' for determining markup, any staking board be it blonde, 2+2, wherever, is controlled by the features of the market itself - by supply and demand.

On blonde for example, there is a relatively low volume of staking requests, this tends to mean that higher markups are possible due to this clear discrepancy between supply and demand, coupled with the stronger community feel here which means that often the people buying and selling action will know each other personally and therefore not view the transaction purely from the perspective of whether it truly represents 'value'.

A couple of years ago on 2p2 the big Russian staking funds were buying virtually all the big live tournament action with a seeming lack of discretion, this meant that markups were high across the board. After this influx of money declined, the markups have now settled back down to a lower level as buyers are generally more selective, is either more reflective of the 'true' position? I would argue that both simply reflected sellers understanding the conditions of the market at the time, and setting markups accordingly.

When we set markups, what are we trying to achieve? A fair deal for investors? A good deal for ourselves? Both? - I have always taken the view that the markups I set should represent value for both myself and investors, but other people quite clearly take the view that they should charge as high a markup as people will be willing to pay, I do not think you can say that either approach is 'right' or 'wrong'. In the end the market will decide whether your markup is 'fair' or not, in that you will either sell your action or you wont.

    
30  Poker Forums / The Rail / Re: SuperTrigg on: January 07, 2013, 10:59:57 PM
Almost Jymaster level Sunday, impressive stuff
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