I agree with the rest of the guys and say that I would also check pre. But then again I don't think your raise is altogether bad, trying something else once in a while is plain ok. If you have a pretty solid image you're representing a stronger hand than you actually have, and if you intend to bet a number of flops e.g. K-x-x then the line is ok imo. If you don't hit your set and you just c-fold then that would make your raise bad imo. But if you do plan to bet these flops when you don't hit it makes even more sense to be consistent and bet when you do. This way your oppos can never be sure whether you have the nuts or air.

Now that you haven't bet out and you're faced with heavy action, especially the committing min-raise from a tight player, I wouldn't push all-in on the draw. The 1st guy is certain to have an Ace at least, but could have a set of 4's, and if you're behind to the flush, which I think is probable, a number of your outs may already be dead.

That is how i like to play, shorten the number of people in the pot then bet out on boards that I would appear to have hit. I would be c-betting any board that only had one over.
I have a pretty tight image and rarely have to show hands.

stu, what was your thinking pf? the bet size seems a little odd to me with 6 limpers

My preflop raise was to get 1 or 2 callers so I could know where I stood a bit more on the flop.
I find myself doing this too much, partly because I hate people limping all the time.

As discussed last night, its not the right move, because im really only looking for a 7, and if i find one I want everyone in the pot.

I don't post often on PHA but I'm learning so I'll have a bash.

I think the opposite of Billy,

I think the button may well have better than MP guy.

I bet the flop here probs 1800-2000, by betting I feel I have more control of the pot. By not betting here I think MP guy is on a steal as he thinks buttton made up for value and MP has Ax at the most.

Button may recognise this and is playing to isolate/take the pot, although poss has a decent flush draw.


I shove here too

Geo

(now show me I'm a complete novice.)

Thanks for posting Geo.

The line i was taking was that if one of them bet, i could reraise, this would look strong and define my situation well.
When MP bet and the Button happily reraised it caught me a little of guard.

Firstly, I would say offering no information about either oppo's playing style or your own image means that we are just guessing based on the action alone. So the guesses are not going to be all that accurate. This is the 3rd level so there must be something that will help us get to the bottom of this. No less than 6 limpers suggests the table's a bit nitty and they don't juice the pot without a hand.

You take quite a strong line pre-flop and that is ok, but you then freeze and check the flop which I don't get. You are going to get business from Aces and single hearts in this situation so a c-bet is ideal imo. And having it checked around and seeing a 4th heart drop would be horrible for you. If you bet out and it went raise, re-raise, you would deffo be in trouble imo. So I think a c-bet would clarify the situation for you better, as well as serving to build a bigger pot. As it stands it's difficult not to think you're in trouble anyway. It's tough to put either oppo on 2-pair considering you hold two of the 7's and obv a set of Aces is impossible. The best you could hope for is the first guy holding an Ace and the 2nd guy holding a set of 4's. It's difficult to think early in a £300 event the limping nits have found their balls and are pumping it up light here, especially min-raise guy who must surely have the flush already.

Apologies for the lack of info Mantis, I was just trying to get the main bits down before I went to sleep.
Trying to block out what followed during the night I would say the following about the two players involved.

MP - Seemed to know what he was doing, took a lot of thought over most bets, had taken a battering but worked his stack back up to 10kish.
Button - Again seemed pretty solid, hadnt been involved in too many hands.

Sorry if thats a bit lacking but, im trying to blank out what i learnt through the rest of the evening.

Shove - one of them has KJo.

Yes yes, your mother had KJo 

Check pre. Shove now.

Surely if i check pre I would be in an even tougher spot now?

DTD £300 freezeout.

Rough recollection of the hand but you will get the idea.

75/150 most people have circa 10k

6 limpers on my BB
I look down at    and make it 700 more to play.

Midposition caller and the button.

Flop comes down 

Im a little confused in this situation and decide to check to see what happens. (Thoughts please)
Midposition bets out 1800
Button raises to 3650

What the hell do i do with my set?
Should one of them have the made flush?
Do my outs justify a shove anyway?

Further action to follow.......... 

go on monatooo. with this staking i fully expect you to go outright for the win on day two with some crazy gambling, but just try and make that 1st

glglglglgl!!!!!!

Cheers Alex

Ghey raises to induce shoves ftw,yo

Thats right innit 

I think you should crazy gamble from the start and try to win the lot on day 1. Who needs a day 2!

Ill be there.

If its like last night come see if you need a few free chips, I dont think I won a pot!

I was doubting myself for a moment and also allowing the thought that a flop with a 2 and a card that fell within UTGs raising range could see me facing a bigger set.

Dont think you should be worrying about set over set. Its just unlucky.
If it happens its very hard to get away from in a tournament like this.
[/quote]

What have i done?
[  ] My quoting skills are awesome

I was doubting myself for a moment and also allowing the thought that a flop with a 2 and a card that fell within UTGs raising range could see me facing a bigger set.

[/quote]

Dont think you should be worrying about set over set. Its just unlucky.
If it happens its very hard to get away from in a tournament like this.

Come on Vinny I owe u a pint 

I thought i was doing well 

I've only read as far as page 3 of this thread.

It looks like the answer to the OP is.....

erm.....

Boldie?

lol..I answered in PM to him..

He doesn't have any children either, so what does he know?

good point, we should have a seperate forum for people without kids.

www.boldiepoker.com/forum ??

[  ] Evilpie can organise a stake in a steak house.