Interesting River Spot

[GreekStein]

If he straddles, does he not raise all pairs on his option?

Nope. I'd expect him to check these most of the time.

Can he not have 34 or 48?

Never raises river with these hands. Ever

[pleno1]

after he c/c turns he never c/r river with a low straight.

[pleno1]

if you are villain and you have 56 how would you play the river, assuming youve played the same upto now.

[doubleup]

I hate betfolding here.

If we were to look at this hand generically the situation is one where villain can quite easily read our hand and villain knows that he can rep something that beats our hand. 

So we are betting the river in the hope that villain is unable to read our hand and will call, but if he can't read our hand why wouldn't he raise with 6x?

If he can read our hand we shouldn't bet the river for value as it won't get called by worse, unless we want to induce a bluff.

[ACE2M]

he's got an overpair most of the time imo so i bet for that, 1/2 - 2/3s pot closer to 2/3s for the 'please fold' factor.  I'm never bet folding here either.

did u read the opening post?

not really.

on reading it properly. i could easily bet fold i think.

[cambridgealex]

with the villain as described im bet folding this river 100% of the time. I think he sigh calls a bet of 60-75 and never c/r with a bluff or worse hand here. Against different villains of course, it's not quite so clear. But I agree that live fish almost never c/r bluff the river. I think villain has worse straights and 2pair a whole bunch here, and sometimes a house. Whether he'd c/r a house rather than just donk out I'm not sure. Either way, once he checks, I'm obv betting, and if he raises. I'm folding.

[cambridgealex]

if you are villain and you have 56 how would you play the river, assuming youve played the same upto now.

interesting question. stereotyping villain, I'd say he's unlikely c/r a bet of 80 or 90, but might raise a smaller bet. Whether he'd c/r at all here and not bet out, I'm not sure, more info on villain reqd. But I reckon generally he'd lead on this river with 56.

[pleno1]

with the villain as described im bet folding this river 100% of the time. I think he sigh calls a bet of 60-75 and never c/r with a bluff or worse hand here. Against different villains of course, it's not quite so clear. But I agree that live fish almost never c/r bluff the river. I think villain has worse straights and 2pair a whole bunch here, and sometimes a house. Whether he'd c/r a house rather than just donk out I'm not sure. Either way, once he checks, I'm obv betting, and if he raises. I'm folding.

I 100% agree and like I said previously, I think the c/r river bluff is the least frequent move in love cash poker by bad fish, especially at 200nl.

[cambridgealex]

Thoughts please on-
Villains calling range
Villains c/jamming value range
Bet sizing with our hand
Bet sizing with 77
The call on the flop
C/raising the river if you are the villain (without a house but as a bluff)

calling range on the river i think is only 78 and 34, 84 the more i think about it.
I think he bets the flop with all these hands (plus all sets and 2pairs , 88, A7 and maybe 79 as well).

Which of these hands does he check the turn with? Most of them imo, except 79 and maybe sets. But I think he has two pair on the turn or 34 and 84 most of the time here. When he calls the £45 quickly I think his range is more weighted towards sets and two pairs (hate the 8 but figure they still have outs). But of course 34 and 84 he's prolly not folding here but I think he takes more time over calling (?).

On the river did villain check very quickly? If he checks quickly I think we can go ahead and be confident he has two pair or worse straights and we are good and think about how much he will call. Again if we get c/rd i think he's filled up and I'd fold.

Thoughts please on-
C/raising the river if you are the villain (without a house but as a bluff)

If I'm the villain I'm not c/raising this river as a bluff very often. Our range is pretty much only straights and houses, it is unclear which as he might think you'd play sets like this (vbetting turn to get called by smallers sets and worse 2pairs for eg / semi bluffing for the rivers we fill up on). If i'm sure you have a straight then I might go ahead a make a large c/r. But if i'm unsure whether you'll fold a straight and sure you won't fold a boat, then I'm not bluffing here often.

[DMorgan]

If passive live nit c/raises this river you're dead pretty much always imo. Villains line looks exactly like 2pr that got there. The type of villain that you describe just doesn't make it 250 on the river with air very often at all in my experience of live cash

[pleno1]

btw just so people dont think that he has c/r, I was merely asking what our line was. It is still on hero to act. My thoughts was b/f £75

[DMorgan]

Yeah I think I prefer a smallish river value bet too. We're only really getting value from the bottom end of the straight, can't see him showing up with a naked 6 or calling river with 78

I'd definitely have raised the flop though