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Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Topic: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter.... (Read 348763 times)
DungBeetle
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2115 on:
December 30, 2014, 02:05:55 PM »
"All ahead of Newcastle in my book in terms of the way the clubs are run, players and management."
What does the way clubs are run have anything to do with whether they are a big club? Or currrent players and management? "Big" club status is about long term potential. Leeds would be a more extreme version of Newcastle.
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Kmac84
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2116 on:
December 30, 2014, 02:09:23 PM »
Seems not only Newcastle fans are deluded.
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DungBeetle
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2117 on:
December 30, 2014, 02:14:54 PM »
I just don't think you get the concept. If Watford finished top 10 five years in a row I wouldn't call them a big club, as we probably would struggle to get above 30,000 fans for home games even with that success.
The concept of being a big club isn't about where you are now. It's where you "should" be given your fanbase revenue streams (or even potential fanbase revenue streams in the case of some fallen teams).
That's why despite the last 10 years Chelsea are still a smaller club than Newcastle by my reckoning.
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Kmac84
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2118 on:
December 30, 2014, 02:23:31 PM »
The concept of being a big club imo is money in the bank, potential for growth, past history.
Newcastle don't have much of either imo.
They are never a top 4 side, as I said earlier they couldn't get to the summit when Joh Hall was free rolling them. Even Blackburn managed it.
Newcastle will no doubt maintain their home gates. But realistically they aren't going to break into the top 6 anytime soon.
Even based on history I would say Leeds were a bigger club.
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pleno1
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2119 on:
December 30, 2014, 02:37:24 PM »
Huh? We were 5th a few seasons ago pal.
Suggesting we are a similar sized club to stoke is just laughable a, perhaps you're not real though.. Arbboy3?
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Quote from: TightEnd on December 16, 2013, 12:59:59 AM
Worst playcalling I have ever seen. Bunch of fucking jokers . Run the bloody ball. 18 rushes all game? You have to be kidding me. Fuck off lol
DungBeetle
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2120 on:
December 30, 2014, 03:05:30 PM »
And finished 2nd in the late 90s?
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pleno1
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2121 on:
December 30, 2014, 03:08:11 PM »
2nd, 2nd, 3rd,3rd, 4th, 5th, 5th, 7th, 7th since we came into the premiership. Negatives is of course a relegation.
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Quote from: TightEnd on December 16, 2013, 12:59:59 AM
Worst playcalling I have ever seen. Bunch of fucking jokers . Run the bloody ball. 18 rushes all game? You have to be kidding me. Fuck off lol
Doobs
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2122 on:
December 30, 2014, 03:08:22 PM »
I think claiming Newcastle are bigger than Chelsea is just plain wrong.
The big 5 (Arsenal, Man U, Man City, Chelsea and Liverpool) are well clear of the rest. You can see that in matchday income, turnover or
http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2014/may/01/premier-league-club-accounts-debt-wages
I don't think it matters what size the stadium is if Chelsea can get £71m in gate income and Newcastle only £28m.
Spurs are the 6th biggest club and there isn't much doubt about that.
You could argue Newcastle are 7th, and they are on turnover, but I wouldn't put Everton and Villa far away on history, crowds etc. If they are finishing around 7th to 10th, they are finishing at around their level. Not underachieving and not overachieving.
If you just look at pure turnover, Newcastle are as close to the 20th biggest club inb the premiership than they are to Spurs. So it is more laughable to suggest Newcastle are as big as Tottenham or bigger than Chelsea than it is to suggest they are similar sized to Stoke. I don't even think there is much potential to get as big as Spurs, for instance they could double their gate turnover or commercial income and still not be that close.
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DMorgan
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2123 on:
December 30, 2014, 03:21:17 PM »
Adjust those turnovers for average wages within an x mile radius of stadium and I'd imagine it's a lot closer than those numbers suggest between Chelsea and Newcastle
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Quote from: Karabiner on May 24, 2014, 12:47:13 PM
Is Dan awake yet?
Kmac84
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2124 on:
December 30, 2014, 03:33:24 PM »
Quote from: Doobs on December 30, 2014, 03:08:22 PM
I think claiming Newcastle are bigger than Chelsea is just plain wrong.
The big 5 (Arsenal, Man U, Man City, Chelsea and Liverpool) are well clear of the rest. You can see that in matchday income, turnover or
http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2014/may/01/premier-league-club-accounts-debt-wages
I don't think it matters what size the stadium is if Chelsea can get £71m in gate income and Newcastle only £28m.
Spurs are the 6th biggest club and there isn't much doubt about that.
You could argue Newcastle are 7th, and they are on turnover, but I wouldn't put Everton and Villa far away on history, crowds etc. If they are finishing around 7th to 10th, they are finishing at around their level. Not underachieving and not overachieving.
If you just look at pure turnover, Newcastle are as close to the 20th biggest club inb the premiership than they are to Spurs. So it is more laughable to suggest Newcastle are as big as Tottenham or bigger than Chelsea than it is to suggest they are similar sized to Stoke. I don't even think there is much potential to get as big as Spurs, for instance they could double their gate turnover or commercial income and still not be that close.
That says it much better than I ever could.
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DungBeetle
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2125 on:
December 30, 2014, 03:37:59 PM »
I'm not sure why people get fixated by a particular point in history when looking at who is bigger than who. The concept of "big club" must be looked at over a longer period, and also consider potential.
If Newcastle as an area became more affluent in the future, and if they had the same success on the pitch, they would make more money in matchday income than Chelsea. At the send of the day they have a bigger fanbase.
Chelsea make more money at the moment. But I'm not sure that is any more relevant than us looking at 1981 matchday income before Ken Bates bought them for £1.
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DungBeetle
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2126 on:
December 30, 2014, 03:43:50 PM »
Incidentally, looking at those figures does that include all matches (i.e. Champs League for Chelsea but nothing for Newcastle?)
If not it means Chelsea on average charge three times more per ticket than Newcastle once you adjust for average attendance. Which may be correct I suppose.
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Ironside
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2127 on:
December 30, 2014, 03:50:22 PM »
Loving the fact saints have been put on a par with newcastle and stoke!! Saints are a smaller club than newcastle but bigger than stoke but currently a better side than both
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lend me a beer and I'll lend you my ear
Doobs
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2128 on:
December 30, 2014, 03:50:46 PM »
Quote from: DungBeetle on December 30, 2014, 03:37:59 PM
I'm not sure why people get fixated by a particular point in history when looking at who is bigger than who. The concept of "big club" must be looked at over a longer period, and also consider potential.
If Newcastle as an area became more affluent in the future, and if they had the same success on the pitch, they would make more money in matchday income than Chelsea. At the send of the day they have a bigger fanbase.
Chelsea make more money at the moment. But I'm not sure that is any more relevant than us looking at 1981 matchday income before Ken Bates bought them for £1.
Because you weren't talking about who
was
the biggest you were talking about who
is
the biggest.
If Newcastle became the biggest club at some point in the future, then I would happily say they are now the biggest, and it wouldn't make any difference that Chelsea were once 3 times as big. Things change, history doesn't mean an awful lot. Given how succesful Man U have been over the years, then there is no reason this can't ever happen.
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RickBFA
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Re: Tales from the Toon. The ups and downs of an NUFC supporter....
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Reply #2129 on:
December 30, 2014, 03:51:49 PM »
None of this changes the view of most neutrals, that Pardew did a decent job with the resources at his disposal.
Football fans are football fans though and often cant see the woods for the trees.
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