Re: Gary Speed

[MANTIS01]

Since his untimely death it has been categorically stated by his family that GS was not suffering depression of any kind and he didn't have an argument with his wife that evening. So the reason he suddenly felt suicidal a few hours after hosting a family party remain a mystery. The press ringing to say he's front page news monday morning is the most plausible explanation. Anyway I was thinking about this today and wondered how many times has GS actually been on Football Focus? I mean I watch FF a lot and don't remember seeing him on it before. Why has his agent arranged for him to appear on prime time telly on this particular Saturday?

[TightEnd]

Seperated from the condolences thread as discussed on there

There are no flames in the OP of this thread, please do not flame in response, ty

[ACE2M]

Whats the point of trying to figure it out? You 'll never know the answer unless something comes out.

[MANTIS01]

I always wonder about the moderation on this forum and why it's so inconsistent. It is constantly deemed fine to flame me until I respond and then suddenly flaming isn't ok anymore. On the subject of GS I am concerned that a volatile life shattering story would be like a loaded gun and those waving it around irresponsibly in his direction should have some degree of accountability for the state of mind they put him in. I don't like that he suddenly appears on Football Focus that weekend and I feel a bit like he was set up for a fall. I can't imagine why I would be chastised for saying I think something is wrong here. Because that is exactly what the Leveson Enquiry is doing right now. Yet expressing my worry about the circumstances of his shocking demise is so intolerable that the thread should be moderated. Afterall it's a RIP thread and asking why shows terrible disrespect right?

The last RIP thread I posted in was that of Amy Winehouse. The coroner reported that her body was free from drugs and so it seems that she did indeed overcome these demons and yet sadly killed herself by drinking too much that evening. In that thread I passionately supported and respected her memory. However, a number of people on this forum posted that she deserved to die, that they didn't give a fig about her, that they had no sympathy for her, and people even made jokes about her. Funny because I don't remember any modding in that thread or calls to respect her memory in what was a RIP thread. I found many comments in that thread to be disrespectful to her memory and just plain malicious. But that was ok. But asking why in the Gary Speed thread is completely unacceptable. Sorry but the picking and choosing of moral standards when it suits is a joke to me.

[TightEnd]

flames towards you after your post were removed by the first mod to be able to do so.....

[RED-DOG]

It's a difficult job Mr Mantis, and I'll be the first to admit that we don't always get it right.

On this occasion removing the flame posts and re-posting your opinion piece on a new thread seemed to be a sensible compromise.

[Sheriff Fatman]

I always wonder about the moderation on this forum and why it's so inconsistent. It is constantly deemed fine to flame me until I respond and then suddenly flaming isn't ok anymore. On the subject of GS I am concerned that a volatile life shattering story would be like a loaded gun and those waving it around irresponsibly in his direction should have some degree of accountability for the state of mind they put him in. I don't like that he suddenly appears on Football Focus that weekend and I feel a bit like he was set up for a fall. I can't imagine why I would be chastised for saying I think something is wrong here. Because that is exactly what the Leveson Enquiry is doing right now. Yet expressing my worry about the circumstances of his shocking demise is so intolerable that the thread should be moderated. Afterall it's a RIP thread and asking why shows terrible disrespect right?

The last RIP thread I posted in was that of Amy Winehouse. The coroner reported that her body was free from drugs and so it seems that she did indeed overcome these demons and yet sadly killed herself by drinking too much that evening. In that thread I passionately supported and respected her memory. However, a number of people on this forum posted that she deserved to die, that they didn't give a fig about her, that they had no sympathy for her, and people even made jokes about her. Funny because I don't remember any modding in that thread or calls to respect her memory in what was a RIP thread. I found many comments in that thread to be disrespectful to her memory and just plain malicious. But that was ok. But asking why in the Gary Speed thread is completely unacceptable. Sorry but the picking and choosing of moral standards when it suits is a joke to me.

Really don't think people should speculate. Don't see what good can come of it. It was a really sad and shocking event.
I'd rather celebrate his life than endlessly discuss his death.

The OP in the thread asked people not to speculate, a request which most people chose to respect.  For some reason, you chose to ignore this and tried to commence a debate within it which, given the emotion attached to the thread, unsurprisingly drew some pretty ugly responses and took the whole thread away from the purpose it was intended for.

Quite why you chose to do this within the thread is beyond me, but I found it distasteful and disrespectful and removed it, if only to protect the integrity of the original thread and prevent it descending into a flame war.  If that's joke moderating then I'm happy enough to be a joke moderator.

Speculate all you want in the new thread, and maybe some people will join you in the discussion.  Others can now choose to ignore it and simply remember Gary Speed in their own way on the original thread.

[MANTIS01]

You’ve had two recent RIP threads to moderate. In this one you deem any deviation away from the original sentiment worthy of moderation. In the Amy Winehouse one people were free to say she got what she deserved and to call her names. I didn’t see anybody seeking to protect the original integrity of the thread. Nobody found those comments distasteful or deleted posts. That thread diverted off into a debate about soldiers and drugs as I remember. In this one I say hey i’m shocked and what happened here? and that is deemed distasteful. I buy into the fact that you are all good people and tough job etc but I do figure it’s possible to aspire to a greater level of consistency than that. If you don’t then ok.

As to why I chose the GS thread to ask what happened to GS. Since this story broke it seems every mention of GS is followed by advice or story about depression. I find that constant link to mental illness quite inappropriate considering GS wasn’t depressed. I wonder if the media should be leading people down that path really and why they are doing it. I would prefer to make up my own mind so think asking other people what happened is reasonable and not at all disrespectful. I mean personally I can’t fathom why people would use the RIP Amy Winehouse thread to say they didn’t give a fig about her really but there you go.

[tikay]

A very difficult one for the Mods, Mr Mantis, & as Tom says, we don't always get it right. Or wrong. However, the Mods try to get it right, & they do so with good intent.

On with the GS debate now, if you so wish, but the Mods will never please everyone, & that's understandable.

If you do wish to debate the Mod's even-handedness or consistency, feel free, but I would suggest a seperate Thread, as several debates are getting mixed up.

THIS thread is for the GS debate.

Thanks.

[smashedagain]

Just doing my job. Keep up the fine work lads and remember .....
"becareful out there".

[GreekStein]

What's the point in speculating?

Agree it's very weird as does everyone.

[celtic]

What's the point in speculating?

Agree it's very weird as does everyone.

Human nature when a well known person does something like this is to speculate why.

[MANTIS01]

I often hear people say the tabloids churn out news from the gutter and the gullible sheep british public just lap it up. Many people who prefer independent thought deduce he died because of press intrusion into his life. I think that too and figure their strategy to link his death to mental illness is diversionary and wholly inappropriate. Usually they are the complete nosey parkers and I don't really think the red tops have "respect" for people, so funny that their whole coverage never directly asked why. Thus imo without the press intruding into his private life he would still be alive and happy. I don't care at all what GS got up to in his private life because it's not in the public interest and clearly didn't affect his job.

Not speculating is to allow the press to destroy lives unchecked. If they were about to destroy his life one day I think all this we loved GS on the front pages the next is a bit rich isn't it? So to not speculate is to behave like the media lead sheep people suggest we are and to tolerate the way the press operate. The NOTW closed because people speculated and speculation could well lead to futher red top closures and a change in how the press conduct themselves. If people don't want to speculate then that's fine but asking why really doesn't make somebody disrespectful. Saying somebody deserved to die is disrespectful.

Anyway can the mods tell me which day I'm on the advent calendar so I can remember to log back in for my special day?

[tikay]

I often hear people say the tabloids churn out news from the gutter and the gullible sheep british public just lap it up. Many people who prefer independent thought deduce he died because of press intrusion into his life. I think that too and figure their strategy to link his death to mental illness is diversionary and wholly inappropriate. Usually they are the complete nosey parkers and I don't really think the red tops have "respect" for people, so funny that their whole coverage never directly asked why. Thus imo without the press intruding into his private life he would still be alive and happy. I don't care at all what GS got up to in his private life because it's not in the public interest and clearly didn't affect his job.

Not speculating is to allow the press to destroy lives unchecked. If they were about to destroy his life one day I think all this we loved GS on the front pages the next is a bit rich isn't it? So to not speculate is to behave like the media lead sheep people suggest we are and to tolerate the way the press operate. The NOTW closed because people speculated and speculation could well lead to futher red top closures and a change in how the press conduct themselves. If people don't want to speculate then that's fine but asking why really doesn't make somebody disrespectful. Saying somebody deserved to die is disrespectful.

Anyway can the mods tell me which day I'm on the advent calendar so I can remember to log back in for my special day?

Rich is keeping his Advent "choices" private, but I have recommended to him that you be included on TWO grounds, one for the brevity of your Posts, & the other for what I consider to be your superb contributions to the PHA, which are admired by one & all. Well, by me, anyway.

[GreekStein]

I often hear people say the tabloids churn out news from the gutter and the gullible sheep british public just lap it up. Many people who prefer independent thought deduce he died because of press intrusion into his life. I think that too and figure their strategy to link his death to mental illness is diversionary and wholly inappropriate. Usually they are the complete nosey parkers and I don't really think the red tops have "respect" for people, so funny that their whole coverage never directly asked why. Thus imo without the press intruding into his private life he would still be alive and happy. I don't care at all what GS got up to in his private life because it's not in the public interest and clearly didn't affect his job.

Not speculating is to allow the press to destroy lives unchecked. If they were about to destroy his life one day I think all this we loved GS on the front pages the next is a bit rich isn't it? So to not speculate is to behave like the media lead sheep people suggest we are and to tolerate the way the press operate. The NOTW closed because people speculated and speculation could well lead to futher red top closures and a change in how the press conduct themselves. If people don't want to speculate then that's fine but asking why really doesn't make somebody disrespectful. Saying somebody deserved to die is disrespectful.

Anyway can the mods tell me which day I'm on the advent calendar so I can remember to log back in for my special day?

Rich is keeping his Advent "choices" private, but I have recommended to him that you be included on TWO grounds, one for the brevity of your Posts, & the other for what I consider to be your superb contributions to the PHA, which are admired by one & all. Well, by me, anyway.

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOL