Jimmy Carr

[StuartHopkin]

There is a very simple solution that is fair to everyone - publish the amount everyone pays in tax.

With public transparency - there is no secrecy.

And how much they earn?

[neeko]

There is a very simple solution that is fair to everyone - publish the amount everyone pays in tax.

With public transparency - there is no secrecy.

And how much they earn?

On balance no - because taxable "income" for non PAYE taxpayers is a accounting fiction, the amount of tax paid is a fact.

One of the purposes of tax openness is to embarass people into paying a "fair" amount - including a % age would muddy things.

[leethefish]

Playing poker for a living is tax avoidance?

Discuss

No not avoidance at all.
Very grey area poker winnings aint taxed simple as that in my book

[EvilPie]

Playing poker for a living is tax avoidance?

Discuss

How can you avoid something that you don't have to do?

[Sheriff Fatman]

Tax avoidance will never be closed down by this government because it would alienate a very large number of Conservative party donors.  Similarly if Cameron had been asked about Barlow he would have declined to comment.  It was a cheap shot by Cameron and one which is very likely to backfire on him.

+1

[kinboshi]

http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/voices/2012/06/tax-avoidance-isnt-left-or-right-issue-its-cancer-eating-our-democracy

[Jon MW]

http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/voices/2012/06/tax-avoidance-isnt-left-or-right-issue-its-cancer-eating-our-democracy

I wonder if he has an ISA - because that's legal tax avoidance, just like every other form of tax avoidance

[EvilPie]

http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/voices/2012/06/tax-avoidance-isnt-left-or-right-issue-its-cancer-eating-our-democracy

I wonder if he has an ISA - because that's legal tax avoidance, just like every other form of tax avoidance

It's a bit different to be fair. An ISA only stops you paying tax on any interest earned on the money that's in there. You still have to pay tax on the money you put in there in the first place.

What we're talking about is avoiding tax on your salary.

For Joe Public to put £10k in to an ISA he probably needs to earn around £13k

For Mr 1% tax to put £10k in an ISA he needs to earn around £10100

[outragous76]

Its a pointless discusion

The article outlines the problem nicely - tax legislation that you can drive a bus through. Everytime another 100 pages are added to close a loophole  - the lawyers and accountants  open another.

The only way it will be stopped is by operating a flat rate of tax. This will never happen as the govt dont want to upset high earners who can benefit from it (and most of them are at it).

I long for the day when I have a difficult moral decision to make!

[Girgy85]

http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/voices/2012/06/tax-avoidance-isnt-left-or-right-issue-its-cancer-eating-our-democracy

I wonder if he has an ISA - because that's legal tax avoidance, just like every other form of tax avoidance

It's a bit different to be fair. An ISA only stops you paying tax on any interest earned on the money that's in there. You still have to pay tax on the money you put in there in the first place.

What we're talking about is avoiding tax on your salary.

For Joe Public to put £10k in to an ISA he probably needs to earn around £13k

For Mr 1% tax to put £10k in an ISA he needs to earn around £10100

For Mr 0% tax to put £10k in an ISA he needs to earn exactly £10000

[outragous76]

Wow

I think HMRC read this thread!

today I got a letter telling me I owe them £500  - I dont - some of it dates back to 2006 (i was PAYE no assets)

Good luck tax dodgers you have my support!

[StuartHopkin]

The whole point is that it is a game of balance and it really is treated as a game.

They will never clamp down on the loop holes, they are there for a reason. They make the UK appealing enough to profitable individuals/companies to remain in the UK and pay some tax.

If everything was water tight overall tax goes down due to the amount of people who realise they are better off living elsewhere.

These schemes can't be done year on year and there is also a huge risk that they will not be successful.
Jimmy Carr would have to fully disclose to HMRC which scheme he had used, and the HMRC would have the full details on file ready for when they decide if they will fight the scheme as a whole.

They dont want to win them all though as that would cost them money in the long run.

[Jon MW]

I actually thought about using the game analogy but cba to post.

1% is an extreme example obviously but 1% tax on Jimmy Carrs earnings is a lot more than most people earn, let alone what they pay in tax.

The more normal tax avoidance schemes wouldn't save quite so much, and the principle is the same, if you get a smaller percentage of a lot of money - you're going to raise a lot more money than if you got 0% of it - which is what would mainly happen if you didn't allow any of the loopholes through.