Vouching for someone

[Doobs]

I guess Pleno should be more careful with his wording, but I didn't read that thinking Pleno was on the hook.  People shouldn't assume that words that mean something in their circles mean the same thing to people from a different generation and move in different circles.

Doesn't this all distract a bit from the person that stole the money?   It isn't Pleno's fault, isn't the fault of his stepfather,it is entirely the stakee's fault.  

[skolsuper]

I guess Pleno should be more careful with his wording, but I didn't read that thinking Pleno was on the hook.  People shouldn't assume that words that mean something in their circles mean the same thing to people from a different generation and move in different circles.

Doesn't this all distract a bit from the person that stole the money?   It isn't Pleno's fault, isn't the fault of his stepfather,it is entirely the stakee's fault.  

I don't think pleno should have to pay everyone, but I do think he and people in general should be more careful with vouching.

[Woodsey]

Personally I'd vouch for a sum total of 1 person on this forum. There's lot's of others I'd trust with my own money and would provide a reference for but I'd never go as far as acting as a guarantor.

logic fail, one of these statements is false.

Eh? How do you work that out?

Take yourself as a perfect example of one of these people.

"I'd happily stake James Keys in to something and trust him with with my money."

"I'd never act as a guarantor for James Keys in any kind of staking venture."

Which one of the above statements is false? They both look spot on to me.

If you wouldn't act as a guarantor, you don't trust me with your money.

Rubbish, what Matt says is spot on for me too, I'd do the same as him.

[Laxie]

I only trust 3 people on the planet 100%...and one of those three is me. 

Have watched too many friends, grimmed by 'trustworthy' sources over the last couple of years.  Just don't loan folks.  Only sure fire way to avoid hassle. 

Staking is different.  If you toss your money in hoping to make further gains, but it all goes tits up...not much different to playing the lotto imo. 

Either way, nice to think the person will be straight up, but foolish to assume it...no matter what anyone says.

[Skippy]

Personally I'd vouch for a sum total of 1 person on this forum. There's lot's of others I'd trust with my own money and would provide a reference for but I'd never go as far as acting as a guarantor.

logic fail, one of these statements is false.

Eh? How do you work that out?

Take yourself as a perfect example of one of these people.

"I'd happily stake James Keys in to something and trust him with with my money."

"I'd never act as a guarantor for James Keys in any kind of staking venture."

Which one of the above statements is false? They both look spot on to me.

If you wouldn't act as a guarantor, you don't trust me with your money.

Rubbish, what Matt says is spot on for me too, I'd do that.

+1, obviously. There's a lot of difference between buying 1% in someone's Main Event package and being on the hook for the $10 million first prize when your horse ships it then goes missing, all because you said "I've lent/staked them money in the past, and it's all went fine".

[EvilPie]

All Pleno's done is say that the guy's 'v trustworthy'. He's expressed an opinion which I'm sure has now changed.

I can't see anywhere that Pleno has actually vouched for Tom.

I guess it depends on your own use of the word vouch. If the word isn't expressly used then I don't see an actual 'vouch'. A vouch to me is a guarantee and there clearly isn't one here.

[FUN4FRASER]

All Pleno's done is say that the guy's 'v trustworthy'. He's expressed an opinion which I'm sure has now changed.

I can't see anywhere that Pleno has actually vouched for Tom.

I guess it depends on your own use of the word vouch. If the word isn't expressly used then I don't see an actual 'vouch'. A vouch to me is a guarantee and there clearly isn't one here.

All of This  +1

[pleno1]

tbf i hashtagged to monda

#justavouch

but we were playing, anyway lesson learned, will stay v clear in future.

[FUN4FRASER]

tbf i hashtagged to monda

#justavouch

but we were playing, anyway lesson learned, will stay v clear in future.

No Way...you dont need to stay clear ...You cannot account for every eventuality  !

Your Comments were well intentioned as are a lot of other peoples on this forum . Unfortunately things have gone wrong this time but as in life these things happen  !!!

As Doobs has  suggested it may be prudent to think about ones choice of words when "vouching" for people but its not your fault Pads   FFS

[EvilPie]

tbf i hashtagged to monda

#justavouch

but we were playing, anyway lesson learned, will stay v clear in future.

No Way...you dont need to stay clear ...You cannot account for every eventuality  !

Your Comments were well intentioned as are a lot of other peoples on this forum . Unfortunately things have gone wrong this time but as in life these things happen  !!!

As Doobs has  suggested it may be prudent to think about ones choice of words when "vouching" for people but its not your fault Pads   FFS

Definitely this. You're one of the people I would trust with a stake despite not knowing you at all. I would also trust your opinion on someone's suitability for a stake.

That hasn't changed one bit because of this incident. All that happened is you got one wrong. Believe me there will be loads more in your chosen profession.

[outragous76]

tbf i hashtagged to monda

#justavouch

but we were playing, anyway lesson learned, will stay v clear in future.

No Way...you dont need to stay clear ...You cannot account for every eventuality  !

Your Comments were well intentioned as are a lot of other peoples on this forum . Unfortunately things have gone wrong this time but as in life these things happen  !!!

As Doobs has  suggested it may be prudent to think about ones choice of words when "vouching" for people but its not your fault Pads   FFS

Disagree Fraser

Pleno saying #justavouch could easily swing someone elses decision to stake (rightly or wrongly)

I actually dont think Pleno formally vouched for him in this instance, but I do think he was a nats piss away from doing so!

I would say it for no-one on here, and its got nothing to do with strength of friendship IMO. I would only vouch if lets say I had a significant investment, but we needed more to make it work and I believed in the guy 100%. Cant see this arising in poker for me

[The Camel]

Fwiw I obviously don't think Pleno bears any responsibility for the money in this case, but I do think his post might have swayed someone who didn't know the player to trust him and buy a stake.

It just put it my mind that people should be very careful who they vouch for and how much better it was back in the day when if you vouched for someone, you owed if they grimmed.

[TL900]

I am the only one responsible for this and who will pay back all the money. Not pads, think its ludicrus that he is even being questioned about it. People will get their money back via me because of my mistakes and my wrong doings not because pads says nice stuff and thinks im a good investment even with the word vouch used.

[redarmi]

I had already invested but plenos post certainly made me feel better about my investment.  I think people say positive things about other players on here a bit too lightly when it comes to staking etc often having only dealt with them a few times and not knowing them personally.  It is impossible to vouch for or even really recommend someone if you don't know their personal situation and even when you do sometimes it goes wrong ala Blatch.  I have financial dealings with a few people on here and if someone asked me about one of them I would just tell the person what I had done and if they seemed okay ie." I have sent money to and received money from Keith on plenty of occasions but rarely more than a thousand.  I would trust him with more up to a limit and he always seems honest about his situation and others I trust seem to trust him too"  Now I trust Keith more than almost anyone else on this forum but I would never vouch for him beyond what I just said.  I don't know whether he has a good relationship with his wife, whether he is stretched with his mortgage....so many variables I just don't know to suggest anything more.

[George2Loose]

Think we're perhaps getting caught up in terminology.

Think in general people are quick to trust/back people up when they've only really skyped. What dealings did Pleno actually have with Tom to say his is v v v trustworthy?