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Paris horror attack
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Topic: Paris horror attack (Read 52295 times)
AndrewT
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Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #195 on:
January 14, 2015, 06:34:48 PM »
Personally, I am offended by the fact that Finkelstein fella can't spell 'considered'.
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RED-DOG
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Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #196 on:
January 14, 2015, 06:35:04 PM »
Quote from: doubleup on January 14, 2015, 06:25:49 PM
Quote from: celtic on January 14, 2015, 05:47:59 PM
Can someone explain why it's deemed ok to offend someone on the basis of their religion, but not on their race?
Surely we can then say we have the right to be racist, 'cos we got freedom of speech Innit'
Race is a fact, religion is a fantasy
Not for the majority.
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The older I get, the better I was.
Ironside
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Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #197 on:
January 14, 2015, 06:37:01 PM »
Quote from: doubleup on January 14, 2015, 06:25:49 PM
Quote from: celtic on January 14, 2015, 05:47:59 PM
Can someone explain why it's deemed ok to offend someone on the basis of their religion, but not on their race?
Surely we can then say we have the right to be racist, 'cos we got freedom of speech Innit'
Race is a fact, religion is a fantasy
relgion is a fact, Its there, the fact you might agree or disagree there is an almighty being which people worship is a case of fact or fiction
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lend me a beer and I'll lend you my ear
Jon MW
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Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #198 on:
January 14, 2015, 06:37:45 PM »
Quote from: celtic on January 14, 2015, 05:47:59 PM
Can someone explain why it's deemed ok to offend someone on the basis of their religion, but not on their race?
Surely we can then say we have the right to be racist, 'cos we got freedom of speech Innit'
Racism isn't offending people based on their race - it's making assumptions based on their race.
You making assumptions might then offend them - but it isn't the part that's racist
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Jon "the British cowboy" Woodfield
2011 blonde MTT League August Champion
2011 UK Team Championships: Black Belt Poker Team Captain - - runners up - -
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kinboshi
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We go again.
Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #199 on:
January 14, 2015, 06:43:55 PM »
Quote from: celtic on January 14, 2015, 05:47:59 PM
Can someone explain why it's deemed ok to offend someone on the basis of their religion, but not on their race?
Surely we can then say we have the right to be racist, 'cos we got freedom of speech Innit'
Broadly speaking, it's the difference between what someone IS, and what they DO.
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'The meme for blind faith secures its own perpetuation by the simple unconscious expedient of discouraging rational inquiry.'
doubleup
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Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #200 on:
January 14, 2015, 06:58:03 PM »
Quote from: RED-DOG on January 14, 2015, 06:35:04 PM
Quote from: doubleup on January 14, 2015, 06:25:49 PM
Quote from: celtic on January 14, 2015, 05:47:59 PM
Can someone explain why it's deemed ok to offend someone on the basis of their religion, but not on their race?
Surely we can then say we have the right to be racist, 'cos we got freedom of speech Innit'
Race is a fact, religion is a fantasy
Not for the majority.
Its made up by human beings, its a fantasy to make them feel better and even if they don't really believe it, they enjoy the tribalism of being part of the group that eg mutilates young girls genitals (without considering why their fabulous infallible creator god didn't do the work properly).
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DaveShoelace
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Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #201 on:
January 14, 2015, 07:34:13 PM »
Quote from: kinboshi on January 14, 2015, 06:43:55 PM
Quote from: celtic on January 14, 2015, 05:47:59 PM
Can someone explain why it's deemed ok to offend someone on the basis of their religion, but not on their race?
Surely we can then say we have the right to be racist, 'cos we got freedom of speech Innit'
Broadly speaking, it's the difference between what someone IS, and what they DO.
I think the assumption people make is that religion is a choice, and your race is not a choice.
I'm not sure I actually agree that's the case for many people. I was raised in a church of england school/area, with agnostic parents and I believe that I eventually came to choose to be atheist. When I did, my circumstances meant it was not a big deal and they probably brought me to that decision naturally. However, for someone born in a very religious country with very religious parents and the threat of (at least) social exclusion if they change their religion, I don't think that person has much choice at all about their religion.
Such a tough one. I believe in freedom of speech and in particular freedom of comedy, but I can see why mocking a relgion is considered on a part with racism also.
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Doobs
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Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #202 on:
January 14, 2015, 08:06:21 PM »
Quote from: doubleup on January 14, 2015, 06:58:03 PM
Quote from: RED-DOG on January 14, 2015, 06:35:04 PM
Quote from: doubleup on January 14, 2015, 06:25:49 PM
Quote from: celtic on January 14, 2015, 05:47:59 PM
Can someone explain why it's deemed ok to offend someone on the basis of their religion, but not on their race?
Surely we can then say we have the right to be racist, 'cos we got freedom of speech Innit'
Race is a fact, religion is a fantasy
Not for the majority.
Its made up by human beings, its a fantasy to make them feel better and even if they don't really believe it, they enjoy the tribalism of being part of the group that eg mutilates young girls genitals (without considering why their fabulous infallible creator god didn't do the work properly).
What has mutiliting young girls got to do with religion? It is a regional thing, not a Muslim or Christian thing. For example, it doesn't happen in Malaysia or much in the UK, or Iraq, but happens an awful lot in Eritrea (more Christians than Muslims).
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kinboshi
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We go again.
Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #203 on:
January 14, 2015, 08:30:03 PM »
Quote from: Doobs on January 14, 2015, 08:06:21 PM
Quote from: doubleup on January 14, 2015, 06:58:03 PM
Quote from: RED-DOG on January 14, 2015, 06:35:04 PM
Quote from: doubleup on January 14, 2015, 06:25:49 PM
Quote from: celtic on January 14, 2015, 05:47:59 PM
Can someone explain why it's deemed ok to offend someone on the basis of their religion, but not on their race?
Surely we can then say we have the right to be racist, 'cos we got freedom of speech Innit'
Race is a fact, religion is a fantasy
Not for the majority.
Its made up by human beings, its a fantasy to make them feel better and even if they don't really believe it, they enjoy the tribalism of being part of the group that eg mutilates young girls genitals (without considering why their fabulous infallible creator god didn't do the work properly).
What has mutiliting young girls got to do with religion? It is a regional thing, not a Muslim or Christian thing. For example, it doesn't happen in Malaysia or much in the UK, or Iraq, but happens an awful lot in Eritrea (more Christians than Muslims).
FGM is awful. In some countries it's ridiculously prevalent.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/lv?key=0At6CC4x_yBnMdGdZSVNGaktTMVhZNFlJb1hmaUppbmc&type=view&gid=0&f=true&sortcolid=2&sortasc=false&rowsperpage=250
http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2013/jun/24/female-genital-mutilation-prevalence-uk
Estimated over 66,000 in the UK who have suffered FGM. That's not an insignificant number.
«
Last Edit: January 14, 2015, 08:31:40 PM by kinboshi
»
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'The meme for blind faith secures its own perpetuation by the simple unconscious expedient of discouraging rational inquiry.'
kinboshi
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We go again.
Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #204 on:
January 14, 2015, 08:35:55 PM »
Quote from: DaveShoelace on January 14, 2015, 07:34:13 PM
Quote from: kinboshi on January 14, 2015, 06:43:55 PM
Quote from: celtic on January 14, 2015, 05:47:59 PM
Can someone explain why it's deemed ok to offend someone on the basis of their religion, but not on their race?
Surely we can then say we have the right to be racist, 'cos we got freedom of speech Innit'
Broadly speaking, it's the difference between what someone IS, and what they DO.
I think the assumption people make is that religion is a choice, and your race is not a choice.
I'm not sure I actually agree that's the case for many people. I was raised in a church of england school/area, with agnostic parents and I believe that I eventually came to choose to be atheist. When I did, my circumstances meant it was not a big deal and they probably brought me to that decision naturally. However, for someone born in a very religious country with very religious parents and the threat of (at least) social exclusion if they change their religion, I don't think that person has much choice at all about their religion.
Such a tough one. I believe in freedom of speech and in particular freedom of comedy, but I can see why mocking a relgion is considered on a part with racism also.
You're not born into a particular religion. Yes, your family and community might be focused around a particular religion, but you're not born as an adherent of a particular religion or faith.
For many there's very little choice as to what religion they end up following. Obviously if you're born in Saudi Arabia you're more likely to become a Muslim than someone born in say Brazil.
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'The meme for blind faith secures its own perpetuation by the simple unconscious expedient of discouraging rational inquiry.'
doubleup
Hero Member
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Posts: 7052
Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #205 on:
January 14, 2015, 08:36:41 PM »
And where it is practiced it is undoubtedly connected to religion
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_views_on_female_genital_mutilation
Islam introduced FGM into Indonesia and Malaysia from the 13th century as part of its drive to convert people to Islam
many Christian women are circumcised in Egypt, Kenya, Nigeria and Tanzania believing it to be a religious requirement
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kinboshi
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We go again.
Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #206 on:
January 14, 2015, 08:39:22 PM »
The percentage in Egypt - it's surprising, and scary, and sad.
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'The meme for blind faith secures its own perpetuation by the simple unconscious expedient of discouraging rational inquiry.'
Woodsey
Hero Member
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Posts: 15846
Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #207 on:
January 14, 2015, 08:54:58 PM »
Quote from: doubleup on January 14, 2015, 08:36:41 PM
And where it is practiced it is undoubtedly connected to religion
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_views_on_female_genital_mutilation
Islam introduced FGM into Indonesia and Malaysia from the 13th century as part of its drive to convert people to Islam
many Christian women are circumcised in Egypt, Kenya, Nigeria and Tanzania believing it to be a religious requirement
Saw a TV program the other day (Panorama maybe?)and they said it's not a religious problem, but an African problem.
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Doobs
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Posts: 16573
Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #208 on:
January 14, 2015, 09:03:05 PM »
Quote from: Woodsey on January 14, 2015, 08:54:58 PM
Quote from: doubleup on January 14, 2015, 08:36:41 PM
And where it is practiced it is undoubtedly connected to religion
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_views_on_female_genital_mutilation
Islam introduced FGM into Indonesia and Malaysia from the 13th century as part of its drive to convert people to Islam
many Christian women are circumcised in Egypt, Kenya, Nigeria and Tanzania believing it to be a religious requirement
Saw a TV program the other day (Panorama maybe?)and they said it's not a religious problem, but an African problem.
Exactly. The vast majority of the world's Muslims don't practice it, 98% of Somalis do. They always did even before Islam took over. It isn't all of Africa either, it is just the bit in the middle. I don't know the figures exactly, but the UK problem is strongly linked to those of Somali origin.
The fact some people use religion to justify it doesn't take away the fact it is very much a regional thing.
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Marky147
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Posts: 22797
Re: Paris horror attack
«
Reply #209 on:
January 14, 2015, 09:08:02 PM »
Quote from: Doobs on January 14, 2015, 09:03:05 PM
Quote from: Woodsey on January 14, 2015, 08:54:58 PM
Quote from: doubleup on January 14, 2015, 08:36:41 PM
And where it is practiced it is undoubtedly connected to religion
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_views_on_female_genital_mutilation
Islam introduced FGM into Indonesia and Malaysia from the 13th century as part of its drive to convert people to Islam
many Christian women are circumcised in Egypt, Kenya, Nigeria and Tanzania believing it to be a religious requirement
Saw a TV program the other day (Panorama maybe?)and they said it's not a religious problem, but an African problem.
Exactly. The vast majority of the world's Muslims don't practice it, 98% of Somalis do. They always did even before Islam took over. It isn't all of Africa either, it is just the bit in the middle. I don't know the figures exactly, but the UK problem is strongly linked to those of Somali origin.
The fact some people use religion to justify it doesn't take away the fact it is very much a regional thing.
The interview that was posted earlier went into the mutilation problem.
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