The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[DaveShoelace]

24 things JC believes.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-34209478

Most of those things seem pretty reasonable to me, even those that I do not agree with.

How do you reckon that national maximum wage would work? What do you think Corbyn would consider an appropriate maximum.

It's a concept I've never considered before, can't get my head around it.

[Doobs]

24 things JC believes.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-34209478

Most of those things seem pretty reasonable to me, even those that I do not agree with.

How do you reckon that national maximum wage would work? What do you think Corbyn would consider an appropriate maximum.

It's a concept I've never considered before, can't get my head around it.

Third of the personal tax take comes from the top 1%?  Maybe not exact, but something like that.  It appeals to the people who don't think things through.  

Edit 27%.  Meh.  Better set the max rate to catch the top 10% though?

[mulhuzz]

24 things JC believes.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-34209478

Most of those things seem pretty reasonable to me, even those that I do not agree with.

There's a lot of naivety as well.

He wants a negotiated settlement for the Falklands eg. The islanders don't want it and the Argentinians won't be satisfied without it, so why would that be a good deal for Britain?

Public Energy company ownership is madness. It leads to lack of investment, no competition and no innovation. If he wants to make the energy sector better he's picked the nut worst way, similarly for the railways.

[Jon MW]

24 things JC believes.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-34209478

Most of those things seem pretty reasonable to me, even those that I do not agree with.

There's a lot of naivety as well.

He wants a negotiated settlement for the Falklands eg. The islanders don't want it and the Argentinians won't be satisfied without it, so why would that be a good deal for Britain?

...

The Falkland Islands had a poll in 2013

Out of 1650 people
1517 people voted

1513 voted that they wished for the status quo to remain
(3 against and 1 invalid)

How could he possibly negotiate for any kind of joint control with that kind of mandate for the status quo?

Most of them seem fairly reasonable though with problems that mean they just wouldn't work.

For example ending austerity by, "higher taxes for the rich and a crackdown on tax avoidance and evasion while tackling "corporate welfare" and tax breaks for companies" - even if you ignore the fact that this could/would decrease wealth creation (as would the maximum wage idea) - I'm pretty sure that you could do all that, and still be left with not enough money to fund it. What's the plan after that? I suspect that it might come into the higher taxes for the rich part - just with an increasingly wide definition of 'rich'.

Similarly, it's a great idea to replace student tuition fees with grants but the only way to afford that would probably be to drastically reduce the size of higher education. I wouldn't be wholly opposed to this - but can you really see any government saying that actually they want to it to go back to only 10% of school leavers going to university?

If they have good enough press and avoid some of the most unelectable ideas I might worry they could have a chance.

[neeko]

I don't understand scrapping uni fees - doing this moves the burden of cost from the riches half of the population (graduates) and sticks the cost (partially) on the poorest (non graduates) - bonkers. (And if the graduate does not have a high income then they don't even pay!)

[Honeybadger]

I remember when Labour brought in the minimum wage. So many people were telling the public that it was a disaster which was going to make thousands of businesses go under and destroy the economy. It didn't.

[Woodsey]

I remember when Labour brought in the minimum wage. So many people were telling the public that it was a disaster which was going to make thousands of businesses go under and destroy the economy. It didn't.

For someone with apparently such a social conscience you seem pretty happy taking people's money at the poker table. Some of whom won't be able to afford it and will no doubt end up going into debt as a result you fleecing them 

[david3103]

I remember when Labour brought in the minimum wage. So many people were telling the public that it was a disaster which was going to make thousands of businesses go under and destroy the economy. It didn't.

For someone with apparently such a social conscience you seem pretty happy taking people's money at the poker table. Some of whom won't be able to afford it and will no doubt end up going into debt as a result you fleecing them 

Do you miss Kmac that much?

[Woodsey]

I remember when Labour brought in the minimum wage. So many people were telling the public that it was a disaster which was going to make thousands of businesses go under and destroy the economy. It didn't.

For someone with apparently such a social conscience you seem pretty happy taking people's money at the poker table. Some of whom won't be able to afford it and will no doubt end up going into debt as a result you fleecing them 

Do you miss Kmac that much?

No idea wtf you are on about...

[MintTrav]

The Falkland Islands had a poll in 2013

Out of 1650 people
1517 people voted

1513 voted that they wished for the status quo to remain
(3 against and 1 invalid)

How could he possibly negotiate for any kind of joint control with that kind of mandate for the status quo?

How valid is any vote in the Falklands (or, indeed, Gibraltar)?

I could get all my family to go and occupy your house. Then we'll have a vote of the people living there regarding who owns it. What do you know? The majority has voted in favour of themselves.

[MANTIS01]

The Falkland Islands had a poll in 2013

Out of 1650 people
1517 people voted

1513 voted that they wished for the status quo to remain
(3 against and 1 invalid)

How could he possibly negotiate for any kind of joint control with that kind of mandate for the status quo?

How valid is any vote in the Falklands (or, indeed, Gibraltar)?

I could get all my family to go and occupy your house. Then we'll have a vote of the people living there regarding who owns it. What do you know? The majority has voted in favour of themselves.

By that rational how valid are votes in UK from people who don't have British heritage?

Kinda dangerous position right?

[Cf]

I don't really take an interest in politics but the tories saying labour are a threat to families and the like sounds like pretty desperate stuff.

And people saying the party are unelectable sounds like the sort of thing people just try to repeat in the hope that it'll make it true.

[AndrewT]

And people saying the party are unelectable sounds like the sort of thing people just try to repeat in the hope that it'll make it true.

But it does work. The exact same thing happened in the general election - the Tories' scare story about a vote for Labour meaning that the SNP would be running the country did eventually stick.

[TightEnd]

I don't really take an interest in politics but the tories saying labour are a threat to families and the like sounds like pretty desperate stuff.

this is the sort of stuff they are referring to

whilst it is overblown, there is plenty for them to go at, years and years of being a maverick with no prospect of power means you can support all sorts of causes and say all sorts of things

we've got this constantly while Crbyn is leader



meanwhile the new shadow chancellor is john mcdonnell...and his history of causes and quotes gives them even more to go at

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/john-mcdonnell-profile-jeremy-corbyns-new-shadow-chancellor-who-once-said-he-wanted-to-assassinate-margaret-thatcher-10499474.html


now when we talk about them being unelectable this is the stuff that middle england and the marginal voter is going to have put in front of them constantly

i do accept that the appeal to previous non voters etc is likely to be a big facotr on the other hand

[david3103]

I'm inclined to wait and see how Corbyn acts as leader and will try to judge him on his merits now rather than his past.
No doubt if we trawled over his previous statements we could come up with '24 things that David Cameron Believes' that would give cause for concern too.
Membership of The Bullington Club would suggest that at one stage in his life he believed that the wealthy should enjoy privileges that the hoi polloi can't...

Meantime, the interview with Hillary Benn on the Today Programme seems to suggest that the BBC have adopted a surprisingly aggressive stance toward Labour's new regime.