(Prince) Andrew

[EssexPhil]

We live in an increasingly mad World.

L am no particular fan of the Royal Family. I have never met Andrew. Various friends of mine have, and were generally pretty unimpressed.

But this pile-on is ridiculous. What exactly is he supposed to have done wrong? Entitled rich middle-aged man partakes of some beautiful 20-something women? Ooh, he must be really unique there. Not.

I can see various American Lawyers circling. Trying to get rich. Since when is a 26 year old woman choosing to fly halfway round the World to shag a man she has never previously met, in return for large amounts of cash, a "victim" ?

The World has gone mad. If a 26 year old woman gives it away, she is still in danger of being derided as a slag (for reasons that escape me, women are never "players"). If they charge £200 they are derided as a prostitute. Charge £20,000? A "victim".

The Man is a fool. A liar. And not someone who lives by values that I agree with.

All of this is just a smokescreen to divert attention away from the people who are still rich and powerful. Presidents. And ex-Presidents. Republicans. And Democrats.

Rant over

[Pokerpops]

Seriously?

What exactly did he do wrong?

Mr Mountbatten-Windsor and his ex-wife peddled themselves to the paedophile for years. Trips to Balmoral, Windsor and Buck House were traded for cash and for sexual opportunity. The excuses/rationalisations you make for him would apply to most of Epstein’s acolytes.
He added a veneer of respectability to Epstein, offered him access to society, stayed ‘loyal’ despite the earlier conviction, and lied about it. On the plus side, the Maitliss interview was hilarious in an Alan Partridgr/David Brent way but I don’t think he meant it to be.

[doubleup]

The 26yo's claim is obviously idiotic. The idea is probably to stimulate a denial (as windsor is too stupid to kep his mouth shut) and then instigate libel proceedings.

[EssexPhil]

That's the good bit about debate. Because different people see things different ways. In my career, I had the dubious pleasure of advising both for and against many paedophiles. They are not just 1 group of people to be lumped into the same box. Life is more complicated than that.

Was Epstein a paedophile? We will never know. Not least because, while he was charged with various offences involving 14-yr-olds (in 2008), those cases were dropped.

The next point to make is that what constitutes either a "paedo" or a "sex trafficker" varies. Not only from Country to Country, but also from State to State.

The US (unlike the UK) has different rules relating to the legal age of consent, both for the act itself, and again for the age someone can charge for it. And, in some States, what me might term "pimping" has a lot wider definition.

To put that in a context that might resonate with Poker Players, what might meet the legal definitions in, say, Nevada, is 21. So any porn involving people who have not been proved to be over 21 is illegal. And anybody viewing UK porn in, say, Las Vegas is likely to be viewed as, technically, a paedophile.

In this instance, various legal arrangements in Florida became illegal once 17-20 year-olds were flown elsewhere.

The idea that there is something inherently wrong with trading trips to Buck House in return for cash or favours is faintly amusing. It's why we have a Royal Family. Why else do you think that Intellectual pygmy Andrew was a Trade Envoy for years? Why else is Trump (or various mass murderers) invited to Buck House?

Epstein's specialties were 2 fold.

1. Giving specialised financial and tax advice to the mega-rich; and
2. Being a supremely gifted networker. Long before Andrew. And to people infinitely wealthier. Which is, of course why the American Left just shout about Trump and Musk, while the American Right shout about Clinton and Gates.

Whereas, of course, the 1 thing both sides can agree on is finger-pointing at foreigners. And our Press love selling papers with lurid details dressed up as outrage. Always have. Always will.

Having said all that, the Maitliss interview was funny. I suspected Andrew was the man who put "genital" in "congenital idiot". What I didn't know is that there was no-one capable of stopping him making such a public fool out of himself.

[Pokerpops]

That's the good bit about debate. Because different people see things different ways. In my career, I had the dubious pleasure of advising both for and against many paedophiles. They are not just 1 group of people to be lumped into the same box. Life is more complicated than that.

Was Epstein a paedophile? We will never know. Not least because, while he was charged with various offences involving 14-yr-olds (in 2008), those cases were dropped.

The next point to make is that what constitutes either a "paedo" or a "sex trafficker" varies. Not only from Country to Country, but also from State to State.

The US (unlike the UK) has different rules relating to the legal age of consent, both for the act itself, and again for the age someone can charge for it. And, in some States, what me might term "pimping" has a lot wider definition.

To put that in a context that might resonate with Poker Players, what might meet the legal definitions in, say, Nevada, is 21. So any porn involving people who have not been proved to be over 21 is illegal. And anybody viewing UK porn in, say, Las Vegas is likely to be viewed as, technically, a paedophile.

In this instance, various legal arrangements in Florida became illegal once 17-20 year-olds were flown elsewhere.

The idea that there is something inherently wrong with trading trips to Buck House in return for cash or favours is faintly amusing. It's why we have a Royal Family. Why else do you think that Intellectual pygmy Andrew was a Trade Envoy for years? Why else is Trump (or various mass murderers) invited to Buck House?

Epstein's specialties were 2 fold.

1. Giving specialised financial and tax advice to the mega-rich; and
2. Being a supremely gifted networker. Long before Andrew. And to people infinitely wealthier. Which is, of course why the American Left just shout about Trump and Musk, while the American Right shout about Clinton and Gates.

Whereas, of course, the 1 thing both sides can agree on is finger-pointing at foreigners. And our Press love selling papers with lurid details dressed up as outrage. Always have. Always will.

Having said all that, the Maitliss interview was funny. I suspected Andrew was the man who put "genital" in "congenital idiot". What I didn't know is that there was no-one capable of stopping him making such a public fool out of himself.

I take your points - they are well made and provoked some thinking.
It doesn’t make me change my view of the piss-artist formerly known as…

Inviting The Donald to a State Visit in hopes of a favourable trade deal is a very different thing to arranging for Epstein and Maxwell to enjoy hospitality in hopes of a shag. Apart from anything else the hope seems more likely to be realised in the latter case.

Should we not add a third category to Epstein’s specials board? Or was that just part of his networking prowess?

Glad we agree on the comedy side.

I guess none of us were surprised that Mandelson had his snout in the trough.

[EssexPhil]

The Royal Family has had a huge problem for Decades in relation to the whole "heir and a spare" thing.

Ever since George VI was promoted (unready) to the top job at the last minute the 2nd in lines have been car crashes. Andrew doesn't look that out of place with Margaret and Harry. Spend years training for a job, then heir has kids, and there is nothing to fall back on.

My wife met Mandelson recently. She has no interest at all in Politics-and didn't have a clue who he was
The Mandelson thing is rather more important than Andrew in various respects. I'll forgive a sad man looking for a shag quicker than selling info on the sly.

For all the fuss about Epstein's Parties-and he did seem to have most of the World's elite at them-fact remains the only people getting heat are Bungalow Andrew, a Gay Man and 2 Women (Fergie and G. Maxwell).

The Billionaires seem strangely missing...

[RED-DOG]

Fabulous debate and debating gentlemen.

My take, sans the eloquence.

Andrew is an idiot.

The women knew what was what and didn't seem coerced or forced to me.

The media are undeniably necessary but often despicable.

[RED-DOG]

Fabulous debate and debating gentlemen.

My take, sans the eloquence.

Andrew is an idiot.

The women knew what was what and didn't seem coerced or forced to me.

The media are undeniably necessary but often despicable.

The women that I've seen that is.

[RED-DOG]

"Scuse me love, do you want to go to a millionaire's island and get shagged by a Prince?"

I've heard worse chat up lines.

[Pokerpops]

Fabulous debate and debating gentlemen.

My take, sans the eloquence.

Andrew is an idiot.

The women knew what was what and didn't seem coerced or forced to me.

The media are undeniably necessary but often despicable.

Force and coercion aren’t always physical.
I mean, we don’t have a lot of information but we do know that Ghislane Maxwell was convicted of procuring girls as young as 14 for Epstein.
I don’t think they knew what they were getting into.

[Pokerpops]

The Royal Family has had a huge problem for Decades in relation to the whole "heir and a spare" thing.

Ever since George VI was promoted (unready) to the top job at the last minute the 2nd in lines have been car crashes. Andrew doesn't look that out of place with Margaret and Harry. Spend years training for a job, then heir has kids, and there is nothing to fall back on.

My wife met Mandelson recently. She has no interest at all in Politics-and didn't have a clue who he was
The Mandelson thing is rather more important than Andrew in various respects. I'll forgive a sad man looking for a shag quicker than selling info on the sly.

For all the fuss about Epstein's Parties-and he did seem to have most of the World's elite at them-fact remains the only people getting heat are Bungalow Andrew, a Gay Man and 2 Women (Fergie and G. Maxwell).

The Billionaires seem strangely missing...

Bill Gates and Mad Musk are starting to get some heat…